2012 Hungarian GP - Hungaroring

[Nando]

You can induce understeer with the help of the diff.

You can make the car "push" on off throttle instead of "pulling" you.
Meaning you can decide the radius of the corner on no throttle simply by playing with the diff.
(assuming you have a fixed lock on the wheel as well)

[raymondu999]

Yep setup helps too, but I was talking more in terms of driving technique

[Cam]

Regarding Shumi's start incident - where he was pushed off the grid into the pits:

41.5 Cars may not enter the pit lane when the race is suspended. A penalty under Article 16.3(a) will be imposed on any driver who enters the pit lane or whose car is pushed from the grid to the pit lane after the race has been suspended.

Was he given a penalty of any kind?? I don't recall seeing one.

[Ral]

Race wasn't suspended so I don't think that article applies.

And they had no choice as obviously he couldn't just turn the ignition key to start the car again. The fact that he had to wait for the whole field to go past the pit exit before he was allowed to leave, was probably penalty enough.

[Dragonfly]

Regarding Shumi's start incident - where he was pushed off the grid into the pits:

41.5 Cars may not enter the pit lane when the race is suspended. A penalty under Article 16.3(a) will be imposed on any driver who enters the pit lane or whose car is pushed from the grid to the pit lane after the race has been suspended.

Was he given a penalty of any kind?? I don't recall seeing one.

If I could I'd downvoted on this post.

[Cam]

Race wasn't suspended so I don't think that article applies.

And they had no choice as obviously he couldn't just turn the ignition key to start the car again. The fact that he had to wait for the whole field to go past the pit exit before he was allowed to leave, was probably penalty enough.

Ahh, so it falls under this?

38.11 If, after returning to the starting grid at the end of the formation lap a problem arises, the following procedures shall apply :
a) If a car develops a problem that could endanger the start the driver must immediately raise his hands above his head and the marshal responsible for that row must immediately wave a yellow flag. If the race director decides the start should be delayed the green lights will be illuminated two seconds after the abort lights are switched on, a board saying “EXTRA FORMATION LAP” will be displayed and all cars able to do so must complete a further formation lap whilst the car which developed the problem is moved into the pit lane.

If I could I'd downvoted on this post.

Apologies for asking a legitimate question for which I required a valid answer, what was I thinking . Instead of denigrating it, you might have helped by giving me the correct answer, then I might have given you a +1.

[zyphro]

Ahh, so it falls under this?

38.11 If, after returning to the starting grid at the end of the formation lap a problem arises, the following procedures shall apply :
a) If a car develops a problem that could endanger the start the driver must immediately raise his hands above his head and the marshal responsible for that row must immediately wave a yellow flag. If the race director decides the start should be delayed the green lights will be illuminated two seconds after the abort lights are switched on, a board saying “EXTRA FORMATION LAP” will be displayed and all cars able to do so must complete a further formation lap whilst the car which developed the problem is moved into the pit lane.

Yes.

[n smikle]

Yep setup helps too, but I was talking more in terms of driving technique

Understeer is less sliding, so it should conserves tyres I think. Maybe Hamilton was purposely turning with larger radii, braking earlier and going on the power early to "induce" under-steer. Yeah that's right, I think Hamilton said that the Lotus's were braking much much later than him too.

As for the scruffy lap, as Webber said in his RedBull video, the corners come at you very fast in Hungary and the track is littered with bumps, so a fast lap is going to look very scruffy, the complete opposite of a place like Spa.

[raymondu999]

Understeer is less sliding

less sliding - at the rear. But the fronts are sliding more.

Maybe Hamilton was purposely turning with larger radii

Possibly - but then again I've also heard that these Pirellis like corners to be shorter - ie a late-apex line puts less thermal into them than the Jenson-type semicircular line.

As for the scruffy lap, as Webber said in his RedBull video, the corners come at you very fast in Hungary and the track is littered with bumps, so a fast lap is going to look very scruffy, the complete opposite of a place like Spa.

I think it's also to do with the fact that S2 is all direction change with need for a strong front, whilst Sectors 1 and 3 need less of that - the setup will inherently be compromised in some fashion. Brundle mentioned in Hungary 2011 qualifying that some drivers, around Hungary and street circuits, like to run the front end very strong - basically "get it to the apex, and sort the rest out later" as he puts it.

Here's Hamilton explaining his own pole lap btw:

[beelsebob]

Understeer is less sliding

less sliding - at the rear. But the fronts are sliding more.

Maybe Hamilton was purposely turning with larger radii

Possibly - but then again I've also heard that these Pirellis like corners to be shorter - ie a late-apex line puts less thermal into them than the Jenson-type semicircular line.

I had put this down to what various drivers had said about them not liking both lateral and longitudinal loads at the same time... You can't break and turn on them, and you can't accelerate and turn on them, so going deep into the corner, turning it quickly, and then powering out of it past a late apex meant that you took an optimal line to separate the breaking, turning and accelerating out.

[Hail22]

[Nando]

According to Autosport magazine Schumi overshot his own pit box so he had the rear tires where the front tires usually stay.
Funnily enough they never mention Kobayashi in it.

Also just realized RBR dominated the sector times in Hungary... Hamilton was nowhere except in the last sector but he was only 5th there i believe.
Bit odd i have to say..

Also noticed Button being close to the top in the speed trap but Hamilton was nowhere to be seen.
They must have been running vastly different setups on the cars.

[raymondu999]

Also just realized RBR dominated the sector times in Hungary... Hamilton was nowhere except in the last sector but he was only 5th there i believe.
Bit odd i have to say..

Hamilton was quickest in S1 and S3, and 2nd quickest (to Grosjean) in S2 mate. The rb8's in comparison were 3rd, 4th, 7th (Vettel) and 5th, 15th, 2nd (Webber)

Also noticed Button being close to the top in the speed trap but Hamilton was nowhere to be seen.
They must have been running vastly different setups on the cars.

Button did a 302.6kph, Hamilton did 302.3... That's not "vastly different?"

[FLuidd]

That's not "vastly different?"

You keep doing exactly the opposite of your quote.

I say 95 % of people of this forum are idiots and trolls that will beat you with their experience.

[Nando]

Also just realized RBR dominated the sector times in Hungary... Hamilton was nowhere except in the last sector but he was only 5th there i believe.
Bit odd i have to say..

Hamilton was quickest in S1 and S3, and 2nd quickest (to Grosjean) in S2 mate. The rb8's in comparison were 3rd, 4th, 7th (Vettel) and 5th, 15th, 2nd (Webber)

Also noticed Button being close to the top in the speed trap but Hamilton was nowhere to be seen.
They must have been running vastly different setups on the cars.

Button did a 302.6kph, Hamilton did 302.3... That's not "vastly different?"

Must have been race sectors then because Vettel was leading two while Webber had the last one.

Same for the speed traps then. This was from the latest Autosport issue.

Edit: here they are. Never expected to see speed trap figures and sector times from a race...