Button holding up Hamilton

[astracrazy]

I've just quickly scanned this thread and i haven't seen it posted but they did tell Button to let Hamilton through (might of been played on tv but i was there so wouldn't know). I always follow the race with twitter as well on @f1pitradio
Its decent and you find out a lot more then you get told, for example at the time Lewis was behind Jenson

‏@F1PitRadio
JB told not to worry about Lewis

@F1PitRadio
To Lewis "Yeah, Lewis, Jenson has been given the message"

So i guess he was told to move.

edit: sorry, just seen the 2nd post says this! Oh well, at least those who haven't heard about @f1pitradio have now lol

[jdlive]

Of course they told him to let Lewis through, let's not be too naive guys

[mzivtins]

Oh dear...

what is important to McLaren, and Martin Whitmarsh to a bigger extent is making F1 sepctacular to watch, team orders remove that completely for the spectator.

And yeah, McLaren need to be told they are in a multimillion pound sport... really? when Whitmarsh leads inter-team discussion, McLaren supply and build all the ECU's and standard telemetry systems to the entire grid?

Us (the fans) are the biggest most important thing to this sport, and sadly Macca are the only team who live and breathe that (although i did like red-bulls idea with their paint job for the british GP)

Macca need to be more selfish and sod everything esle for a bit and just get the damned car better.

[jdlive]

There seem to be a lot of these anti-Hamilton-conspiracies going on, if I were Mclaren teamleader they would be justifiable, but come on

[RB7ate9]

Oh dear...

what is important to McLaren, and Martin Whitmarsh to a bigger extent is making F1 sepctacular to watch, team orders remove that completely for the spectator.

Quick question for clarification: when you talk team orders, do you mean having Driver A cede position for Driver B who is higher in the WDC (a la Germany 2010)? Ask Driver A to "Maintain the Gap" (a la Silverstone 2011)? Or ask Driver A to specifically hold up rival Driver C from threatening Driver B in P1?

In regards to preventing teammates from racing, that's silly. In regards to specifically asking teammate to move aside, I can agree if it is obvious that one has the pace the other does not (it's a team effort for the WCC). In regards to tactically using the teammates to get the victory or defend points, I wouldn't mind a little more of that. Of course, that precludes the teammates being in positions where they can assist each other (i.e. getting them on the grid together, or having one driver defend from an opposing driver in the lead so that the teammate can jump via pits). Though I think there is a rule against deliberately holding up drivers.

In the end, Button held up Hamilton for a spell, but in the end, it didn't have as much influence as some might suggest. Also, while the call may be sent out via radio, it's always the drivers that have to make the final twitches to let anyone by (again, "Maintain the gap" went unheeded, supposedly). Button's not the happiest camper. It's a little understandable to, well...race...even though he realistically and strategically should let Hamilton by.

[RB7ate9]

Look at 2008 where Hamilton was by default the #1 driver. He brought home the WDC even when everything seemed to be going against him.

Now we have McLaren --- up Hamilton's race at every opportunity. That's not how you run a racing team unfortunately. Look at Ferrari. Now that's how you run a raceing team.

Ferrari is a good example of how to claw yourself back into contention: throwing effort behind a beast of a driver until updates can be brought in. Red Bull have a similar tack, but they have two really good drivers that are consistent and can pick up the slack for the other (hence their lead in the WCC at least).

The Mcl situation is peculiar and I agree that all efforts should be put into getting Ham on the podium as much as possible. They may not get that WCC (again) but with the concentrated effort, come back into swinging form.

Telling Jen to let Ham through could be the beginnings of it. Here's to seeing what Mcl/Ham/Jen do in Germany.

[PlatinumZealot]

Oh dear...

what is important to McLaren, and Martin Whitmarsh to a bigger extent is making F1 sepctacular to watch, team orders remove that completely for the spectator.

And yeah, McLaren need to be told they are in a multimillion pound sport... really? when Whitmarsh leads inter-team discussion, McLaren supply and build all the ECU's and standard telemetry systems to the entire grid?

Us (the fans) are the biggest most important thing to this sport, and sadly Macca are the only team who live and breathe that (although i did like red-bulls idea with their paint job for the british GP)

Macca need to be more selfish and sod everything esle for a bit and just get the damned car better.

disagree.. That was not racing back there; Jenson holding Lewis up. That was a defeated man holding on to the legs of the champion Gladiator. Just Holding up the process for stupid reasons of pride in front of the home crowd.

[RB7ate9]

disagree.. That was not racing back there; Jenson holding Lewis up. That was a defeated man holding on to the legs of the champion Gladiator. Just Holding up the process for stupid reasons of pride in front of the home crowd.

