Driver performance science

Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.
Nando
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Re: Driver performance science

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beelsebob wrote:We produce adrenaline for a reason – it's evolutionary advantageous. We survive more often when operating on adrenaline, than when operating not on it, thus the fitness function plus evolution says we make it.

While it's easy to produce anecdotes where it causes us to act in the wrong way, overall, adrenaline has a positive effect on our snap decision making.
There´s a reason why your body doesn´t pump adrenaline through you all day everyday.
It´s because as i said, a flight or fight system that dates back to when we ran from Lions and Tigers and what have you.

Calm and collected is always the best state of mind. High on adrenaline only dilutes everything, because it´s essentially a drug.
Not to mention the risk of getting a adrenaline dump and if you get that you are completely finished.

Concentration = laptime/consistency
Not adrenaline.
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Websta
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Re: Driver performance science

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If a driver gets very nervous prior to or at the start of a race, they could take beta blockers to reduce their nerves. These act by inhibiting the influence of adrenaline and noradrenaline - reducing heart and respiratory rates, and muscle tremors, etc. The use of beta blockers to control nerves and improve dexterity and fine motor control in stressful situations is well established - musicians will commonly use these drugs and I know that surgical interns will also sometimes use them. However; the reduction in heart activity reduces blood pressure - in fact, beta blockers are commonly used to manage hypertension. Their use during an activity involving significant physical exertion would not be a good idea and would cause fatigue, or even lead to a more serious condition depending on the dosage. A low dosage could be beneficial for inexperienced drivers in the development series, perhaps to control pre-race nerves.

The use of psychostimulants such as dextroamphetamine (the active drug in Adderal and the so called "go pills" used by the USAF to combat fatigue over extended combat missions) could be beneficial. Such drugs improve concentration, reaction times, endurance and even strength. For those that are interested, stimulants enhance neurotransmitter activity in neural synapses.

One of the most common stimulants, caffeine, would of course be very dangerous to give any racing driver before a race, or any athlete in general before a workout. Caffeine is a strong diuretic (increases water excretion -> urination) and causes dehydration under such conditions. Unfortunately, many kids will down a whole can of an "energy" drink before a sports game - a very dangerous, even potentially fatal practise if they do not continually hydrate.

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turbof1
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Re: Driver performance science

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Nando wrote:
beelsebob wrote:We produce adrenaline for a reason – it's evolutionary advantageous. We survive more often when operating on adrenaline, than when operating not on it, thus the fitness function plus evolution says we make it.

While it's easy to produce anecdotes where it causes us to act in the wrong way, overall, adrenaline has a positive effect on our snap decision making.
There´s a reason why your body doesn´t pump adrenaline through you all day everyday.
It´s because as i said, a flight or fight system that dates back to when we ran from Lions and Tigers and what have you.

Calm and collected is always the best state of mind. High on adrenaline only dilutes everything, because it´s essentially a drug.
Not to mention the risk of getting a adrenaline dump and if you get that you are completely finished.

Concentration = laptime/consistency
Not adrenaline.
Adrenaline, produced in the central nervous system, itself does not hamper concentration. The fight or flight system, which is located in the sympathetic nervous system, does. Decoupling the adrenaline surge from that system, and of coursing not loosing yourself in the huge amount of extra energy, is the key to make it work. Of course you cannot do that for a full race; that'll require too much concentration and will burn through your energy reserves. But it is ideal for qualifying.
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raymondu999
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Re: Driver performance science

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Found an old interview related to the topic
While he may not be the most recognisable person in the garage, Toyota’s team doctor Ricardo Ceccarelli is one of the most important. Aside from keeping the entire racing outfit fit and well whilst at Grands Prix, Ceccarelli is also responsible for the health of drivers Timo Glock and Jarno Trulli.

And with Glock and Trulli’s heart rates averaging more than 180bpm over a race distance, their neck muscles undergoing extreme G-forces, and their bodyweights losing almost two per cent through perspiration, it’s no mean feat…

What work do you do with the team?
Ricardo Ceccarelli: I am like a family doctor travelling with the team so I deal with every problem that comes up. I have a small pharmacy with me and I treat team members so they can recover as soon as possible and work at their best. If the condition is more serious I decide whether it is necessary to visit the medical centre or even a hospital, where I stay with them to make sure they receive the proper care. I also work with team members to make sure they are generally looking after themselves as well as possible; for example I prepare a special mineral drink and distribute this in the garage during the race to make sure they are hydrated properly. The aim is to make sure every team member is as fit as possible to do their job - a driver can't stay in the hotel on a Sunday afternoon to recover and neither can anyone else in the team.

