Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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FoxHound
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Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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This story was quietly broken a few months ago, but seems to be gaining more momentum.

A few details have emerged, along with Lotus tuning the chassis at some stage(alleged).
It will feature a Mercedes F1 hybrid powertrain redeveloped for the road and engineered at Mercedes-AMG High Performance Powertrains in Brixworth, where F1 racing engines are also made.It is not yet known whether the F1 engine’s 1.6-litre capacity will be retained or if the road engine’s block will be bored out for improved reliability. The racing engine’s 15,000rpm rev limit will almost certainly be significantly reduced for the same reason.
Even if it's pegged down to 10k rpm and bumped up to 2.2 litres It could easily push out 650bhp plus, as the "standard" 2 litre found in the A45 AMG can knock out about 400bhp today.

On top of this, the Hybrid tech is said to be deployed on this car too...
an F1 powertrain was being considered for use in a Mercedes hypercar earlier this year. “We have the most energy-dense hybrid pack in existence,” said one insider in April. “It would make a great deal of sense to harness that technology for the road.”
Possibly with all bells and whistles it could have a good 800bhp plus.
With Red Bull getting involved with AM, it seems to have pushed Mercedes into making the most of their F1 tie up.
The car’s chassis and body will be built around an F1-style carbonfibre monocoque, with software and hardware for its systems that take influence from the F1 team’s F1 W07 race car. The results will make for a car that should rival Aston Martin’s similarly focused AM-RB 001, which also benefits from F1 technology and construction know-how.
Pricing for the Mercedes will most likely be similarly stratospheric; a figure of around £3 million has been mooted.
And Lotus appear to be getting involved with chassis tuning for the road. At this early stage, no grandiose claims of lapping silverstone quicker than an "f1 car".... :lol:
http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-c ... tus-tuning

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FoxHound
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Re: Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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Jolle
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Re: Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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A silver gullwinged door car with a lotus tinkered chassis with a V6. Sounds like a DeLorean :P

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FoxHound
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Re: Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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Jolle wrote:A silver gullwinged door car with a lotus tinkered chassis with a V6. Sounds like a DeLorean :P
Sorta hoping it goes better than one...

Auto Bild reckon state of tune can vary, going up to 1300bhp!
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Pat Pending
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Re: Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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AMG already exists as Mercedes in-house tuning arm, and they have only recently persuaded the MB top brass to give them free rein on the new AMG GT. So why would MB want to downplay AMG's credentials by getting Lotus involved. Don't see it myself.

Just_a_fan
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Re: Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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Lotus is a world-renowned chassis tuner, that's why. AMG make great engines but their chassis tuning isn't in Lotus's league.
If you are more fortunate than others, build a larger table not a taller fence.

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Andres125sx
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Re: Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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Impressive!

This site claims it will be a 2 litre four cylinder engine providing around 1000bhp, toghether with two electric motors in the front wheels providing extra 150bhp each one for a total of 1300 bhp wich will move a total weight of 1300kg :D

They also claim active suspensions and active aero will be used


I wonder what ES they will use, type and size. 1300kg for a hybrid hypercar looks light.


BTW, if true, what do you think about their decision to go with a four cylinder? Wasn´t Mercedes (together with Ferrari) one of the manufacturers who pushed for the V6 instead of the L4 in F1? Maybe my memory sucks, but if I´m correct, it would be ironic

Jolle
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Re: Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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Andres125sx wrote:Impressive!

This site claims it will be a 2 litre four cylinder engine providing around 1000bhp, toghether with two electric motors in the front wheels providing extra 150bhp each one for a total of 1300 bhp wich will move a total weight of 1300kg :D

They also claim active suspensions and active aero will be used


I wonder what ES they will use, type and size. 1300kg for a hybrid hypercar looks light.


BTW, if true, what do you think about their decision to go with a four cylinder? Wasn´t Mercedes (together with Ferrari) one of the manufacturers who pushed for the V6 instead of the L4 in F1? Maybe my memory sucks, but if I´m correct, it would be ironic
In my mind Mercedes was ok with an 4l aswell, seeing that they are more and more ditching the v6es in their production cars

Pat Pending
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Re: Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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Just_a_fan wrote:Lotus is a world-renowned chassis tuner, that's why. AMG make great engines but their chassis tuning isn't in Lotus's league.
I don't disagree, but hiring in Lotus to fettle the chassis would do serious damage to the AMG brand. It would be perceived as MB admitting that their own performance division weren't up to the job. It would be bad business for MB to 'self harm' their own brand in that way.

