+1richard_leeds wrote:errr... this is a man who is going to record the most dominant season in F1.
He can't be blamed for not demonstrating any "race craft" because he's always been out in front on his own - he's rarely had anyone to race against!
17th to 5th is an impressive feat in a crap car especially when you have no "race craft"....and don`t forget Monaco where he qualified 17th and finished in teh points in 5th place...bizadfar wrote:+1richard_leeds wrote:errr... this is a man who is going to record the most dominant season in F1.
He can't be blamed for not demonstrating any "race craft" because he's always been out in front on his own - he's rarely had anyone to race against!
Plus are all you forgetting 2007-08?
Watch the Chinese GP of 2007 and specifically how Vettel achieved that position.
and in Brazil he qualified 7th and finished 5th when he overtook Hamilton Not really no... that would be one continuous spell... Otherwise Hamilton's spell would be two, Alonso's would be 4-5, etc.Traction wrote:well Vettel did come second in 2009 when the RB was not of par and won in 2010 and is about to win his second title. Wouldn`t that make this his third spell?
fair enough....beelsebob wrote:Not really no... that would be one continuous spell... Otherwise Hamilton's spell would be two, Alonso's would be 4-5, etc.Traction wrote:well Vettel did come second in 2009 when the RB was not of par and won in 2010 and is about to win his second title. Wouldn`t that make this his third spell?
Look who is talking... Scot speed, Bourdais, Luizzi, Webber? lol.Traction wrote:He teamed up with Alonso for one season and they won teh same amount of races and ended up on the same points.JohnsonsEvilTwin wrote:Traction,
Thats true, but Hamilton has displayed this prior to this year. He also matched Alonso(some say beat, in my book the pair matched each other) in 2007 in a year both offered some very impressive drives.
One thing is for sure with Hamilton, he impresses more than he disappoints. And he has done so with Alonso, Button and Kovalainen as team mates.
Bourdais, Webber and Speed with all due respect do not compare to the above three.
For me at least, the Jury is still out on Vettel as he hasnt been tested due to the various factors surrounding his career thus far.
Thats not a criticism of him, just that we have yet to see it. But there are signs that he struggles when faced with chasing down opponents in front of him. Thats not a judgement, but an observation. In time he may become a demonic overtaker and bang wheels with the best. But right now, its not what his reputation is built on.
I would hardly call Heikki Kovalainen a worthy team mate....
Its only Button that I would rate as anything of value and well the points at the moment speak volumes.
Hamilton hasn't been shown up by any teammate.richard_leeds wrote:To be really honest about it all, you can only confer greatest if it is repeatable.
- Vettel is in his first spell of glory
- Hamilton got the glory in 2007 (in the context of a rookie) and 2008, has not been able to repeat it, and has been shown up by his teammate.
- Alonso got the glory in 2005 & 06, was shown up by his teammate in 07, and was within a gnat's crotchet of repeating the glory last year.
Consider they have raced for 1, 3, & 5 post-WDC seasons respectively, then you can start to see a trend. Alonso is the only one who has come close to repeating his WDC in a second era.
ps - Button could leapfrog the lot of them is he gets a second WDC with McLaren.
Never said they were fearsome...n smikle wrote:Look who is talking... Scot speed, Bourdais, Luizzi, Webber? lol.Traction wrote:He teamed up with Alonso for one season and they won teh same amount of races and ended up on the same points.JohnsonsEvilTwin wrote:Traction,
Thats true, but Hamilton has displayed this prior to this year. He also matched Alonso(some say beat, in my book the pair matched each other) in 2007 in a year both offered some very impressive drives.
One thing is for sure with Hamilton, he impresses more than he disappoints. And he has done so with Alonso, Button and Kovalainen as team mates.
Bourdais, Webber and Speed with all due respect do not compare to the above three.
For me at least, the Jury is still out on Vettel as he hasnt been tested due to the various factors surrounding his career thus far.
Thats not a criticism of him, just that we have yet to see it. But there are signs that he struggles when faced with chasing down opponents in front of him. Thats not a judgement, but an observation. In time he may become a demonic overtaker and bang wheels with the best. But right now, its not what his reputation is built on.
I would hardly call Heikki Kovalainen a worthy team mate....
Its only Button that I would rate as anything of value and well the points at the moment speak volumes.
What a fearsome line up.
Well how come he cant repeat any of that when he is now in the best car ?Traction wrote:17th to 5th is an impressive feat in a crap car especially when you have no "race craft"....and don`t forget Monaco where he qualified 17th and finished in teh points in 5th place...bizadfar wrote:+1richard_leeds wrote:errr... this is a man who is going to record the most dominant season in F1.
He can't be blamed for not demonstrating any "race craft" because he's always been out in front on his own - he's rarely had anyone to race against!
Plus are all you forgetting 2007-08?
Watch the Chinese GP of 2007 and specifically how Vettel achieved that position.
...in fairness though his early races showed he can when he has to...raymondu999 wrote:Izy- he hasn't shown he can or he can't. He hasn't been, other than Silverstone and maybe Spa 2010, in such situations.
About the silverstone safety car, I think that's slightly unfair. He could have been doing what Button did in Singapore 2011 and saving his tyres for a late surge in case a safety car comes about
I hear you and I agree. He doesn`t get into the same situations as he did when he was in the TR however I am just saying that when he did need to do it he pulled out the goodsraymondu999 wrote:Traction - you should re-read izy's post. He's asking why Vettel can't repeat that now. I'm saying he hasn't been able to show it because he hasn't had the opportunity to.
