Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

[archiebald]

Just this photo on the Autocar webstie.

Can someone tell me why Hamiltons front wheels are hardly turned?

Obviously I can't be certain, but I'd go with it being because his wheel is planted flat against Massa's sidepod. More lock would require the back of the wheel next to Massa to move out more, which it can't do because there's no space.

Yep, totally agree. The force of the Ferrari's sidepod is preventing Hamilton's wheel getting to full lock.

Massa's wheels are actually being pushed onto full lock by the sideways force acting on it.

As a result, the incident ended up looking a lot worse than it really was as the McLaren simply couldn't turn away from the Ferrari.

If Massa hadn't binned it by himself in the tunnel a few seconds later, then there would probably have been no penalty.

[Shrieker]

@Giblet,

LOL. Great post priceless man !

Anyone notice the big chunk thats missing from Massa's nosecone?That sure isnt caused by Hamilton...

How... DARE YOU !?! IT WAS OBVIOUSLY LH WHO DROVE INTO HIS NOSECONE !!!




One last word about the incident with PM. After watching the replays, Martin Brundle offers a different opinion:

Having seen further footage not available to me in commentary, I do think that Lewis was treated harshly in the incident involving Pastor Maldonado, although that penalty didn't affect his sixth place. He was all over the back of Maldonado's weaving Williams down the pit straight and he should not have been surprised to have Hamilton moving alongside him into the corner. He should have left more space or covered the inside better. I would not have penalised Lewis in this incident.

[ringo]

Why am I not surprised.

The truth only comes out when everyone has got their pound of flesh.

Things go back to civility until the hater hormones build up again next month.

[Ciro Pabón]

... Things go back to civility until the hater hormones build up again next month.

I think this deserves a response. You're implying that people here hates your idol and, besides, they do it because of their hormones.

I think sometimes people forget where they are writing. This is not Pitpass, we're friends here, united by a common interest.

I must hate Hamilton too, don't I?

Besides, as all hysterics around the site, I must have my PMS working against the feeble neurons in my hating brain.

Thanks, man. You're very kind.

It's not my best judgement, it's my cruel heart talking against Hamilton, filled with envy, isn't it, Ringo? You don't have to answer me, why should you?

If the testosterone (hopefully, it could be my estrogen) takes me to hate, why should you feed me, the troll?

After all, if I'm sooo wrong, it must be my dark, hate filled soul.

After all, we all know I'm not interested in racing, I come here with the sole purpose of ruining your day, don't I?

I wonder why should you read what I write, much less have the kindness to respond. What can you say to a hysteric?

Oh, c'mon, how lame is that position?

Can't you see it is the same Ham does? He offends people, then he implies they did not understand him. It's not his fault, people did not understood him!

What would you think if I said that you hate Maldonado? How would you feel if I implied that Hamilton, the proud black successful man is playing his racist card too?

Does Ham...?

Actually, do you hate latinamericans? I see you hate Massa, too.

C'mon, let's both of us confess our hate... How is your progesterone today? Can you write coherent sentences this time of the month?

(as you can see, by this little sample of counterargument, this will lead us to a very rational discussion, wouldn't it?).

Do all critics hate you, Ringo? Then you have a problem.

Anywat, let me make clear that I think the forum standards for respect have reached a low point since I left moderation. I must be saying that because I hate the forum, don't you think?

[ringo]

Well ciro you wasted you energy typing that, and i wont read all of it, because i was refering to Brundle, who retracted his original statement.

anyway here's another angle of the massa weaving.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ed8zaLh2 ... detailpage[/youtube]

[Ciro Pabón]

I don't waste my energy. I don't expect you to read it, much less to respond, but other people will.

They might respond to the way we try to keep arguments around the site.

You won't, apparently, because my point did not reach you.

We don't accuse people of being stupid as an argument. Or, at least, we learn quickly that in this site, when you do that, you get an answer.

[Caito]

About the video, massa turns earlier than all other cars, anyway, it'd be gifting the position if he left space for ham to go in, he had the apex in the next one, there was no need to close so bad to ham. both lost. As always, it's very easy to talk sitting in a couch.


ANother point about the video. You can clearly hear the tires squeal, which I love. Why can't I hear that on the tv broadcast?

[ringo]

I am a Maldonado fan, as i live in the latin american region. But i guess the islands aren't latin enough eh??

Massa moved twice. And the guy is simply a stumbling block. The FIA needs to have a word with him.
He will do that throughout the year to Hamilton or Button specifically.
You can accuse me of hating the guy, or having a Hatamine imbalance, but Massa is trouble and he's got an ax to grind from 2008 Brazil.

[ringo]

I don't waste my energy. I don't expect you to read it, much less to respond, but other people will.

They might respond to the way we try to keep arguments around the site.

You won't, apparently, because my point did not reach you.

We don't accuse people of being stupid as an argument. Or, at least, we learn quickly that in this site, when you do that, you get an answer.

I read it but never took it personally, why?

