2012 Testing - Barcelona 2: 21-24 Feb

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Post Sun Feb 26, 2012 3:27 am

siskue2005 wrote:havent you considered that this could be due to F-duct front wing?

noone even knows if it is a F-duct front wing its just guessing
snoop1050
 
Joined: 20 Feb 2012

Post Sun Feb 26, 2012 7:41 am

Hail22 wrote:But let us be real in the last decade both teams that were tipped to win a third championship failed to do so due to the amount of pressure placed upon them to win thus leading to failures (Ferrari 2003, 2004 lost in 05), (Renault 2005, Renault 2006)

Some of your post I agree with but your using the results of one decade to try to define a trend is most misleading. To follow recent trends you need to at least asterisk that when Ferrari lost both championships it was after a 6 year run of Constructors Championships, and ended five consecutive years of WDC's by Mike.
You're coming up with ideas and then trying to fit them somewhere. Come on man! 2001 Ferrari won the WCC for the third time consecutively with ease. 2002 Mike won The WDC for the third consecutive time with 11 victories 5 2nds and 1 third. He almost tripled the highest score of anyone from another team. That's pressure baby :-"
Last edited by Mr Alcatraz on Sun Feb 26, 2012 9:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
Those who believe in telekinetics raise my hand
Mr Alcatraz
 
Joined: 18 May 2008
Location: San Diego Ca. USA

Post Sun Feb 26, 2012 7:50 am

The speeds could be due to gearing also. So many factors are involved it is hard to say. We'll see the real picture in a few weeks.
Honda!
dren
 
Joined: 3 Mar 2010

Post Sun Feb 26, 2012 9:26 am

I'd think top speeds at such a level would be more down to drag rather than gearing (except if they chose to go for better 7th gear for quali vs race) but that again can be a function of setup
失败者找理由,成功者找方法
raymondu999
 
Joined: 4 Feb 2010

Post Sun Feb 26, 2012 9:45 am

The RB7 has never been really fast with top speed. But they are always quickest around the track. perhaps thats the reason why they couldnt nail it at Shanghai GP.
CHT
 
Joined: 14 Apr 2008

Post Sun Feb 26, 2012 9:56 am

Well, Vettel was one of the slowest (if not the slowest ?) at the end of the main straight of Monza, ans still walk away in the race...
I don't think top speed means something, it's only one instantaneous speed, it don't reflect the shape of a car on straights.
Mercedes was widely consider as the fastest car on straights last year and they had barely the best top speed.
SchumiSutil
 
Joined: 24 Feb 2012

Post Sun Feb 26, 2012 10:11 am

It doesn't mean much on its own, but it gives a tactical edge in terms of defense and slipstreaming others to make a pass on the straight
失败者找理由,成功者找方法
raymondu999
 
Joined: 4 Feb 2010

Post Sun Feb 26, 2012 10:40 am

Mr Alcatraz wrote:
Hail22 wrote:But let us be real in the last decade both teams that were tipped to win a third championship failed to do so due to the amount of pressure placed upon them to win thus leading to failures (Ferrari 2003, 2004 lost in 05), (Renault 2005, Renault 2006)

Some of your post I agree with but your using the results of one decade to try to define a trend is most misleading. To follow recent trends you need to at least asterisk that when Ferrari lost both championships it was after a 6 year run of Constructors Championships, and ended five consecutive years of WDC's by Mike.
You're coming up with ideas and then trying to fit them somewhere. Come on man! 2001 Ferrari won the WCC for the third time consecutively with ease. 2002 Mike won The WDC for the third consecutive time with 11 victories 5 2nds and 1 third. He almost tripled the highest score of anyone from another team. That's pressure baby :-"


Agreed I forgot the begon era of 2001, 2000 and 1999...

Will be a bit more objective and clear in future posts :)
If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari.

Gilles Villeneuve
Hail22
 
Joined: 8 Feb 2012

Post Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:34 pm

found on autosport.forums:

Image

I love how they all include Lotus and put them mainly better or = fifth while Lotus didn't really attend the first real test in Montmelo. lol.

Ferrari might be not as good as McLaren but no way they are that behind.


