Caterham F1 team 2014

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turbof1
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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Force India is probably the best example. Torro Rosso originally got the same chassis and aero as the mother team until it was outlawed.

Maybe there should be a rule that allows a new team to run a customer chassis from a big team for 2 or 3 years, to allow the team in the meanwhile set up a factory and personel.

Back on topic: the investment group claims to have paid Tony and that the latter is fully responsible for the current state of affairs. With just 1 week to go, this looks like a nightmare. Loosing out on the price money will devalue the team further, and whoever gets the team will be left with something almost worthless since the team will most likely be liquified to pay off some of the debts.
#AeroFrodo

ScottB
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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rohit1594 wrote:I wonder just how much serious the owners of teams like Spyker (yes, they did score 1 point in the VERY WET 2007 Japanese GP at Fuji), Virgin, HRT, Caterham (and dare I say, even Marussia?) were about 'competing' in Formula 1 in the first place... By the looks of things, all they wanted to do, was to get media attention along with the big boys and 'pretend' that they belong to the pinnacle of motorsport. Financial issues, little or no development over the course of the season, pay drivers, ugly looking cars has become the hallmark of such teams!

... and in my opinion, it's becoming a bit irritating now! Frankly speaking, the FIA should not allow new teams into Formula 1 unless they have established some kind of a technical tie-up with a top manufacturer. I wonder how Haas F1 will fare...
I think the 3 'new' teams; Campos / HRT, Virgin / Marussia, Lotus / Caterham, all suffered because they came in being sold the line of budget caps coming in, I don't think any of them had the budget to compete in the current set up. Which is much more a black mark against the FIA and the process that brought these three in (along with the stillborn USF1), than on any of these three teams themselves.

HAAS are coming in under no serious discussion of a budget cap, they have big money behind them (Billion Dollar a year business), with a clear goal; the company increased their brand awareness and sales for their automotive tools business through NASCAR, now they want to do the same in global markets which F1 happens to be in. I'd say that's quite a good base, compared to Fernandes coming in with vague dreams of buying Lotus, then trying to turn Caterham into a bigger car company, along with the ridiculous number of other motorsport and business ventures they started up. Marussia were to build a brand for a car company that doesn't really exist anymore, and is basically just a good little racing team, HRT became a mess when VC's thought they might be able to turn a profit and USF1 seemed to have no rationale beyond 'we want an American team because we are America! **** Yeah!'


There's nothing to stop new teams doing better than the last 3, you just either have to have one come in with a realistic budget, and not try and convince them to enter based on rules changes that aren't agreed yet, or you change the rules to give them technical support. I prefer something along the lines of the Force India model, where they had lots of help and personnel from Mclaren to work with, rather than outright buying whole cars myself though...

Of course an actual budget cap and / or the teams getting more of the sports revenues, going to less dodgy places and more big markets (Russia, Azerbaijan? Pricing the sport out of US exposure etc) to attract more sponsors and fans would also help too!

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rohit1594
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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Yes, I would not mind seeing a two-tier F1 Championship within the main series: One for the WDC and constructors championship (e.g. between Mercedes, RB, Williams, Ferrari & McLaren) and the other one between customer teams for the remaining "honour" positions, provided they are competitive enough.

ScottB
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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rohit1594 wrote:Yes, I would not mind seeing a two-tier F1 Championship within the main series: One for the WDC and constructors championship (e.g. between Mercedes, RB, Williams, Ferrari & McLaren) and the other one between customer teams for the remaining "honour" positions, provided they are competitive enough.
I'm not sure that works, had that been the case, in recent years Williams would probably have been finishing behind all the other works teams, and most, if not all of the customers. They could well have given up making their own cars by now, lest they have lost all their sponsorship / good people / good drivers etc.

How would you deal with, for example, next year every customer team would be lining up to buy a Merc car. Can one team be expected to supply have a grid with cars? If not, how do you determine who gets to pick what? Highest bidder just leads to the same situation among the current teams, of most cash wins. Works teams could face big drops in income if they have a desirable car to customers one year, but not the next, etc.

That's why I think having Mclaren / Force India style relationships is best, small teams get to learn while doing, big ones get to train up their more junior engineers etc.

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rohit1594
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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ScottB wrote:
rohit1594 wrote:Yes, I would not mind seeing a two-tier F1 Championship within the main series: One for the WDC and constructors championship (e.g. between Mercedes, RB, Williams, Ferrari & McLaren) and the other one between customer teams for the remaining "honour" positions, provided they are competitive enough.
I'm not sure that works, had that been the case, in recent years Williams would probably have been finishing behind all the other works teams, and most, if not all of the customers.

