Min Cost for Max - F1 goes Wal-Mart?

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checkered
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Joined: 02 Mar 2007, 14:32

Min Cost for Max - F1 goes Wal-Mart?

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Take a design, copy and package

under various brands, outsource and produce in bulk (in newly industrialising countries when possible), rely on economies of scale, dominate distribution, make sure that subsidiaries carry all overhead and risk. Appear as safe, recognisable, simple, ubiquitous, unchanging and in every way as self-evident and unchallenged towards your retail customer as possible. Minimise contact between the actual running of the business and the retail customer, the experience towards him/her must always be the same, the protocol of interaction must always be the same. Make it a habit, conditionalise by repetition.

OK, maybe I'm in a bit of a depressed and aggravated mood. But once again, the issue of cost cuts has arisen. And there's an effort by Mosley to make it an absolute priority. Once again, once again. I can't help but think that this risks a lot. It might also preclude a lot ... is there a lack of faith creeping in that Formula One can't take on the challenges of sustainability and producing technological advances, outlined so very recently? How much pressure is there because of the loan burden of the new owners of the series? Mosley has sent a letter to team principals last week and it sounds a lot like a "Spec'n'Span" future for this motor sport series. This is strange as teams and companies are more and more highlighting their innovations and technologies through F1, especially online. Excerpts from an Autosport article (link to full article):
Max Mosley in a document attached to the letter wrote: Formula One's vast profits are currently being wasted on pointless exercises for the private entertainment of the teams' engineers. As a result, several independent teams are losing money when they should be making a profit, while car manufacturers are forced to spend excessively. This is the problem which needs to be addressed.

If it did not waste money on pointless, hidden and duplicated technology, Formula One would be an immensely profitable business. Each department would be a valuable franchise. Instead it is living on subsidies from the car industry and hand-outs from friendly billionaires.

Until the basic problem of costs has been resolved, time should not be wasted discussing how the FOM money is to be distributed. It is a secondary matter. The same applies to debating the level of technical co-operation allowed between teams.

The technical contest has become enormously expensive. However, most of its elements are concealed from the public. Because they are concealed, even secret, these elements add nothing to the entertainment.

Therefore the money spent on them is wasted, all the more so because work on these elements is duplicated in each of the 12 departments (the teams). It makes absolutely no sense to spend large sums on items which do not add to the entertainment, indeed often detract from it.

It makes even less sense for each of 12 departments to carry out the same unnecessary work. No rational person would run a business in which 12 departments duplicate each other's research work, still less if that work provides very little of the entertainment which underpins the business.

Therefore all items on the cars which are not known, visible and understood by the public should be standardised and manufactured at minimal cost. The technical contest should be limited to items which are visible, understood and potentially useful - eg KERS.

This would produce a huge reduction in costs without affecting the entertainment. Indeed the cars would be more equal, giving closer racing and better entertainment.
I especially "love" the comment about only using items that the fans "understand" on the cars ... :roll: And here I was thinking that it was the FIA's current F1 rules that forced the 12 "departments" i.e. teams to allocate big resources to study and develop very similar technologies ... How stupid of me.

Here's a little something to reflect the ongoing cost cutting drive against: A Pitpass article (link) stating that since CVC acquired the sport, profits have gone from $312.7M to $6M.

EDIT: A pretty good opinion about all this from Grandprix.com - "The funding of the sport" (link).
Last edited by checkered on 25 Sep 2007, 20:57, edited 1 time in total.

modbaraban
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Joined: 05 Apr 2007, 17:44
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Re: Min Cost for Max - F1 goes Wal-Mart?

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Max wrote:It makes even less sense for each of 12 departments to carry out the same unnecessary work. No rational person would run a business in which 12 departments duplicate each other's research work, still less if that work provides very little of the entertainment which underpins the business.
Holy....t :shock:
I thought they were competitors! But they are just departments of 1 business.

I'm too speechless to comment any further :roll:

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Tom
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Joined: 13 Jan 2006, 00:24
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Has Max considered that standadising parts will mean that everyone who sat down and designed a unique component, every CAD, CAM and CFD operator who bought these components to 3d, every company that specialised in producing and developing these parts will all be made instantly redundant at the loss of thousands of jobs?

How can a man so clever overlook suck an obvious issue?
Perhaps he hasn't, perhaps he actually just doesn't care as long as FOM get more ill-earned cash.
Murphy's 9th Law of Technology:
Tell a man there are 300 million stars in the universe and he'll believe you. Tell him a bench has wet paint on it and he'll have to touch to be sure.

Saribro
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Joined: 28 Jul 2006, 00:34

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Tom wrote:How can a man so clever...
Ahem... How many times does he have to disprove that till everyone notices :).