You work closely with the drivers, so how fit does a Formula One driver need to be?
RC: There is no other sport in the world which compares to the demands Formula One puts on the heart. The heat rate of a top driver can average over 180bpm for a race distance of 90 minutes or more. This is huge and no other sport keeps a heart rate so high for such a long time. On top of that there is a lot of muscle work for the whole body - heavy work for neck muscles to cope with the g-forces, high loads on legs and arms and good lumbar strength to stabilise the body. A normal person could do two or three laps in a Formula One car under those stresses before physically they couldn't continue.

What about the mental aspect of driving?
RC: The demand on the muscles is important but the load on the brain is amazing. Formula One is a sport where the brain has to be working hard for the whole race. In tennis you have a break every few seconds, in boxing you break every three minutes, in shooting you break all the time. This means a Formula One driver's brain is working in a different way. When you compare a Formula One driver's brain to an average person, the way it works is completely different.

Does a driver react differently in qualifying compared to the race?
RC: Yes. When a driver is racing he is driving differently to a qualifying lap, which puts more intense physical strain on him. In qualifying a driver is right on the limit, always very close to a mistake and his heart can be beating 50bpm faster than a normal racing lap. This shows the body is doing a massive amount of work, which is possible to sustain for a few minutes but not a whole race.

How does excessive heat affect team members and drivers?
RC: It is a simple fact that when you have a fever you feel weak because your body is not working properly; like a car when the engine is overheating, the performance goes down. When you are working or driving in hot conditions, like in Bahrain, and you can't cool down, the temperature in your body goes up like you have a fever, so you have the same reaction. As soon as the body temperature goes up, you brain, muscle and reactions suffer. Sweating is the body's cooling system so you also lose fluids through sweat. So in extreme heat you feel weaker due to the temperature and also the loss of fluids.

What effect does the loss of fluids have?
RC: When you lose two per cent of your body weight as fluid you start to lose an important part of your capacity for psychological and physical performance - if you are 60kgs that is just over 1kg of sweat. Sometimes the drivers can lose up to 3kg in a race and if you lose four per cent of your bodyweight you lose around 40 per cent of your psycho-physical capacity. So it is normal in hot conditions that a driver would lose a bit of performance if nothing is done to combat the effect of heat.

So what can be done to reduce this?
RC: The small things, if you put them all together, can be quite effective. First of all drink a lot and always have a bottle of fluid available; mainly this is water but also you can add some minerals. The second thing is to be very careful with nutrition. It is best to eat simple food which is easy to digest; fruit and vegetables are the best things to eat. Finally, for a driver, you try to get him as cool as possible before the race, which means putting ice in his helmet, his shoes in the fridge, that kind of thing, so when he first steps into the car he is not already overheating.

If a driver is not completely fit, how would that affect his performance?
RC: The affect on the driver is really subtle and difficult to see. Before I worked with Toyota, I saw a driver who was starting the race after having a very bad infection for four days. He lost a lot of fluids and he arrived on Sunday feeling really bad, but he had to start. He told me after the race that he felt he could collapse at any point but he finished in the top six because he had a good car. When a driver who is normally super fit is sick, he is likely to be four tenths - maximum half a second - slower than usual in the race.
Source: http://www.formula1.com/news/interviews ... /9277.html

Another feature:
Just because Formula One drivers do their work sitting down doesn't mean they are not among the fittest athletes on the planet - far from it. While he may not be running, jumping or swimming, an F1 driver nevertheless needs immense physical strength and stamina to survive the rigours of a 350 km/h racing car.

To drive a modern Formula One car is not only down to a driver's reflexes and natural talent; without supreme fitness it would be virtually impossible to race flat-out for a Grand Prix distance due to the immense forces faced on every lap.

The highly-efficient carbon brakes slow a car down so rapidly and the downforce generated by current aerodynamics is such that a driver experiences a peak of around 5Gs under braking and in high-speed corners. This affects the whole body but has its most dramatic consequence on the neck and chest.

For a typical person, these forces are almost unimaginable and the nearest most will come is on the most extreme, white-knuckle rollercoaster. But on a rollercoaster you are a passenger for a minute or so; in a Formula One car a driver must be focused and push to the very limit for up to two hours at a time.

The result is a heart rate higher than almost any other kind of athlete, with an average rate of around 170 beats per minute (bpm) during a race and peaks as high as 190. Contrast that to a typical healthy man of similar age, whose heart rate is closer to 60bpm.

Naturally, like all their rivals, Toyota drivers Jarno Trulli and Timo Glock take fitness very seriously and rigorous daily workouts mean they are always in peak condition whenever they get behind the wheel.

"I would say it's completely different to any other sport because you have a heartbeat average of 170 over an hour and a half and you never see that in another sport," Glock says. "That makes it completely different. That's the reason why you have to be really fit as a Formula One driver."