Imagine if BMW announced that the an 'M' branded supercar (lets say a new M1) would have chassis tuning by Lotus...

The only way this might happen is if the Lotus involvement was kept secret.

It doesn't matter what the technical reality is (and again, I agree with your comment above), Marketing & Brand management will always come first for companies like MB.

Cold Fussion
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Re: Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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This should be obvious but unless the engine meats the technical regulations then it isn't an F1 engine.

Jolle
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Re: Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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Pat Pending wrote:
Just_a_fan wrote:Lotus is a world-renowned chassis tuner, that's why. AMG make great engines but their chassis tuning isn't in Lotus's league.
I don't disagree, but hiring in Lotus to fettle the chassis would do serious damage to the AMG brand. It would be perceived as MB admitting that their own performance division weren't up to the job. It would be bad business for MB to 'self harm' their own brand in that way.

Imagine if BMW announced that the an 'M' branded supercar (lets say a new M1) would have chassis tuning by Lotus...

The only way this might happen is if the Lotus involvement was kept secret.

It doesn't matter what the technical reality is (and again, I agree with your comment above), Marketing & Brand management will always come first for companies like MB.
Like the M1 was developed by a company like Lamborghini?
Lotus Engineering do more tuning of cars then you think

Pat Pending
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Joined: 22 Feb 2016, 13:11

Re: Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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Jolle wrote: Like the M1 was developed by a company like Lamborghini?
Lotus Engineering do more tuning of cars then you think
No it wasn't in the end, actually.

I am aware of how much Engineering consultancy that Lotus does but my point is that their involvement is rarely if ever publicly acknowledged.

So, yes OK, I concede that Lotus could in theory be involved with an MB/AMG hypercar, but I still maintain that it won't be publicly acknowledged.

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FoxHound
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Re: Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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Pat Pending wrote:AMG already exists as Mercedes in-house tuning arm, and they have only recently persuaded the MB top brass to give them free rein on the new AMG GT. So why would MB want to downplay AMG's credentials by getting Lotus involved. Don't see it myself.
In terms of design and engineering, it will be an AMG. Tuning the suspension is something down the line that will require set up work to the then existing set up. Even then, it may only be to reference AMG's own work.

Just_a_fan wrote:Lotus is a world-renowned chassis tuner, that's why. AMG make great engines but their chassis tuning isn't in Lotus's league.
Both cater to vastly different clients, and major in their own fields. But elephant in the room is that AMG can actually make money from delivering what their clients expect.
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FoxHound
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Re: Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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Andres125sx wrote:Impressive!

This site claims it will be a 2 litre four cylinder engine providing around 1000bhp, toghether with two electric motors in the front wheels providing extra 150bhp each one for a total of 1300 bhp wich will move a total weight of 1300kg :D

They also claim active suspensions and active aero will be used


I wonder what ES they will use, type and size. 1300kg for a hybrid hypercar looks light.


BTW, if true, what do you think about their decision to go with a four cylinder? Wasn´t Mercedes (together with Ferrari) one of the manufacturers who pushed for the V6 instead of the L4 in F1? Maybe my memory sucks, but if I´m correct, it would be ironic
I'll bet that Merc-AMG have diverted a few engineers from Brackley onto this project, so the ES componentry will bear some traits to the F1 programmes own.
Tobias Moers himself has said they want to make full use of the "most energy dense hybrid pack on earth", so there's that....

As for the engine, EVO is reporting that the source that broke this story is part of the F1 team, and that at Belgium last weekend they confirmed the car would have the same engine as the W07! =P~
There s the caveat as to how they get it working, the engine may be stretched out to a larger displacement.
http://www.evo.co.uk/news/18211/mercede ... d-hypercar
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Just_a_fan
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Re: Mercedes F1 engined Hypercar

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FoxHound wrote:
Both cater to vastly different clients, and major in their own fields. But elephant in the room is that AMG can actually make money from delivering what their clients expect.
Lotus could do so too if they had the financial muscle of MB behind them. Lotus has never had that level of financial stability/ support. And yet they are still going and still selling cars to people who want true sports cars.
If you are more fortunate than others, build a larger table not a taller fence.

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