FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.
piast9
20
Joined: 16 Mar 2010, 00:39

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

Let me first state that I am not a fan of super safe tracks and tarmac run-off areas. But I have just realized something. In my opinion, if f1technical existed back in the '60s there would be similar topic with ranting about the spirit of F1 being ruined by some drivers group that want the trees that grow next to the track being cut. Maybe current driver safety innovations are also something that in half a century would be considered as normal.

Manoah2u
61
Joined: 24 Feb 2013, 14:07

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

The guy above me gets it.
"Explain the ending to F1 in football terms"
"Hamilton was beating Verstappen 7-0, then the ref decided F%$& rules, next goal wins
while also sending off 4 Hamilton players to make it more interesting"

langwadt
35
Joined: 25 Mar 2012, 14:54

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

piast9 wrote:
22 Apr 2017, 19:31
Let me first state that I am not a fan of super safe tracks and tarmac run-off areas. But I have just realized something. In my opinion, if f1technical existed back in the '60s there would be similar topic with ranting about the spirit of F1 being ruined by some drivers group that want the trees that grow next to the track being cut. Maybe current driver safety innovations are also something that in half a century would be considered as normal.
everytime the safety precautions in track racing is discussed I wonder how rally is still allowed

User avatar
Henne
2
Joined: 11 Jul 2008, 16:29

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

piast9 wrote:
22 Apr 2017, 19:31
Let me first state that I am not a fan of super safe tracks and tarmac run-off areas. But I have just realized something. In my opinion, if f1technical existed back in the '60s there would be similar topic with ranting about the spirit of F1 being ruined by some drivers group that want the trees that grow next to the track being cut. Maybe current driver safety innovations are also something that in half a century would be considered as normal.
Their grandstands, and photography possibilities, where amazingly safe back then... Oh wait... :wink:

Image

User avatar
Andres125sx
166
Joined: 13 Aug 2013, 10:15
Location: Madrid, Spain

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

langwadt wrote:
22 Apr 2017, 23:39
piast9 wrote:
22 Apr 2017, 19:31
Let me first state that I am not a fan of super safe tracks and tarmac run-off areas. But I have just realized something. In my opinion, if f1technical existed back in the '60s there would be similar topic with ranting about the spirit of F1 being ruined by some drivers group that want the trees that grow next to the track being cut. Maybe current driver safety innovations are also something that in half a century would be considered as normal.
everytime the safety precautions in track racing is discussed I wonder how rally is still allowed
How many fatalities there have been in the WRC championship in the last decade? I guess the number must be high for you to say this, right?

User avatar
Andres125sx
166
Joined: 13 Aug 2013, 10:15
Location: Madrid, Spain

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

Henne wrote:
22 Apr 2017, 23:50
piast9 wrote:
22 Apr 2017, 19:31
Let me first state that I am not a fan of super safe tracks and tarmac run-off areas. But I have just realized something. In my opinion, if f1technical existed back in the '60s there would be similar topic with ranting about the spirit of F1 being ruined by some drivers group that want the trees that grow next to the track being cut. Maybe current driver safety innovations are also something that in half a century would be considered as normal.
Their grandstands, and photography possibilities, where amazingly safe back then... Oh wait... :wink:

http://img03.deviantart.net/8707/i/2012 ... 5esc66.jpg
:o :shock: :wtf: :? #-o :roll:

That picture is enlightening, provides a clear picture about how safety was seen in that days.... or to be more precise, provide a clear picture about the total absence of safety concerns back then

Jolle
132
Joined: 29 Jan 2014, 22:58
Location: Dordrecht

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

cplchanb wrote:
21 Apr 2017, 20:47
Jolle wrote:
21 Apr 2017, 19:08
With this the horrible F4 accident in mind and the motorbike deaths in the last few years (drivers getting run over), maybe the next level of safety is a more active one. So far the FIA only worked on building more structures, better chassis, more equipment around the drivers heads and a few procedures (like the VSC). What if, trough the ECU there is a max speed differential on certain parts of the track?

