FIA continues to help Ferrari

[manchild]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/54506

Complaints that a driver has been impeded during qualifying will no longer be referred to the stewards of the meeting. Only in cases where it appears to race control that there has been a clear and deliberate attempt to impede another driver will the stewards be asked to intervene.

F1 continues to sink lower and lower. If on next races Massa or Schuey impeed Alonso that won't be sanctioned. This really, really stinks. It was a usefull rule to enable Schuey to catch up on Alonso and now all of the sudden when the possibilty occured that Schumacher might suffer from same rule FIA stops applying it!

[Spencifer_Murphy]

another article here:

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=37376

On the other hand manchild, Ferrari can't complain that Alonso is impeeding others simply by being on the track like they did at Monza lmao

This is a good thing, up until this I was expecting Ferrari to complain to the FIA that Alonso is impeeding Schumi by taking points away from him! lmao

[FLC]

manchild, stop being so pathetic. MS never had anything to do with what happened at Monza, and the chance MS or Massa, after what happened last week, would impede Alonso or Fisichella is anyway very low. F1 isnt just about Ferrari and Renault. Other teams can suffer from exactly the same thing.
The FIA has done a --- job with that low, and just now when they realised it, after seeing what it might cause, they got the brains to change it. Very late and stupid, but it's got nothing to do with Ferrari. It's not like every race there is a case of impeding.

by the way, this was also in the article:

And in a sentence aimed clearly at Renault's reaction to what happened at Monza, he added: "We now feel it is pointless for the stewards to engage in long and painstaking enquiries if competitors ignore clear scientific evidence and instead abuse the regulator."

[mcdenife]

Perhaps if they showed this "clear scientific evidence" they wont get abuse.
They say the data proves Massa was impeded. Well why not make the proof available to the guilty so they can at least defend themselves. Or are they afraid the interpretation of the data is wrong?

[FLC]

Did they show the data from MS's incident at Monaco? Because maybe the interpretation there wasnt right too... Did they show the data from VIL and FIS's incident? They never show the data, no matter which teams are involved. Why should Ferrari show their's?

[manchild]

No one thought that Alonso impeeded Massa except Ferrari while everyone except Ferrari thought that Schuey deliberately parked his car. That's a huge difference.

[captainmorgan]

just a theoretical question... if FIA somehow does show the data, and if it shows that Massa was also AIDED by a tow, would that make a difference to anyone?

[boban-mk]

F1 continues to sink lower and lower. If on next races Massa or Schuey impeed Alonso that won't be sanctioned. This really, really stinks. It was a usefull rule to enable Schuey to catch up on Alonso and now all of the sudden when the possibilty occured that Schumacher might suffer from same rule FIA stops applying it!

What ever will be decided, or changed by FIA you always see as wrong and in Ferrari favor. What happend in Monza was a situation that will never repeat. That's when one driver is in situation to hurry to catch up the flag and have no time at all to break and let the driver behind him to pass. If Alonso had enough time he will let Massa to pass him for sure.
Also the statement that all are sure that that was not impeding is completely not true. All are sure that impeding was not deliberate. But impeding happend. That is completly different thing.
If you all cry as childs for one machine break, i can't imagine what you will do if reno and alonso lose this years titles. So i can say, ralax, steady, this is a sport, and everything can happend. You can't be always lucky and bad things can happend to reno too.

[captainmorgan]

If you all cry as childs for one machine break, i can't imagine what you will do if reno and alonso lose this years titles. So i can say, ralax, steady, this is a sport, and everything can happend. You can't be always lucky and bad things can happend to reno too.

I don't understand what you mean by this... the controversy isnt about Alonso's engine failure, its about prejudicial decisions made by stewards and by extension FIA, both whom are supposed to be impartial.

FIA claims to base their decisions on "scientific" evidence... If its so scientific then it should be objective, meaning that anyone who has the data should arrive at the same conclusion, so why not release it? I just want to see how he was impeded. or at least read about it

[kheopsb]

Not liking Ferrari and MS is one thing which I can find understandable, but the conspiracy rethoric about the FIA aiding Schumi and the ferraris carries as much weight as the claim that Iraq was an imminent threat to the US and hte UK...

Did they show the data from MS's incident at Monaco? Because maybe the interpretation there wasnt right too... Did they show the data from VIL and FIS's incident? They never show the data, no matter which teams are involved. Why should Ferrari show their's?

This is a very astute observation, it seems people use any argument they find whether valid or not to castigate a team they dislike.. this to me dis neither thorough nor plausible logic.