Your perception of my post caused the inception of your post.

Your perception was wrong.

So it follows that whatever points you make in that post would not have been made if you made the correct presumption.

I don't make underhanded attacks. I think massa is a pain in the butt.
And i think sometimes you purposely release some steam on Hamilton for kicks.

I don't have to hide that in a post to tell you that.

The use of the word hater is not understood by most. It's a form of motivation for the victim or accuser and that's what most people don't know.
They think it flat out means they are being accused of Hating someone's guts. That is not the case.
A critic can be called a hater for no other reason but to motivate and build confidence of the hatee.

[Jeffsvilleusa]

...I think sometimes people forget where they are writing. This is not Pitpass, we're friends here, united by a common interest.
...

Can't this be classified as hating?

In reality, we're all pretty much strangers on the internet- if some migrated to F1 technical for one reason or another, it's no reason to dis another site- we're all part of the internet-community and F1-fan-community.

I only say this because I respect your point of view.

[andartop]

Problem with HAM is not only is he black, but he also has a record. Now, if he was also muslim, communist, gay and vegetarian, he would easily be the most hated driver in Formula 1 history.

F1 drivers are so lucky, they can have their race, get their money, do their antics, then concentrate on the next race reassured in the knowledge that hordes of fans and anti-fans will be arguing back and forth on the forums of the modern day High Court of Honour (internet) for weeks to defend their dignity, until the truth shines (ha!) or until they get bored.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

...I think sometimes people forget where they are writing. This is not Pitpass, we're friends here, united by a common interest.
...

Can't this be classified as hating?

I get Ciro's point here. Pitpass is there to ruffle feathers and invoke reaction, its sensationalist media disguised as factually correct information. Thats not hating, its calling a spade, a spade.

I'm guilty of over reacting at times, as we all can be. But arent we all aiming to learn from this site? I would say yes.
If our heroes fall below a certain standard is it a reflection of us? Of course not.
But if they fall below that standard, and there is a blind defense to what has actually happened then one teeters on the brink of not wanting to learn.

[Mandrake]

Don't worry.

Your going to forget it by next week, and your going to be a big Hamilton fan again.

You can't fight it.

I'm gonna be his biggest fan the moment he crashes into the wall of champions as he tries to stay with Vettel and Button, both lapping faster than him!

[Mr Alcatraz]

...I think sometimes people forget where they are writing. This is not Pitpass, we're friends here, united by a common interest.
...

Can't this be classified as hating?

I get Ciro's point here. Pitpass is there to ruffle feathers and invoke reaction, its sensationalist media disguised as factually correct information. Thats not hating, its calling a spade, a spade.

I'm guilty of over reacting at times, as we all can be. But arent we all aiming to learn from this site? I would say yes.
If our heroes fall below a certain standard is it a reflection of us? Of course not.

But if they fall below that standard, and there is a blind defense to what has actually happened then one teeters on the brink of not wanting to learn.

I do think the issues are exacerbated by Monaco having always (in the modern era) been an accident waiting to happen compared to every other track, especially the Tilkedromes. And for as long as I've been watching F1 it's been a pretty good bet that the first car through the first corner has a much higher probability to win than at any other venue and exponentially . This coupled with the teams other than Red Bull that consider themselves still in the fight really needing to beat Vettel here really adding to the expectations and angst. This season with DRS and Pirelli's suggested that passing was of a much higher probability than any time in the recent past. I posted right after the race that finishing p6 after having to start p9 @ Monaco as LH did was not a catastrophe! Other than the red flag 6 laps to go I was watching the most entertaining Monaco dry weather GP in a while. It exceeded my expectations.
There are a lot of inequities in F1 especially the way penalty applications have always been a little “nebulous” to put it kindly. With a guy that charges like Hamilton there was bound to be some contact. It’s just the nature of the track, and I might add that having several rookies in the field had to be considered a factor as well.
This forum has pretty much fallen along party lines as to whose fault they were. But Ciro makes a very good point. We members should hold ourselves to a higher standard when discussing specific incidents. The insults posted after this race broke new ground for the amount of this rude behavior on F1T forum IMO since I've been participating.

[andrew]

Having seen further footage not available to me in commentary, I do think that Lewis was treated harshly in the incident involving Pastor Maldonado, although that penalty didn't affect his sixth place. He was all over the back of Maldonado's weaving Williams down the pit straight and he should not have been surprised to have Hamilton moving alongside him into the corner. He should have left more space or covered the inside better. I would not have penalised Lewis in this incident.

Oh there's a surprise. I mentioned the usual bias of the British pundits and was binned for it. Looks like I was right again.

Brundle is wrong in my opinion. What he is basically saying is that Maldonado should have jumped out of the way becayse Hamilton was behind him. I forgot about Hamilton's God given right to be infornt of everyone. How could I have missed that in the official rules?!

Having read pages and pages of opinions on various sites nothing can convince me that this incident was the fault of anyone other than Hamilton.