If a driver slows down a lot, it's picked up by GPS and other drivers are first warned (a few corners ahead, a racetrack is pretty predictable) and an automatic speedlimit on that section (for instance, "slow car + 50km/h)

This system could also be used to "punish" driving outside the lines, on the tarmac where once gravel traps were.

with taking an active role in not crashing (to hard), F1 on a road safety level gets more relevant as well.
I don't think it would work well....the sudden deceleration from 200km to 50 will for sure damage the drivers neck. Even if it was possible I don't think the system would be able to react in time to this type of situation. At that point there wouldn't be much point in using this system since by then there would be enough time in 99% of the cases to see and react to the situation.
Something like this:

http://mashable.com/2016/12/27/tesla-pr ... urrJtqMOqP

cplchanb
11
Joined: 31 Jan 2017, 19:13

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

well imo like merc was in 2016, the gains in safety are really diminishing in return before it gets really too safe for the greater good of the sport and it becomes bumper car safe.
Sure its nice when one can race withoiut fear of injury, but when it gets to the point where it sanitizes the very essence of the sport itself theyve gone too far.
I think realistically we are at a level today where the mix between safety, danger and entertainment is pretty optimal albiet probably a tiny bit too safe with their vsc procedures and for sure on run offs in certain tracks.

Manoah2u
61
Joined: 24 Feb 2013, 14:07

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

Lol, i can't grasp at the amount of ignorance people have.

How many times do people need to be reminded of the recent deaths of Bianchi and Maria DeVillota? Freak accidents? no, it shows just how dangerous it really is. It also shows just on what extremely high level this 'show' is being run. Then there's our F4 driver that lost its legs. Freak accident? well, define freak accident. Does it matter less because it is a freak accident? No, that's exactly the point. They're all freak accidents because they are not the norm.

Let's analyze a little bit further, shall we?

How about Alonso's crash last year, that left him injured. Would you guys prefered to have seen him DEAD? Because that's really what's happening here. "Theyre taking safety too far"
-censorship is desirable for what i really think about those thought processes- no, they're doing their job. And just how good they're doing it shows because Alonso could walk away.
And even then, he got lucky.

Wehrlein. Race of Champions. Freak accident? there we go again. No, it's an accident, and it shows just how fast some 'worthless' race can turn into something dangerous and harmful.
It wasn't a F1 car going 300+. There aren't millions of prize money to be gained from that 'fun' race.
Let's take our dear friend Kubica. Sure, another discipline, but it again shows just how dangerous racing is.

Finished? hell no. Giovanazzi, twice. During qually, solid crash, drivers blast through a dozen inches away from him. They get penalized because they didn't slow down enough. Take a look at our F4 friend again to see how fast something can get ugly. Grosjean can cry like a little child about it, but it would have been rather different if because of his higher speed he had taken out Giovanazzi's legs. No, it didn't happen. thankfully. But you guys don't realize just how close it gets.
Race run again Giovanazzi.

Then Verstappen loses his brakes. Imagine that happening at Monte carlo just after the straight, and the picture gets rather different, doesn't it?

I get the feeling all those 'bloodsport' likers are by the majority still or just stepping out of their diapers and don't know death outside of a 'fragkill' from some lame ass videogame.
Go ahead and step into an indoor (or even more dangerous, outdoor) Kart event, and let's see how many times you guys have to change your underwear when you slide sideways and
the competition passes you by just centimeters full speed. And also, let's talk on how 'athletic' you guys then are when the race is over, bruize free? still able to run the marathon?

Really, learn some respect for those drivers that are the best athletes in the world. Most if not all competing F1 drivers are vastly more athletic and fit then professional soccer players,
another sport where people seem to lack basic understanding of how easily one can get severely harmed in a contact sport. No, lives are not at stake at soccer, but in F1, they actually are.

And while at it, do learn some basic understanding of laws of physics, and human biology to see just how much of an impact high-speed close-competition racing really strains on the body.
"Explain the ending to F1 in football terms"
"Hamilton was beating Verstappen 7-0, then the ref decided F%$& rules, next goal wins
while also sending off 4 Hamilton players to make it more interesting"

User avatar
Vasconia
6
Joined: 30 Aug 2012, 10:45
Location: Basque Country

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

strad wrote:
21 Apr 2017, 03:35
While I cannot agree that they should die for our entertainment I would agree with these quotes from ones who should know...
Motorsport without danger is like cooking without salt
Sir Stirling Moss
.
If a man can't look at danger and still go on, man has stopped living. If the worst ever happens – then it means simply that I've been asked to pay the bill for the happiness of my life – without a moment's regret. Graham Hill
.
These men are not wild and wooly characters who
do not care if they live or die, nor are they clowns
or speed-happy maniacs.
They are men with a special skill which they have
developed over a hazardous few years. They survived
the development period and became great in their
profession.
Having survived and become champions, they lived on
an exciting plateau alone with their own kind, above
other men, envied by many who were not gifted with the
daring spirit and the ability to live life to the
fullest possessed by them.
"
~ Johnnie Parsons, 1970
The men who live it, seem to have a different view from those who worry overmuch about safety.
It was a different historic moment. F1 was seen as a heroic sport where some drives wanted to make clear the difference between "real" men and "ordinary" men. It was only part of our DNA where humans have tried to push the boundaries, reach new limits and risk their own lives just to feel that great feeling.