Demands like that on the body require specially-tailored training plans, as Toyota team doctor Riccardo Ceccarelli explains: "The heart-rate is amazing so they need aerobic fitness to a very high level. They go jogging, cycling, all sports that involve aerobic area. The second part of the training is specific for the neck. They need a very strong neck because every corner puts a load of around 20-25kgs on the neck, and obviously a strong upper body and forearms."

But it is not just physical fitness that is important in Formula One racing. To drive a 350km/h car at the very limit for a race distance requires immense concentration and mental strength.

"The brain is just like a muscle and you can train it," according to Ceccarelli and he offers Toyota drivers the chance to stay sharp by using computer programmes. He has developed simulations which can test - and improve - reaction times, multi tasking and spatial awareness.

Trulli uses these techniques to ensure he is mentally ready for each Grand Prix, as he explains: "We do mental preparation with some of these simulations which have been developed through the years. I can easily do them at home or even during the Grand Prix weekend using my computer. It's all about keeping concentration and trying to be fit and concentrated for a race distance, which is not so easy in a Formula One car because obviously it's very quick."

Studies show a marked difference in how a racing driver responds to these challenges. For example, the reaction time test simulates the start of a Grand Prix and the user is required to press a button as soon as the lights go out. In general a Formula One driver and an ordinary person have similar reaction times, but the driver uses significantly less energy in his brain to achieve this.

"The difference is that the driver is much more economical in managing this performance, so his brain is working in an economical way compared to a normal person," says Dr Ceccarelli. "That means he is able to carry on this performance for a longer time compared to a normal person. That is the important point we have to consider in the training."

More surprisingly, since the elimination of traction control and engine braking, drivers are facing more strain on their bodies as they battle to keep the 700bhp car under complete control.

Dr Ceccarelli reveals: "From the beginning of this season compared to last year, we have seen the heart rate is from five to 10 beats more and the sweating is more, which means the driver is more involved in driving. We consider this is not on the physical side but the mental side, which consumes a lot of energy."

So, there is more reason than ever for Toyota's drivers to stay fighting fit as they search for the vital edge which will help the team move closer to its ambitious targets.
Source: http://www.formula1.com/news/features/2008/7/8158.html
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godlameroso
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Re: 2013 United States Grand Prix

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I don't know, when adrenaline kicks in and you're pushing and using all your focus to drive little issues like heat, fatigue, and aches pretty much get muted.
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SectorOne
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Re: 2013 United States Grand Prix

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You won´t maintain an adrenaline rush for 1,5 hours. Especially when you start lapping by yourself out on track.
That´s when the pain will trickle in.
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raymondu999
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Re: 2013 United States Grand Prix

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SectorOne wrote:You won´t maintain an adrenaline rush for 1,5 hours. Especially when you start lapping by yourself out on track.
That´s when the pain will trickle in.
You can certainly maintain a sustained adrenalin rush over hours. As a public speaker I used to sustain myself on adrenalin on stage (the nature of my speaking is not calm stuff, but more high-energy stuff) I stutter whenever I rehearse, but once I'm in front of a crowd the adrenalin kicks in and stabilises me. I've done up to 3, maybe 3.5 hours on a single stretch (toilet breaks before/after, not during). However it may be different at several G - so I don't know about on track.

The proviso here is that even after taking the stage hundreds of times a year, I don't think my strategy of adrenalin sustenance is healthy. After I go off-stage, I would be shaking as if I had been doing some serious cardio and lifting (albeit without the muscle fatigue) and hyperventilating. My heart rate would be up in my cardio workout zone too.
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SectorOne
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Re: 2013 United States Grand Prix

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raymondu999 wrote:You can certainly maintain a sustained adrenalin rush over hours. As a public speaker I used to sustain myself on adrenalin on stage (the nature of my speaking is not calm stuff, but more high-energy stuff) I stutter whenever I rehearse, but once I'm in front of a crowd the adrenalin kicks in and stabilises me. I've done up to 3, maybe 3.5 hours on a single stretch (toilet breaks before/after, not during). However it may be different at several G - so I don't know about on track.

The proviso here is that even after taking the stage hundreds of times a year, I don't think my strategy of adrenalin sustenance is healthy. After I go off-stage, I would be shaking as if I had been doing some serious cardio and lifting (albeit without the muscle fatigue) and hyperventilating. My heart rate would be up in my cardio workout zone too.
I don´t think that´s Adrenaline you are describing honestly.
It´s a fight or flight system and eventually your body will have assessed the danger.
Just like you would have massive Adrenaline at the start of a race but when you are on lap 50 all by yourself you are not running around on an adrenaline rush because there´s no threat to the body.
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Chuckjr
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Re: 2013 United States Grand Prix

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SectorOne wrote:
raymondu999 wrote:You can certainly maintain a sustained adrenalin rush over hours. As a public speaker I used to sustain myself on adrenalin on stage (the nature of my speaking is not calm stuff, but more high-energy stuff) I stutter whenever I rehearse, but once I'm in front of a crowd the adrenalin kicks in and stabilises me. I've done up to 3, maybe 3.5 hours on a single stretch (toilet breaks before/after, not during). However it may be different at several G - so I don't know about on track.