Furthermore, why are we not bringing up all the penalties assessed against Ferrari? although imperfect this is a sport with more than just one or two teams. rulings have been made against ferrari, renault and many other teams with no end in sight.
I just find it questionable to wave the conspiracy theory flag... at the risk of being perceived as a bitter sportsman as were alonso and flavio after their strange comments.
We all recognize the shortcomings of the FIA but I feel it should be left at that, unless anyone has statistics demonstrating that the majority of FIA rulings have consistently been in 1 team's interest.

[FLC]

You cant see it because the telemtry data in F1 has been treated as 'top secret' information for a long time now, and not because the FIA is trying to hide something in this particualr incident. All teams work the same when it comes to that. I'm sure that we, as fans who are intersted in the technical side of F1, would love to see the telemtry data, even when it's got nothing to do with a penalty, but thats just not the way it is. Teams dont show their data, on the contrary - they invest a lot of money in order to protect it and to put their hands on their rivals'.
What bothers me is that people here never asked to see the data from MS's incident at Monaco or from other impeding incidents or even just when a dirver speeds on the pit lane, which means they are confidnet the stewards make the right choices or atleast that nothing is suspicious about them. Is that because the ruling in those cases fit their likings (or they just dont really care) and now it isnt?

The ruling of the incident at Monza wasnt to some people's liking. They call it a 'farce', using words like 'curroption', 'conspiracy' and 'fixing' to describe it. The regulations sucks, they say. How come that, now, when it's finally changed they say it is unfair? If Ferrari did get an advantage out of something wrong - would it be ok if Renault did the same? In the name of what? Revenge? Talk about double morale...

[janus]

lets lose the conpiracy teory !! the point is this....and shumi did that thing in monaco fia opened a precedent for the frist time a drivers was penalise and i dont now if shumacher did it deliberate the point was that a driver was penalise and was reasanable doubt if it was deliberate or not and i remeber writing on that post that from now on a driver that makes a little mistake or makes it deliberate would get the same treatement ..

i am not defending anyone the point was that the mistake was from fia frist in monaco or put shumacher out of the race adminitng that i did it deliberate or ignored

than thaking that action of only taking out is best times the only possible thin that fia shoud do in monza was the same for alonso i think i did not do it deliberate but the point is that the rules are clear and fia should the apply same criterium in this case unfair but the rules are the rules

i dont think ferrair made this append i think ferrari took the chance beacause they new the fia did not have any choise...that the same criterium aplaide in monaco was the same where beacause the rule if for deliberate action and now deliberate action i am not comparing the tow thing but the rule is for the two


look like ferari was smart and took advatage of the monaco mistake and waited until the right time to do a payback to renault

but let be honest the reanult engine if did not blow in monza is was going to blow in china or be change and alonso was penalise

[pRo]

Excuse my language, but un-----believable.

MS never had anything to do with what happened at Monza

Actually, he has everything to do with it. He has a chance for the title this year.

Anyone remember FIA acting weird during last season? I wonder why. Maybe they thought that they can't impede Renault enough, or did every major guy at FIA silently change for this year and that's the reason for all this crap?

It's not even a conspiracy, it's too obvious.

[manchild]

Excuse my language, but un-----believable.

MS never had anything to do with what happened at Monza

Actually, he has everything to do with it. He has a chance for the title this year.

Even though Massa was the one who complained I'm sure he was the last person in Ferrari wanting to complain to stewards. I'm sure no one doubts he was told to do so by Ferrari bosses just to help Schuey. So, as pRo said, what happened in Monza happened only because of Schuey's "glory".

[DaveKillens]

I'm sure the Ferrari team made available to the stewards G-force data at Parabolica. They had previous lap(s) and the one where Massa was following Alonso. I'm sure that was the data that triggered the decision.
But now that this ruling was "clarified" (why didn't Whiting overrule the stewards Saturday night instead of much later?) I wonder if we will see any change in the Ferrari qualifying strategy. Usually in the last session Schumacher and Massa leave the pits together, pit at the same time, and usually run within sight of each other.
Will Massa some how wind up in front of Alonso in the last few minutes? I think that's what we shall have to look for if Ferrari are playing dirty pool.
Personally, this is just like when Shu got caught out passing under a flag, and lost qualifying positions. Everyone is constantly seeking any advantage, searching for the second where a competitor puts a wheel wrong. They themselves have nothing to lose, so the stewards are informed, and the complaining team hopes a ruling comes their way.
It's just due to crappy circumstance that Alonso wound up in front of Massa, with the clock giving him no option but to press on.
But it's still fishy how at of all tracks, Monza, that the stewards handed out a too-sever punishment to Schumacher's (Ferfari) rival. In some spots it's called "home field advantage".