F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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bcoxa
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Joined: 11 Aug 2009, 09:59

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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The cars aren't slower, the regulations are.
I'm not an engineer, just an experiment.

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rohit1594
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Joined: 27 Sep 2012, 13:45

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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Here's a good read: "Are the 2014 cars powerful enough for Formula One?"

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2014/02/17/f ... 6-present/

Mandrake
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Joined: 31 May 2010, 01:31

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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Facts Only wrote:I remember F1 being insainly boring 8 years ago, I'd take 2014 over 2004-2006 anyday of the week. People specs are getting very rose tinted.
2014 is the first year that I regularly miss races and skip through the replay. Why is that? Domination of 1 team is worse than any season in the last 10 or more years. Even if someone can come up with data to prove me wrong, at least it feels that way. The Mercs are unbeatable and WCC + WDC were sealed since day one, hell even since pre-season testing. So unless you are are LH or NR fan, races are really boring. I do not care for "intense" battles for place 10.

Last years in the RB domination phase it was almost equally boring at the front, however the cars were at least very fast in the corners. This is what is lacking this year. They can compensate for the loss of laptime with higher speed and faster acceleration, but the straightline speed never comes across on TV. The old cars, especially in 2004 were massively quick through the corners and it really looked that way. This year it just looks slow.

xwz
xwz
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Joined: 31 Mar 2014, 12:05

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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Mandrake wrote: 2014 is the first year that I regularly miss races and skip through the replay. Why is that? Domination of 1 team is worse than any season in the last 10 or more years. Even if someone can come up with data to prove me wrong, at least it feels that way.
Congratulations, foolproof system.
Mandrake wrote:The Mercs are unbeatable and WCC + WDC were sealed since day one, hell even since pre-season testing.

Congratulations again, great wisdom from the beginning. I first encountererd such popular mantra in 1976, starting with kyalami, increasingly louder with every race for quite some time: "F1 has become sooo boooring! Lauda will again be champion, without any serious competition, how boring, why watch at all?"
Mandrake wrote:So unless you are are LH or NR fan, races are really boring. I do not care for "intense" battles for place 10.
You may have missed something.

McMrocks
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Joined: 14 Apr 2012, 17:58

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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2014 Pole time in Austin will be faster than 2013

Kingshark
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Joined: 26 May 2014, 05:41

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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And you are correct. Today the pole time was 3 tenths faster than it was in 2013, and only 4 tenths slower than it was in 2012.

Considering what a technical circuit Austin is (20 corners, lots of direction change) the amount of recovered downforce is mighty impressive.

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Juzh
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Joined: 06 Oct 2012, 08:45

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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soft tires

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mikeerfol
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Joined: 20 Apr 2013, 22:19
Location: Greece

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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Yeah but overall harder tyres than 2013.

Blanchimont
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Joined: 09 Nov 2012, 23:47

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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I think that's the first circuit where the 2014 car achieved a faster laptime than the 2013 one. In Canada and Italy it was close, the times where only 1 resp. 4 tenths slower there compared to 2013.

What are the factors?

+ Tyre compounds can differ
+ DRS can open wider in 2014
+- for Austin the air temps were different, this changes the density of the air and the drag but also downforce, density 2014 1,21 kg/m³ and in 2013 1,14 kg/m³

- 2014 car about 50 kg heavier during qualifying

Other influences?
Dear FIA, if you read this, please pm me for a redesign of the Technical Regulations to avoid finger nose shapes for 2016! :-)

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Juzh
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Joined: 06 Oct 2012, 08:45

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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mikeerfol wrote:Yeah but overall harder tyres than 2013.
2014 soft is still faster than 2013 med.

Kingshark
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Joined: 26 May 2014, 05:41

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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Juzh wrote:
mikeerfol wrote:Yeah but overall harder tyres than 2013.
2014 soft is still faster than 2013 med.
At Spa earlier this year, the 2014 soft tyres were lasting at least as long as the medium tyres were in 2013.

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Juzh
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Joined: 06 Oct 2012, 08:45

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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Kingshark wrote:
Juzh wrote:
mikeerfol wrote:Yeah but overall harder tyres than 2013.
2014 soft is still faster than 2013 med.
At Spa earlier this year, the 2014 soft tyres were lasting at least as long as the medium tyres were in 2013.
Bridgestone supersoft was faster and lasted entire race on tracks where pirelis fall apart in 10 laps. Means nothing.

Kingshark
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Joined: 26 May 2014, 05:41

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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Still, how do you know that the 2014 softs are any faster over one lap than the 2013 mediums? We know that the tyres are one step harder than they were in 2013. Rosberg is 3 tenths faster than Vettel last year.

F1 is not too "slow" this year, at least not if your car is a Mercedes.

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GitanesBlondes
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Joined: 30 Jul 2013, 20:16

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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rohit1594 wrote:
SiLo wrote:Soon it will be called GP1 and Formula 2.
I don't think so. Current Formula 1 is not just about sheer lap times and screaming sound of the cars (louder doesn't necessarily mean better); the technology used since this year is unparalleled in any other form of fuel-racing, not to mention the relevance to road-car technology! I am pretty confident that terms like 'ERS', 'turbocharger', 'energy recovery', 'heat energy' etc. will soon be quite common across most of other motorsport categories.

In fact, we should be really proud of the bold steps Formula 1 has taken to shift to this expensive but technologically advanced solution.
Sorry, Formula 1 has never had anything to do with road relevance, ever.

Go back and trace the entire history of F1 back to 1950, and you'll see all claims of road relevance are about as weak as the tires Pirelli produces for F1.

Even the current engines have nothing to do with road relevance as hybrid engines were already around in the 1990s, so it's not as if they can claim they were somehow first on this front.

What F1 was noted for on the engine side --all grand prix cars for that matter followed this 'formula' if you will-- outrageous engines that were simply in line with what one expected out of normally aspirated exotics. Turbochargers are not new to other motor racing series, rally racing had turbocharged engines in 1980.

F1 is not leading any technical revolution I'm afraid, nor is the technology at use unparalleled compared to any other motorsport. Try watching LMP1 to see what they're doing and how much more interesting it is. The Toyota TS040 Hybrid is far more impressive than an F1 car on the engine side of things. A pity they didn't last at Le Mans this year.

F1's current technical "prowess" is a giant marketing gimmick, always has been.
"I don't want to make friends with anybody. I don't give a sh*t for fame. I just want to win." -Nelson Piquet

ParkerArt
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Joined: 14 Jul 2014, 17:16

Re: F1 cars are 8 seconds slower than 10 years ago.

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GitanesBlondes wrote:
rohit1594 wrote:
SiLo wrote:Soon it will be called GP1 and Formula 2.
The Toyota TS040 Hybrid is far more impressive than an F1 car on the engine side of things.
Mercedes HPP would beg to differ. Pretty sure the W05 would crush any LMP-H car at a 6 hour race. The car would be able to handle the 24 Le Mans as it is though.

Plus, these cars are hugely limited by the fuel flow rate, as well as total fuel.