The proviso here is that even after taking the stage hundreds of times a year, I don't think my strategy of adrenalin sustenance is healthy. After I go off-stage, I would be shaking as if I had been doing some serious cardio and lifting (albeit without the muscle fatigue) and hyperventilating. My heart rate would be up in my cardio workout zone too.
I don´t think that´s Adrenaline you are describing honestly.
It´s a fight or flight system and eventually your body will have assessed the danger.
Just like you would have massive Adrenaline at the start of a race but when you are on lap 50 all by yourself you are not running around on an adrenaline rush because there´s no threat to the body.

Fight or flight is a neurological function driven by the autonomic nervous system (ANS). This system, when in fight or flight mode, is driven by the adrenals. These mechanisms can be triggered by emotional, environmental, or any number of real time experiential triggers which any individual can initiate in daily life.

With all due respect, to commandeer someone else's ANS by stating it is or is not an adrenal function, IMO, is pushing reality.

I'm no doctor but I've much personal experience with the ANS, it's functioning, and MO due to personal family dynamics, and it is of my opinion that a 3 or more hour ANS adrenal suspension is very possible, is not an exceptional event, but rather, quite common. Just watch a child at Disneyland for 8 hours and you'll see dam near constant adrenal release followed by a 12 hour nap as the rest and digest functioning kicks in to rebalance the system. I talk about the ANS in my cancer testimony video here if you want to know more detail: http://youtu.be/SEtdmGyYxN0.
It's a long video, sorry, but the info is in there if your curious.

---

Back on topic, Vettel win for this one and my opinion is that if it's faster in turn 6 by taking a non typical line, Lewis is not alone in this understanding. I don't think another team driver takes a crap without another team knowing it. To think its exclusive or that Lewis has some hidden ability, IMO, is not realistic. If it's faster to take that section another way, the drivers will be informed of such by the team, no question.
Watching F1 since 1986.

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SectorOne
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Re: 2013 United States Grand Prix

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Chuckjr wrote:and it is of my opinion that a 3 or more hour ANS adrenal suspension is very possible, is not an exceptional event, but rather, quite common.
If you have any scientific papers on these sort of sustained lengths of Adrenaline rushes i´d be more then happy to look at them. I´ve yet to find anything that would support the notion of hour-long adrenaline rushes.
I think people confuse adrenaline rushes with a whole load of other things (like what you mentioned with a kid at Disneyland)

PM if you find anything, back on topic.
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SamH123
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Re: 2013 United States Grand Prix

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I've heard lots of references by other drviers to not feeling anything when they are in the zone during a race

I don't think you need a sustained adrenaline rush to not feel an ailment.. just the focus on the track can distract you from discomfort

Richard
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Re: 2013 United States Grand Prix

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Elite athletes often have to push through the pain barrier, their focus on the end goal helps make the pain peripheral. Marathon runners and, cycling time trials are good examples. The cyclists in particular maintain perfect composure on the bike, then collapse as soon as they cross the line. I also remember Senna and Mansell barely able to walk after some races

Hobbs04
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Re: 2013 United States Grand Prix

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As a competitive runner it's easy to block out pain and suffereing. Especially on long runs I'm distracted by other runners, my pace, technique, breathing, etc. I reckon it's like Pirelli tires sometimes. Most people burst out of the gates and fizzle out after the first couple miles. Managing your energy so you have an even burn. Then pick off everyone on the last couple miles. So yeah it's enough to think about for me, I'm sure an f1 cockpit is 1000 x more complex and ever changing.

komninosm
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Re: 2013 United States Grand Prix

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This discussion on adrenaline is fascinating. Keep it up, it's more interesting than F1 ^.^

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SectorOne
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Re: 2013 United States Grand Prix

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SamH123 wrote:I've heard lots of references by other drviers to not feeling anything when they are in the zone during a race

I don't think you need a sustained adrenaline rush to not feel an ailment.. just the focus on the track can distract you from discomfort
the word zone is the key i think.

I got that alot when i played Gran Turismo in my younger days and had to do 70-80 laps around Nordschleife.
After some laps you just get detached and fall into the zone and sort of let the brain handle it for you.
You see what happens on screen but it´s almost like you let the sub-conscious take care of it.
Then after a while you snap out of it thinking you have driven terribly and realize actually you were lapping the fastest during that period.

I believe this is what Senna was talking about especially around Monaco.
Hard to quantify scientifically i think but just massive amounts of concentration blocks out nearly everything around you.
"If the only thing keeping a person decent is the expectation of divine reward, then brother that person is a piece of sh*t"