Agreed. Despite what the SpeedTV pre-race promos show, Button is not a robot. He's a human being with a sense of pride, and frustration. The reasons for not letting Ham through quickly will be a mystery, but the fact that he did shows that, in the end, he knows he is a team player.

[ds.raikkonen]

In 'The F1 Show' on Sky Sports, MW told Ted Kravitz that they were facing similar troubles with JB's car as Lotus F1 were facing with Kimi's car in terms of putting heat in the tyres in the low energy corner tracks due to their 'smooth' driving styles. Hamilton and Grosjean seem to be dealing with this issue well. Regarding Grosjean, well, even though James Allison said he is the man in form and probably the candidate for Lotus F1's first win this season, still has to finish the races to gather some points for the team. It has been Kimi who has racked up more points for the team till now.

[internetf1fan]

And yet again McLaren pits Button to give him a new set of tyres while leaving Hamilton out. Their focus on Button is completely destroying any chances of McLaren winning a WDC or the WCC. Like I said, let's look what happened when McLaren was 100% behind Hamilton in 2008. He gave them their first WDC in a decade. If McLaren continues like this, then they will not win another championship while watching Alonso getting another championship.

[PlatinumZealot]

Hamilton could have beat thim though if he didn't aquaplane. But yeah, what the hell was that about? No information at all from Hamilton's side of the garage. Look what a fresh set did for Alonso!

[JimClarkFan]

And yet again McLaren pits Button to give him a new set of tyres while leaving Hamilton out. Their focus on Button is completely destroying any chances of McLaren winning a WDC or the WCC. Like I said, let's look what happened when McLaren was 100% behind Hamilton in 2008. He gave them their first WDC in a decade. If McLaren continues like this, then they will not win another championship while watching Alonso getting another championship.

This is complete rubbish.
Where are you sources on information being passed exclusively to one side of the garage or one side of the garage willfully not acting because of favoritism - are you just saying this to be controversial?
Where is this supposed favoritism that you are talking about, because I fail to see it yet some of you make out that it is glaringly obvious?

The real problem is that the Mclaren team have for the past few years been making more and more bad decisions. Lewis isn't a racer which seems capable of thinking a race through like a Vettel or an Alonso, whereas Button can. Hamilton has the raw speed but not the brain, and Button has the brain but not the raw speed. The result is that Hamilton is relying on his team to do most of the thinking for him, a team which at times seems incapable of making even simple decisions, whereas Button can make those decisions by himself.

It is not a team deliberately favoring one driving over another, it is a mixture of both a team, and a driver (Lewis) both unable to make split second decisions that other teams like Red Bull and Ferrari can make and the only reason why Button is not suffering the same fate as Lewis is because he can make those decisions for himself.

Get it?

Mclaren need to have a serious look at themselves because they have two world class drivers with very different attributes that should be delivering a world championship in one or both of the titles. Lewis who can drive a dog of a car in all conditions very fast and who is also a great wheel to wheel racer; and Jenson whose need for a finely balanced car should be a massive advantage when developing a car that is fast on all tracks. Lewis' and Jensen's individual attributes should be coming together to produce a great car, backed up by equally strong qualifying and race performances.... but they aren't, and I have a feeling that it isn't the fault of either driver but the fault of the team and a failure of leadership from Mr. Whitmarsh and company.

[internetf1fan]

So if the decision to get Button on to new tyres was the correct one, why was this information not passed on to Hamilton's side of the garage? You say Button has a brians so why is McLaren not sharing that information with Hamilton's side? On the other hand, they seem to be perfectly happy recently giving away Hamilton's car set-up to help Button.

And at the end of you post, you conclude by blaming the team, which confuses me because that is exactly my point as well so I don't understand where we're disagreeing. Like I said again, back in 2008 where McLaren were 100% behind HAmilton he gave them their first WDC in a decade even when everything seemed to be going against him. McLaren's focus on Jenson is hurting McLaren's chances badly.

[matt_b]

And yet again McLaren pits Button to give him a new set of tyres while leaving Hamilton out. Their focus on Button is completely destroying any chances of McLaren winning a WDC or the WCC

McLaren didnt pit Lewis for new tyres because he was lighting the timesheets purple at the time, it wouldve been a huge gamble to ask Lewis to abort the lap and come in, especially if it rained harder. Jenson however wasnt going faster so it made sense for the team to bring him in for a new set. They couldnt bring Lewis in after his fastest lap because they didnt have enough time. Its just the way it goes sometimes. They line up 6th and 7th with dry weather expected and great overtaking opportunities, so still all to play for.

[Pup]

And yet again...

And yet again.