2012 Hungarian GP - Hungaroring

[SiLo]

Only just got to watch Hamiltons pole lap. Did anyone else think it was really scruffy? Loads of oversteer moments, missing apex's... And still almost 1/2 a second faster than anyone else. Scary.

[Nando]

3 small oversteer moments but nothing crazy. Possibly lost the most time in the highspeed right hander.
But he absolutely hooked most exits like nothing else, especially the last two corners.

One turn he runs very wide as well but you can do that there without losing time. I believe there are some bumps at the apex that can and probably will upset the car.

[simieski]

Thanks for the quote. Shame people slammed the Merc team for letting Schumacher down when in fact it was a mistake by Koabayashi.

I don't think it was kobayashi who turned his engine off

With ref to the eng overheat...
Considering that Schumacher was one of the last drivers on the grid this lends itself to a car issue or either an improper parade lap in car procedure causing the overheat.

He turned off his engine coz of over heating

Of course. What did I say that suggested anything else?

[richard_leeds]

Have you read the previous posts?

He turned the engine off because that was the routine in the old days.

[Pup]

Were aborted starts once routine?

Actually, when were the rules different from today? Maybe I'm too young or stupid, but I don't remember aborted starts ever being treated differently. Red flagged starts, sure, but that's different.

[siskue2005]

Previosly aborted starts were like delayed starts, the mechanics would come and put tyre warmer etc etc, now its just straight away to another formation lap
The rule AFAIK was changed from 2007? 2008 ? somewhere around that time

youtube search for 1998 suzuka race start

[simieski]

Have you read the previous posts?

He turned the engine off because that was the routine in the old days.

It was a combination of two issues is why he turned the engine off. Yes it used to be standard procedure but he was also aware of an engine overheat condition. But I was asking what would have caused the overheat, it can't have been excessive time on the grid as he was one of the last to arrive, so suggests a car cooling issue or a flawed or improperly carried out parade lap procedure.

[siskue2005]

that sand and dirt from quly maybe?

[n smikle]

Only just got to watch Hamiltons pole lap. Did anyone else think it was really scruffy? Loads of oversteer moments, missing apex's... And still almost 1/2 a second faster than anyone else. Scary.

It's Hungary that's why.

Mark Webber gave us a small lecture on how difficult is to consistently string together a single lap of the Hungary track. He said it is extremely rare that anyone get's all the turn right. The track is just that difficult to perfect.

[GrizzleBoy]

Only just got to watch Hamiltons pole lap. Did anyone else think it was really scruffy? Loads of oversteer moments, missing apex's... And still almost 1/2 a second faster than anyone else. Scary.

He was actually quite messy looking all weekend, but that messyness was probably due to him pushing the car the way it needed to be pushed.

After the race, he talked about how the car changed characteristics through the race, he had to start using the steering wheel to induce over steer.

The car actually looked very rear heavy to me. Traction on slow corner exit was very bumpy and the fronts seemed to skip across the track under traction.

Through fast corners that didn't require much steering input, it was very planted but when the sharper fast turns of 10 to 13 came up, he threw the car in and it slid just as much as it needed to.

My theory is that is why Jenson cant find his "perfect setup" answer. It seems it requires driver input to balance the cars handling characteristics on track, rather than the mechanics.

[Ral]

I think he was saying the car started off with understeer and as the race progressed, he needed to induce understeer. It confused me, as I'm not entirely sure why someone would want to induce understeer, certainly if that someone is Hamilton. But perhaps the long corners require a setup that felt like it caused understeer in the shorter ones?

[GrizzleBoy]

I think he was saying the car started off with understeer and as the race progressed, he needed to induce understeer. It confused me, as I'm not entirely sure why someone would want to induce understeer, certainly if that someone is Hamilton. But perhaps the long corners require a setup that felt like it caused understeer in the shorter ones?

You cant really induce under steer. The car either turns in or it doesn't. Deciding to make a car under steer is basically just not turning the car in properly.

I'm quite sure it was over steer he said he had to create.

Less weight on the car with less fuel + moving from soft to medium tyres = less weight pushing the car into the track and less mechanical grip from the tyres through corners. All of which contributes to under steer, especially on such a tight front end.

[Redragon]

Shumacher not only switched off his engine, apparently he position himself on place back.
Not giving enough space for the 22 cars, that's why the position lap was repeated.
Or at least it is was saying the spanish press.
So shumacher mistake all from begining

[raymondu999]

You cant really induce under steer. The car either turns in or it doesn't. Deciding to make a car under steer is basically just not turning the car in properly.

You could, to an extent.

Try underspeeding on entry, then going on power very gradually through (not out of) the corner. The squatting will shift vertical load rearwards and away from the fronts. That's one of the reasons why generally you dont see oversteery moments through long flat out corners (think Blanchimont/130R) in the dry

Looking at his pole lap, he had several oversteer moments, but no obvious understeer. It could be that he was throwing the rear too much, and tried to use the stability of understeer to protect the rear from sliding. It would certainly tally with him turning on the wet/intermediate engine map to protect the rears under traction

[siskue2005]

Shumacher not only switched off his engine, apparently he position himself on place back.
Not giving enough space for the 22 cars, that's why the position lap was repeated.
Or at least it is was saying the spanish press.
So shumacher mistake all from begining

http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=13188&start=675