Silly Season 2011 Thread

Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.

Post Wed Jun 09, 2010 7:57 pm

xpensive wrote:
ringo wrote:Will Williams use Renault engines? Sounds pretty feasible, after all Renault have said they can manage an increased demand.


Blaming Cosworth for their failures will be a popular thing among more than one team, but Williams and Rensault seems to make sense.


Seemingly Williams have had complaints about the fact that there is more than one glitch for their liking, seemingly they are having problems with the CA2010 with their overall package. Geoff Wills said in the May 2010 issue of Race Tech mag theres a mid range glitch with the Cosworth power-plant. This leads me to the fact that i can see them going to Renault, but only if Epsilon dont go for Renault power, failing that, they could see if Renault can supply 4 teams with power.

Would be logical, untill Williams and Red Bull both get VW power under the Audi brand.
ESPImperium
 
Joined: 5 Apr 2008
Location: Glasgow, Scotland

Post Wed Jun 09, 2010 9:58 pm

doopie2you wrote:
alberto222mx wrote:
andrew wrote:You're right about Webber. They should have aimed for Raikonnen.


+1,

I think with this decission Kimi's F1 career is over, he won´t sign for a small team.

doopie2you wrote:Massa confirmed!

Second team who makes a mistace :lol:

First Webber and now Massa they just DON'T GOT IT.


Is not a mistake to hire Massa for the next two seasons, is the best Ferrari can do right now, bet on Alonso and put Massa as the second. The mistake was let Kimi go the last year instead of Massa.


So you are saying that Ferrari can't handle 2 proffesional drivers so the only reason to keep massa is to get no fighting in the team :lol:


Exactly!
And neither Alonso can handle a fight with another talented driver in the same team. :)
"Why doesn´t someone tell Pedro it´s raining" - Chris Amon, 1000km Brands Hatch, 1970
alberto222mx
 
Joined: 16 May 2010
Location: México, D.F.

Post Wed Jun 09, 2010 10:40 pm

doopie2you wrote:Damn Webber stays at RBR :lol:

If i were RBR i wouldn't had signed him, he is so old. And can't overtake [-X



He is only three years older than Raikkonen, I wonder what your cutoff for 'old' is. 32?
Before I do anything I ask myself “Would an idiot do that?” And if the answer is yes, I do not do that thing. - Dwight Schrute
Giblet
 
Joined: 19 Mar 2007
Location: Downtown Canada

Post Wed Jun 09, 2010 10:43 pm

I think he can. Alonso came to Ferrari knowing that Massa had successfully challenged all of his teammates there. And had he not gone through the accident last year he would have probably finished better than Raikkonen. Massa isn't a slouch anymore and Alonso clearly knows that.
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mx_tifoso
 
Joined: 30 Nov 2006
Location: North America

Post Wed Jun 09, 2010 11:06 pm

The funny thing is that Massa is underrated; for some strange reason. He has finished in the points for every race this year, and hasn't made any mistakes. He is a good driver to keep if Ferrari want to win a constructors.
Not only that, but he is a winning driver and can win again if the car is up to scratch. Any other driver replacing him would be a step backwards, even Kubica.
Massa has what 11 wins and 15 poles?
The man is a very decorated driver, very solid, good for team spirit and good for marketing to south America. :lol:
Ferrari made a good move looking ahead.
Continuity is good in the team, and maybe there can be better input into the newer cars so Massa will be comfortable with the compounds.
If he is comfortable he is a very formidable driver, occasionally faster than Alonso i believe, if he is 100%.
Massa is a much better asset for the long run than Kimi. Kimi and Massa are basically equal in speed, so there's not much more that Kimi can offer besides being less whiny about setups and tyres.
For Sure!!
ringo
 
Joined: 29 Mar 2009

Post Wed Jun 09, 2010 11:14 pm

ringo wrote:The funny thing is that Massa is underrated; for some strange reason. He has finished in the points for every race this year, and hasn't made any mistakes. He is a good driver to keep if Ferrari want to win a constructors.
Not only that, but he is a winning driver and can win again if the car is up to scratch. Any other driver replacing him would be a step backwards, even Kubica.
Massa has what 11 wins and 15 poles?
The man is a very decorated driver, very solid, good for team spirit and good for marketing to south America. :lol:
Ferrari made a good move looking ahead.
Continuity is good in the team, and maybe there can be better input into the newer cars so Massa will be comfortable with the compounds.
If he is comfortable he is a very formidable driver, occasionally faster than Alonso i believe, if he is 100%.
Massa is a much better asset for the long run than Kimi. Kimi and Massa are basically equal in speed, so there's not much more that Kimi can offer besides being less whiny about setups and tyres.



I rate Massa lower than many other top drivers, because when he loses the plot, he really loses the plot. He's the only driver I have seen in modern times forget how to drive an F1 car (Martin Brundle's words not mine) in the wet. Silverstone anyways. I have seen epic mistakes from other drivers, but not spinning over and over in the wet.

When he is on it he is on it though, and that is one of his strengths. His confidence seems to be 'manufactured' if that makes any sense. I thin Schumi for example is naturally confident, but Massa has to find it from somewhere, like previous wins, or Brazilian fans.
Before I do anything I ask myself “Would an idiot do that?” And if the answer is yes, I do not do that thing. - Dwight Schrute
Giblet
 
Joined: 19 Mar 2007
Location: Downtown Canada

Post Wed Jun 09, 2010 11:30 pm

Giblet wrote:I rate Massa lower than many other top drivers, because when he loses the plot, he really loses the plot. He's the only driver I have seen in modern times forget how to drive an F1 car (Martin Brundle's words not mine) in the wet. Silverstone anyways. I have seen epic mistakes from other drivers, but not spinning over and over in the wet.