My pecking order a few days ago:

McLaren
RedBull
Mercedes
Ferrari
ForceIndia
Williams
Sauber
Toro Rosso
Caterham

My New one:

McLaren
RedBull
ForceIndia
Ferrari, Sauber
Mercedes
Williams
Toro Rosso
Caterham
"Double points is Tyranny!"
FrukostScones
 
Joined: 25 May 2010
Location: Bonnie's Ranch

Post Sun Feb 26, 2012 5:45 pm

If you keep in mind that some of the teams which are slower on the straights than mercedes had even better laptimes....the Merc is REALLY fast. Force India and Williams were two seconds faster, at least one second faster if you compare fastest laptimes. So, lets see what the speed trap shows if Mercedes runs this times.
ForMuLaOne
 
Joined: 19 Feb 2011

Post Sun Feb 26, 2012 6:00 pm

Has someone the speedtraps of the race in 2011 in Barcelona?
Would be interesting to compare...
Ganxxta
 
Joined: 6 Feb 2010
Location: Germany, NRW

Post Sun Feb 26, 2012 6:03 pm

Ganxxta wrote:Has someone the speedtraps of the race in 2011 in Barcelona?
Would be interesting to compare...


:arrow: :arrow: viewtopic.php?p=286619#p286619
Richard
 
Joined: 15 Apr 2009
Location: UK

Post Sun Feb 26, 2012 7:03 pm

richard_leeds wrote: :arrow: :arrow: viewtopic.php?p=286619#p286619

Thanks.

Qualifying:
POS DRIVER KPH
1 A. SUTIL 325.2
2 P. DI RESTA 323.2
3 M. SCHUMACHER 321.9
4 R. BARRICHELLO 321.9
5 N. ROSBERG 321.8
6 V. PETROV 321.5
7 F. MASSA 321.3
8 F. ALONSO 320.9
9 J. BUTTON 319.2
10 L. HAMILTON 318.7
11 P. MALDONADO 318.4
12 S. BUEMI 314.6
13 J. ALGUERSUARI 314.5
14 M. WEBBER 313.6
15 K. KOBAYASHI 313.5
16 T. GLOCK 312.7
17 S. VETTEL 312.3
18 S. PEREZ 310.9
19 J. D'AMBROSIO 310.8
20 V. LIUZZI 310.6
21 N. KARTHIKEYAN 309.5
22 J. TRULLI 306.9
23 H. KOVALAINEN 306.8

2012 Testing:
Mercedes 320.5
Toro Rosso 319.5
Caterham 318.5
Force India 317.5
Sauber 315.8
McLaren 314.9
Ferrari 311.2
Williams 311.2
Red Bull 310.3

Well compared to the qualy speeds where everyone was pushing with kers+drs, the speeds are more or less the same or a little bit slower, so in my opinion there is nothing to worry about if Mercedes are the fastest or redbull is the slowest, thats just the philosophy of the designs + motor power+effectiveness of drs...
Ganxxta
 
Joined: 6 Feb 2010
Location: Germany, NRW

Post Mon Feb 27, 2012 12:22 am

FrukostScones wrote:found on autosport.forums:

Image

:|


This one image says enough about the expertise of the so called experts

These numbers would have some value if it was the winterchampionship where you knew they tried to lap as fast as possible. Half of the teams haven't even tried doing quick laptimes on fresh soft tyres and low on fuel around the same time of the day.

Ferrari for instance has just about finished analysing their front suspension and which exhaust solution they will use. They are at a different stage of development since it's a brand new car and haven't even focussed on tyres and setup where a lot of time is to be found. They also planned long ago to put some significant updates on the car in the last week of testing. So how can you judge a team that haven't even tried to go fast with a car thats half finished?

Maybe they won't have their car fully dialed in before Melbourne but i'm quite optimistic they will be competitive and one to look out for.
“As we know, there are known knowns. There are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns. That is to say, we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, the ones we don’t know we don’t know.” Donald Rumsfield
Moanlower
 
Joined: 17 Apr 2008

Post Mon Feb 27, 2012 8:10 am

Moanlower wrote:This one image says enough about the expertise of the so called experts

These numbers would have some value if it was the winterchampionship where you knew they tried to lap as fast as possible. Half of the teams haven't even tried doing quick laptimes on fresh soft tyres and low on fuel around the same time of the day.

I think you're underestimating them here – you're right that the experts know only what we know – very little, but you seem to be asserting that they're basing their analysis of where they think teams are on how fast they've done a lap. Note that most of them put McLaren second; note also that McLaren have never done a single lap under 1:23 during testing, and that many of the midfield teams have. The analysis is based on more than just lap times, most likely looking at how the cars are handling at different places.
beelsebob
 
Joined: 23 Mar 2011
Location: Cupertino, California

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