2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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CHT
CHT
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Joined: 14 Apr 2008, 05:24

Re: 2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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iotar__ wrote:
CHT wrote:I am expecting Vettel and RBR to be back to their dominant self again at SPA and for the rest of the season.
RB's dominance again. Like they were said to be dominant in Hungary and Germany? RB was only dominant at one full race - Malaysia, at the height of anti-tyre propaganda. BTW it's funny and depressing at the same time, after Hamilton's win predictably enough no one's worried about not pushing 100% any more :lol: . Bahrain - no, Canada almost, hard to say with wet/drying track qualifying.

If you think that's how the rest of the season is going to look, I disagree. They are favourites for wins in majority of the remaining races. Nothing new considering the car, biggest resources for development and tyres, no dominance however. We've got three odd ones now, then Korea (and Japan) - if RB 'dominates' there - game over.

I'm not sold on Mercedes' race pace based on Hungary alone. OK, they were fast in Malaysia/Silverstone but with many different tracks and conditions I have doubts. I hope they are strong, it should be interesting especially with Rosberg.

About Spa - RB might win but it should be close. I would favour Mercedes but: see above about their race pace.
It happen same time last year, so its not surprising they are doing it again.

SamH123
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Joined: 12 May 2012, 12:18

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The most intriguing thing about the weekend for me was the dry Q2 session (I just watched it back on the mobile app)

Vettel was basically lapping at the same time as Alonso/Raikonnen but did not seem to have a 1 lap pace advantage over them. You can't assume any sandbagging what with the cutoff mark for Q3 only being a few tenths slower and although it is a short session, Vettel did do a couple of consistent (IMO 'representative') laps.
Merc did not look there over 1 lap either, Rosberg got up to 3rd but his lap was perfectly timed as I think he was the last one over the line (track was still drying a bit)

I wonder what would have happened in a dry Q3... it looked like Lotus/Ferrari did have a real shot

It seems strange considering how quick Vettel was in the race though

GrizzleBoy
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Joined: 05 Mar 2012, 04:06

Re: 2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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gandharva wrote:Slightly OffTopic but well worth it imo. :D

http://img4.auto-motor-und-sport.de/Gir ... 713045.jpg
Needs more meat.

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Shrieker
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Joined: 01 Mar 2010, 23:41

Re: 2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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On a second thought, Merc's Eau Rogue exit speed was slow because the plank was scraping the track more than others, result of extra downforce being carried. Now that makes sense. Especially coupled with Hamilton's sector 2 performance in q3.
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sennafan24
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Joined: 09 Jul 2013, 17:36

Re: 2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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GrizzleBoy wrote:
gandharva wrote:Slightly OffTopic but well worth it imo. :D

http://img4.auto-motor-und-sport.de/Gir ... 713045.jpg
Needs more meat.
The women?

No way man, slim is where it is at!

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raymondu999
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Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 07:31

Re: 2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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Shrieker wrote:On a second thought, Merc's Eau Rogue exit speed was slow because the plank was scraping the track more than others, result of extra downforce being carried. Now that makes sense. Especially coupled with Hamilton's sector 2 performance in q3.
I don't think the plank was the cause, but I do agree that the speed loss was more down to tyre scrub
失败者找理由,成功者找方法

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iotar__
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Joined: 28 Sep 2012, 12:31

Re: 2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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CHT wrote:
iotar__ wrote:
CHT wrote:I am expecting Vettel and RBR to be back to their dominant self again at SPA and for the rest of the season.
RB's dominance again. Like they were said to be dominant in Hungary and Germany? RB was only dominant at one full race - Malaysia, at the height of anti-tyre propaganda. BTW it's funny and depressing at the same time, after Hamilton's win predictably enough no one's worried about not pushing 100% any more :lol: . Bahrain - no, Canada almost, hard to say with wet/drying track qualifying.

If you think that's how the rest of the season is going to look, I disagree. They are favourites for wins in majority of the remaining races. Nothing new considering the car, biggest resources for development and tyres, no dominance however. We've got three odd ones now, then Korea (and Japan) - if RB 'dominates' there - game over.

I'm not sold on Mercedes' race pace based on Hungary alone. OK, they were fast in Malaysia/Silverstone but with many different tracks and conditions I have doubts. I hope they are strong, it should be interesting especially with Rosberg.

About Spa - RB might win but it should be close. I would favour Mercedes but: see above about their race pace.
It happen same time last year, so its not surprising they are doing it again.
I have to admit: they did dominate. Maybe if Alonso started higher and Hamilton didn't lose position it could have been mildly interesting but with overtaking possible it wouldn't have mattered anyway.