If I remember rightly, that was the race where Ferrari had the car on a dry set-up and it hosed down? The team messed up there, not the driver. As for Brundle, don't get me started on that has been/never was! Given his high numbers of wins I guess he is suitably placed to judge others that have been more succesful.
andrew
 
Joined: 16 Feb 2010
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland - WhiteBlue Country (not the region)

Post Wed Jun 09, 2010 11:44 pm

ringo wrote:Massa is a much better asset for the long run than Kimi. Kimi and Massa are basically equal in speed, so there's not much more that Kimi can offer besides being less whiny about setups and tyres.


I don´t think so, IMO just a few drivers in the last years are equal or best in speed than Kimi when he did have a car wich liked it, Schumacher in his best times and probably Hamilton now, in Ferrari he never found that car and yet won a WDC over Massa.
The last two years doesn´t matter because Ferrari was working in the contract with Santander and Alonso :mrgreen:
"Why doesn´t someone tell Pedro it´s raining" - Chris Amon, 1000km Brands Hatch, 1970
alberto222mx
 
Joined: 16 May 2010
Location: México, D.F.

Post Wed Jun 09, 2010 11:55 pm

andrew wrote:
Giblet wrote:I rate Massa lower than many other top drivers, because when he loses the plot, he really loses the plot. He's the only driver I have seen in modern times forget how to drive an F1 car (Martin Brundle's words not mine) in the wet. Silverstone anyways. I have seen epic mistakes from other drivers, but not spinning over and over in the wet.


If I remember rightly, that was the race where Ferrari had the car on a dry set-up and it hosed down? The team messed up there, not the driver. As for Brundle, don't get me started on that has been/never was! Given his high numbers of wins I guess he is suitably placed to judge others that have been more succesful.



Well then don't start about Brundle, that is your prerogative. He was Schumis closest rival ever in a team, but you are entitled to your opinions.

His comments about Massa were fair and accurate, whether you like the man or not has no bearing.

Just because his car was not set up for the conditions properly is no excuse to overdrive for said conditions, and spin out over and over. Many other drivers have been in the same position, and not looked like a rookie in their first practice in the rain.

Massa has shown other times where he seems to just not get it. He had a lot more trouble than other drivers adapting to the lack of TC.

His hard work seems to balance his seeming relative lack of natural talent, but that is what I think of Massa, and my opinion has been formed over the years.
Before I do anything I ask myself “Would an idiot do that?” And if the answer is yes, I do not do that thing. - Dwight Schrute
Giblet
 
Joined: 19 Mar 2007
Location: Downtown Canada

Post Wed Jun 09, 2010 11:57 pm

2008 Massa was his strongest showing. Kimi may well be a smidge quicker, sometimes, but he could never blow massa away and never seemed like the dominant driver when he was in ferrari. That team was the best driver pairing i think. Both equally good, and yet never obstructed the other, and very dificult to say who was leading the team.
Any little tincy wincy advantage kimi has in "durability" and no nonsense on the track and speed, is quickly erased when it comes his motivation and leadership skills.
Not a good driver to develope a car that's behind in a championship, and doesn't have the spirit to let the team know there will be better days ahead if they keep pushing.

I never get the impression he had a speed advantage over Massa, at least not like Alonso has it over Massa, or Vettel over Webber, or Lewis over Jenson. Kimi's best days were at Mclaren.
For Sure!!
ringo
 
Joined: 29 Mar 2009

Post Thu Jun 10, 2010 12:01 am

I agree that Massa has to be hypnotized or coached into being a top qualifier, an agressive driver or a race winner.
He's like a text book driver, but the talent is there. As long as ferrari can flatter him, calling him baby and what not; they can extract the best out of him.
For Sure!!
ringo
 
Joined: 29 Mar 2009

Post Thu Jun 10, 2010 5:48 am

ringo wrote:
I never get the impression he had a speed advantage over Massa, at least not like Alonso has it over Massa, or Vettel over Webber, or Lewis over Jenson. Kimi's best days were at Mclaren.


Wait wait wait... Webber has how many points compared to Vettel this year?

and don't get me wrong, I'm a Vettel fan I just think they're alot more equal this year than the last.
megz
 
Joined: 14 Mar 2007
Location: New Zealand

Post Thu Jun 10, 2010 6:23 am

I don't think Ringo was talking about points. What gives me that impression is that he said Raikkonen's best days were at McLaren, but only until he went to Ferrari did he win a championship. So even though he got the most points in 2007, according to Ringo he was better in previous seasons.
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mx_tifoso
 
Joined: 30 Nov 2006
Location: North America

Post Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:44 am

Giblet wrote:
doopie2you wrote:Damn Webber stays at RBR :lol:

If i were RBR i wouldn't had signed him, he is so old. And can't overtake [-X



He is only three years older than Raikkonen, I wonder what your cutoff for 'old' is. 32?


He looks old :oops: :lol:
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doopie2you
 
Joined: 26 Feb 2010
Location: Zuid-Holland

Post Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:29 pm

mx_tifosi wrote:I don't think Ringo was talking about points. What gives me that impression is that he said Raikkonen's best days were at McLaren, but only until he went to Ferrari did he win a championship. So even though he got the most points in 2007, according to Ringo he was better in previous seasons.


I'd be tempted to agree with that, Kimi didn't seem to have the same fight in him for most of his Ferrari days except in his string of podiums in '09, Spa '08 and his fightback in '07 for the title. In almost all of '03, '04 and '05 he was running the McLaren to the ragged edge and beyond, unfortunately the car didn't handle it so well at times.
megz
 
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Location: New Zealand

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