Nowadays F1 is something totally different. It depends on each person´s taste to judge which one is better.

User avatar
Vasconia
6
Joined: 30 Aug 2012, 10:45
Location: Basque Country

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

And by the way, what FIA wants to do is stupid, but is my own opinion.

User avatar
mclaren111
272
Joined: 06 Apr 2014, 10:49
Location: Shithole - South Africa

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

Vasconia wrote:
24 Apr 2017, 09:53
And by the way, what FIA wants to do is stupid, but is my own opinion.
And I agree with you. Motorsport is dangerous - Period !!!!

Always has been and always should be !!! Big part of the attraction !!!!

User avatar
strad
117
Joined: 02 Jan 2010, 01:57

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

Henne wrote:
22 Apr 2017, 23:50
piast9 wrote:
22 Apr 2017, 19:31
Let me first state that I am not a fan of super safe tracks and tarmac run-off areas. But I have just realized something. In my opinion, if f1technical existed back in the '60s there would be similar topic with ranting about the spirit of F1 being ruined by some drivers group that want the trees that grow next to the track being cut. Maybe current driver safety innovations are also something that in half a century would be considered as normal.
Their grandstands, and photography possibilities, where amazingly safe back then... Oh wait... :wink:

http://img03.deviantart.net/8707/i/2012 ... 5esc66.jpg
How many hundreds of times do you think he sat right there snapping pictures without any harm?
This silly argument always comes up in these discussions.
To achieve anything, you must be prepared to dabble on the boundary of disaster.”
Sir Stirling Moss

Manoah2u
61
Joined: 24 Feb 2013, 14:07

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

As for track-side dangers, that guy is risking his own life, and is rather being disrespectful for the racers going about. Imagine losing control and hitting that photographer.

Apart from that, i felt my toes churning when in the AUS race the finishflag dropped and the gates were opened for spectators that came inches away from F1 cars driving slow;
perhaps more dangerous than fast driving, as their downforce is low at that moment. But it just shows that the tiniest thing can turn something absolutely mad.

I've been holding my breath several times the past few seasons looking at marshalls running on the track, when the pack is blazing in on them. I remember famously that marshal
that crossed the track and got hit by a f1 car speeding about the corner, and both getting killed due to the fire extinguisher the marhsal was carrying hitting the driver in the head.
obviously, doesnt need much explenation why the marshal didnt live to tell.

as for taking things too far - rants about safety and the disrespect for the lives of the drivers and their direct relatives, friends, families, and for marshals simlarly because one thinks
they're not getting entertained enough is taking this waaaay too far.

because in the end, that's reallit isn't it?

those complaining out safety feel like they're not entertained enough sitting on their couch because a driver is not about to get impaled by a sharp stick through his cranium.
how boring! a close-combat race with cars smashing into eachother, brakes failing, corner after corner fighting, manly overtakes. how boring! prefer to see brainmatter splattered
against the walls or mangled legs portruding from the nosecone


it's respectless and rather disturbing, really.

nobody is keeping you guys from stepping on a Superbike, taking off the brakes, putting on some swimtrunks, some sunglasses, and racing the isle of man race if you want the danger of death.
if you're not up to that task, then you should really learn to sh*t the funk up and sit in a corner and shame upon oneself.

/end of rant.
"Explain the ending to F1 in football terms"
"Hamilton was beating Verstappen 7-0, then the ref decided F%$& rules, next goal wins
while also sending off 4 Hamilton players to make it more interesting"

Manoah2u
61
Joined: 24 Feb 2013, 14:07

Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post

and while i'm at it, really, 'downvoting with reason' hyperbole' ?

nothing hyperbolical at all. they are facts, or do you live on another planet where kubica is a double f1 world champion with his hands in perfect working condition?
"Explain the ending to F1 in football terms"
"Hamilton was beating Verstappen 7-0, then the ref decided F%$& rules, next goal wins
while also sending off 4 Hamilton players to make it more interesting"