2012 Canadian GP - Gilles Villeneuve

[raymondu999]

Right. Bhallg2k, regardless of the relevance to this current debate then - I'd just like you to answer two simple questions.

Would you agree, that Alonso's pace (not relative pace - but his ultimate pace - his laptime) had a gradual, consistent decline? Yes, or no?

Then moving on to part B of the question - would you say that the pace dropoff entered into a more predictable pattern, or would you say it was a very unpredictable, unruly pattern?

[Cam]

LOL... it's like watching Ma and Pa trying to sort out the domestic chores. And I thought I was contentious.

It's quite clear that the term 'cliff' is used in direct correlation to the performance of the 2012 tyres, that is, the point at where the tyres go off (the tyres are good, the tyres are good, the tyres are good, cliff, the tyres are not as good). To what degree the tyres are not as good can be debated, but the term 'cliff' is what is used to describe that moment of change. To use the term 'cliff' in any other form or factor while discussing F1, is to intentionally confuse an already confusing issue.

Alonsos tyres hit the cliff. His tyre performance and subsequent race and lap performance went south.

Ferrari screwed up.

Whether you look at his times to another driver or not, his tyres passed the point of being good and became not so good very rapidly. There was no going back.

Now kiss and make up you two.

[richard_leeds]

Unfortunately in an devastating accident of sensibility some posts were tragically lost to this thread after they fell off a cliff... or was it a slope.. or maybe a plateau. Is it possible to fall off a plateau?

So Tomba Productions have lovingly recreated the lost posts in the form of an allegory. Starring Tomba as King Arthur, MX-Tifosi as Squire, and Mr Leeds as the coconut shells. Members of the forum kindly played the part of the warring knights.

[raymondu999]

[i]Unfortunately in an devastating accident of sensibility some posts were tragically lost to this thread after they fell off a cliff... or was it a slope.. or maybe a plateau. Is it possible to fall off a plateau?

Perhaps the posts fell off the cliff of the Pirelli moderation?

[n smikle]

Ballzebub, it wasn't a cliff because the drivers felt a gradual reduction in performance. Remember Hamilton saying, guys my rears are going? If it was cliff, there would be no time to react at all.. it would be BAM! no grip!

[GrizzleBoy]

Ballzebub, it wasn't a cliff because the drivers felt a gradual reduction in performance. Remember Hamilton saying, guys my rears are going? If it was cliff, there would be no time to react at all.. it would be BAM! no grip!

Well funny enough, after we heard that message, Alonso was hot on Lewis' tail and almost eating seconds out of his lap times just before he scrambled into the pits.

[raymondu999]

Yes - we've established that his rears were going... Which is what n_smikle said.

[myurr]

Ballzebub, it wasn't a cliff because the drivers felt a gradual reduction in performance. Remember Hamilton saying, guys my rears are going? If it was cliff, there would be no time to react at all.. it would be BAM! no grip!

Well funny enough, after we heard that message, Alonso was hot on Lewis' tail and almost eating seconds out of his lap times just before he scrambled into the pits.

Lewis actually lost about 2 seconds of his lead due to traffic. He struggled to pull away again after that but build the lead up again by a little bit before starting to slip back towards Alonso and then pitting immediately.

[ironrose]

Hi ... I am new to this forum, however I got a doubt after looking at the race edit for canada on the official formula 1 website... it appears that Vettel has opened his DRS in the last corner coming off the wall of champions during the race and when he was behind hamilton ... shouldnt he be penalised for using the DRS in a non DRS location in the race ??????

[raymondu999]

There are times when FOM indulges in shots from practice to make their race edits look pretty. That has happened many times before.

[ironrose]

But he closed it immediately pulling off from the corner.. sort of an ooooops moment.. if that was a shot from practice, he would have had it open through the start finish straight...

[raymondu999]

It could still happen. Look at Monaco 2011 and Monza 2011 race edits. There's a shot of a McLaren opening it up in each vid. I think it was Lewis in Monza and Button in Monaco

[Nando]

It could still happen. Look at Monaco 2011 and Monza 2011 race edits. There's a shot of a McLaren opening it up in each vid. I think it was Lewis in Monza and Button in Monaco

Yea i remember that, it was at Casino just before the downhill section. Not in a DRS zone but it was from a practice session i believe.

[raymondu999]

Yea. I'm just saying the race edits arent necessarily from the race

[Nando]

Yea. I'm just saying the race edits arent necessarily from the race

I am too, i actually just confirmed what you said.