On an unrelated subject of things that can't be true but are: Horner says they need to address Webber's clutch problems. Yes, they will do that and solve his KERS problems in 2014, or in any race he starts five positions behind Vettel and is not WDC contender. Where's genius Newey when you need him? Afterall Horner hid and sent him instead to drivers after race in Malaysia, cringe inducing but very telling sight when it comes to team dynamic, awkward "casual" chat and pretending that nothing's happened.

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SectorOne
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Re: 2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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Shrieker wrote:On a second thought, Merc's Eau Rogue exit speed was slow because the plank was scraping the track more than others, result of extra downforce being carried. Now that makes sense. Especially coupled with Hamilton's sector 2 performance in q3.
I think what really made the difference was nothing on the Mercedes car but rather the ridiculous accelleration of the Red Bull.
He could have nailed Eau Rouge the best he´s ever done, Vettel would have still sailed past him with no problems at all.
"If the only thing keeping a person decent is the expectation of divine reward, then brother that person is a piece of sh*t"

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Juzh
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Joined: 06 Oct 2012, 08:45

Re: 2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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Shrieker wrote:On a second thought, Merc's Eau Rogue exit speed was slow because the plank was scraping the track more than others, result of extra downforce being carried. Now that makes sense. Especially coupled with Hamilton's sector 2 performance in q3.
Mercs had noweher near as much downforce as red bull did, prooven by 2nd sector times troughout the race. More wing doesn't stricly mean more downforce.

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turbof1
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Re: 2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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I think it is due ride height and suspension stifness set up. In a wet race you want to keep the car controllable, so you make a softer and higher set up. In the dry that'll cost you, because the diffuser and floor will generate a lot less downforce, while the drag remains the same.
#AeroFrodo

Mandrake
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Joined: 31 May 2010, 01:31

Re: 2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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turbof1 wrote:I think it is due ride height and suspension stifness set up. In a wet race you want to keep the car controllable, so you make a softer and higher set up. In the dry that'll cost you, because the diffuser and floor will generate a lot less downforce, while the drag remains the same.
If the Merc was really set up for wet weather, would you not think that LH would have smashed Vettel in qualy more than he did? Hamilton was the last guy over the line so he had track condition advantage over the RedBulls. That combined with a more wet setup should have meant a larger advantage. Else you would have to admire Vettel for getting his car with a dry set that close to LH.

I think passing LH after Eau Rouge was caused by a heavier Merc (higher fuel consumption), tires not offering the perfect grip for LH and Vettel with all the opposite effects + KERS usage up the hill. Also, his shorter gearing meant he was up to speed that tiny bit earlier than LH.

Through the hole race the Merc did never look as much on rails as in Hungary, I think the tires played a large part in their performance. In Eau Rouge the car looked less agile than the RedBull and Ferrari.

SamH123
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Joined: 12 May 2012, 12:18

Re: 2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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The Mercs weren't far off smashing the RBs in the wet IMO (relative to the Dry anyway).
They looked about a second faster in Q1 than the other teams

Hamilton went incredibly wide in turn 1 on his pole lap and seemed to have a huge advantage in sector 2 that he didn't have in the dry. Rosberg seemed way quicker in Q3 than Hamilton on top of that

Considering it is Red Bull who have taken all the wet poles, it did seem as though the Mercedes had a much wetter setup than the Red Bull

beelsebob
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Joined: 23 Mar 2011, 15:49
Location: Cupertino, California

Re: 2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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SamH123 wrote:The Mercs weren't far off smashing the RBs in the wet IMO (relative to the Dry anyway).
They looked about a second faster in Q1 than the other teams

Hamilton went incredibly wide in turn 1 on his pole lap and seemed to have a huge advantage in sector 2 that he didn't have in the dry. Rosberg seemed way quicker in Q3 than Hamilton on top of that

Considering it is Red Bull who have taken all the wet poles, it did seem as though the Mercedes had a much wetter setup than the Red Bull
Indeed, I believe on a wet circuit, Merc would have destroyed everyone. HAM's pole lap was messy as hell, but still 0.2 seconds faster. I'd bet there was another second in the lap if he'd actually hooked it up

beelsebob
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Joined: 23 Mar 2011, 15:49
Location: Cupertino, California

Re: 2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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So... I know this gets said a lot, and more fool me for not believing people, but wow this track is steep. Seriously, I bet Eau Rouge would have a warning sign on it if it were a normal road.

In fact, screw betting, I just measured it – it's 1 in 3. That's as steep as public roads get!

You really don't notice it on the TV, but the whole track is sloped, and not by insignificant amounts. the run down into Pouhon is pretty steep too.

Mandrake
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Joined: 31 May 2010, 01:31

Re: 2013 Belgian GP - Spa

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It's t he same as the Nordschleife. If you drive down towards Breidscheid, into the left over the bridge, all you see out of your window is tarmac. Does not come across like that in any game or TV.

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