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Ciro Pabón
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Well, I can find some reason in the reasoning.

Just one question:

When was the last time F1 invented something used in cars (or in other racing series)?

Frankly, I cannot remember. Maybe it was when the Gurney flap came to light.

Simple.

F1 is "disconnected" from other series. If they want to save some serious money, they could try to develop things in a formal, regulated "ladder", from inventions to drivers to teams.

This reminds me of my horoscope for today (this is it, seriously! ;))

"One of the gifts God gave you is individualism. This gift becomes the greatest annoyance for the people that shares their life with you".

Max, Max, Max.... c'mon. Max: you're the boss of FIA, not of F1. All racing series have a meaning and a purpose, no matter how humble... except F1, it seems. The top series is too expensive. Glad to know.

Wal Mart? Yeap, F1 it's like buying at Wal Mart. Like buying diamonds at Wal Mart.... :lol:
Ciro

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Rob W
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Joined: 18 Aug 2006, 03:28

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Max talking before he engages his brain again. How many things has he said over the year on-behalf of F1 which never eventuate? Tons.

Rob W

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wrk
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Joined: 17 Feb 2005, 17:00
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well if thats the case he wants to turn F1 into A1GP.. all the same underneath just a different colour paint job
gentlemen start your engines......

Ogami musashi
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Joined: 13 Jun 2007, 22:57

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I think this is PR.

MAx Mosley is someone clever i'm sure, but acts according to some obscure plans.

The sentence about how the FOM money redistribution being a secondary question makes me feel for him maybe this is a first one.

If teams spend less money then FOM money redistribution will be easier.


All in one MR mosley takes the problem again in the opposite.
According to him the expenses are too high because they concern technology not revealed to the fans.
Instead of trying to open the fans to technologies (which has been proposed by many teams principals for long time) and in general F1 specificities max wants to lower the level of technology.

His standard-mania really scares me....

On a technical side, it is quite obvious the FIA tries not to be overdriven by team's technological advances like before by implementing standardized thing (ECU, undertray, wings if they had no opposition from teams..).

Welcome to Champ car!

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whiplash
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The Man is a numpty he is on about standerdising parts that canot be seen and cutting costs and sharing information he has just fined Maclaren $100 milion for trying to do that :D

On a more serious note I feel that Spygate gose a lot further and involves more teams and by leagally sharing information it will ilimanate such very public embarsment to the FIA

Ogami musashi
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Joined: 13 Jun 2007, 22:57

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you're maybe right. All of this is politics and that's so sad because we're about a sport.

Belatti
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Joined: 10 Jul 2007, 21:48
Location: Argentina

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Here is a joke I´ll try to translate to you:

An engineer dies and goes to haeven, but St.Peter says to him that there is no more room and send him to hell. The devil says nothing and accept the engineer. One month later, hell is working like never before, air conditioning is fixed, the elevators works well, they have no more water problems and soon new optical fiber net will be installed for computers and digital TV. God sees this and begin complaining. He says to him "give me back that engineer, he belongs to haeven". The devil replies "No, you didn´t accept him, now he belongs here". "That is not fair" God objects, "I will sue you", "Really?" says the devil.... "and with what lawyer???" :D

Friends, remember we are all engineers (or something close to it) and Max is a lawyer. We do all the work and others benefit from it. That is how it works.
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna

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tomislavp4
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Joined: 16 Jun 2006, 17:07
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Man, just give ´em a pair of running shoes and let them run ´round monza, everyone knows how that works :lol:

kurtiejjj
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Joined: 21 Jan 2007, 17:40

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Cost-cutting, it's everywhere. F1 and the teams are companies of which many strive for a profit. Some only for marketing value.

However I think F1's will be depressing if it goes on like this, without too much action on the track more and more people will stop watching. Something has to be done, soon!

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Scuderia_Russ
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kurtiejjj wrote:Cost-cutting, it's everywhere. F1 and the teams are companies of which many strive for a profit. Some only for marketing value.

However I think F1's will be depressing if it goes on like this, without too much action on the track more and more people will stop watching. Something has to be done, soon!

I'm interested in the technological side of motor racing as much as anyone else here but people don't seem to realise that if there is a spending competition that is allowed to get out of hand there will be no Formula One to watch full stop!
So why don't we all just critisize Max Mosely because it's fasionable ffs :roll:
"Whether you think you can or can't, either way you are right."
-Henry Ford-

modbaraban
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Joined: 05 Apr 2007, 17:44
Location: Kyiv, Ukraine

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Scuderia_Russ wrote:So why don't we all just critisize Max Mosely because it's fasionable ffs :roll:
Ok! Let's support Max and happily end up watching the future F1=A1GP but more expensive :lol:

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