How would you deal with, for example, next year every customer team would be lining up to buy a Merc car. Can one team be expected to supply have a grid with cars? If not, how do you determine who gets to pick what? Highest bidder just leads to the same situation among the current teams, of most cash wins. Works teams could face big drops in income if they have a desirable car to customers one year, but not the next, etc.

That's why I think having Mclaren / Force India style relationships is best, small teams get to learn while doing, big ones get to train up their more junior engineers etc.
No no, I wasn't suggesting that any one manufacturer supply all the customer cars. My bad! "Technical partnership" is the word I should have used. Like you said, the McLaren & Force India model is the way to go!

ScottB
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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rohit1594 wrote:
ScottB wrote:
rohit1594 wrote:Yes, I would not mind seeing a two-tier F1 Championship within the main series: One for the WDC and constructors championship (e.g. between Mercedes, RB, Williams, Ferrari & McLaren) and the other one between customer teams for the remaining "honour" positions, provided they are competitive enough.
I'm not sure that works, had that been the case, in recent years Williams would probably have been finishing behind all the other works teams, and most, if not all of the customers.

How would you deal with, for example, next year every customer team would be lining up to buy a Merc car. Can one team be expected to supply have a grid with cars? If not, how do you determine who gets to pick what? Highest bidder just leads to the same situation among the current teams, of most cash wins. Works teams could face big drops in income if they have a desirable car to customers one year, but not the next, etc.

That's why I think having Mclaren / Force India style relationships is best, small teams get to learn while doing, big ones get to train up their more junior engineers etc.
No no, I wasn't suggesting that any one manufacturer supply all the customer cars. My bad! "Technical partnership" is the word I should have used. Like you said, the McLaren & Force India model is the way to go!
Ah I see! Yes, I think it works because all teams would still be constructors, even if some are getting a little help along the way...

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rohit1594
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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Precisely!

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Pierce89
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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turbof1 wrote:Force India is probably the best example. Torro Rosso originally got the same chassis and aero as the mother team until it was outlawed.

Maybe there should be a rule that allows a new team to run a customer chassis from a big team for 2 or 3 years, to allow the team in the meanwhile set up a factory and personel.

Back on topic: the investment group claims to have paid Tony and that the latter is fully responsible for the current state of affairs. With just 1 week to go, this looks like a nightmare. Loosing out on the price money will devalue the team further, and whoever gets the team will be left with something almost worthless since the team will most likely be liquified to pay off some of the debts.
Tony Fernandes has really screwed the new owners, from what I've seen. I really actually feel bad for the new investors. I think, what they were "sold" and what they actually received are two very different situations. But then again, they apparently haven't actually received anything yet.
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turbof1
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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Pierce89 wrote:
turbof1 wrote:Force India is probably the best example. Torro Rosso originally got the same chassis and aero as the mother team until it was outlawed.

Maybe there should be a rule that allows a new team to run a customer chassis from a big team for 2 or 3 years, to allow the team in the meanwhile set up a factory and personel.

Back on topic: the investment group claims to have paid Tony and that the latter is fully responsible for the current state of affairs. With just 1 week to go, this looks like a nightmare. Loosing out on the price money will devalue the team further, and whoever gets the team will be left with something almost worthless since the team will most likely be liquified to pay off some of the debts.
Tony Fernandes has really screwed the new owners, from what I've seen. I really actually feel bad for the new investors. I think, what they were "sold" and what they actually received are two very different situations.
I don't know who is exactly at fault. I'm not going to take the word from a mysterious group just for granted. All we know for sure, is that one party is lying, the other party trying to cover his sweet *ss, but most importantly several hundred employees will pay the price by loosing their jobs. Neither Tony Fony or Group Mystique will be concerned about that, but rather who will be held responsible in court and who has to pay off the debts.

Edit: some more information has risen:
http://m.autosport.com/news/report.php/ ... hing-i-can
http://m.autosport.com/news/report.php/ ... rham-buyer

This is very sad. Also, any potentional buyers will be scared off since we have 2 parties claiming ownership, which means selling the team is legally very complicated as of now.

From Kolles comments, the deadline is due saturday to get the cars on the plane.
#AeroFrodo

CHT
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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Here is my guess,

New owner bought the shares from TF and TF quickly washes his hands from the mountain of debt he created.
New owner realize that debt is much bigger than expected and refuses to accept responsibility and TF refuses to transfer the share. Now new owner what to pass the hot potato back to TF.

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matt21
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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The investerors have opted out of 1MRT.
Management of the team is now in the hand of an administrator.

http://www.pitpass.com/52782/Management ... inistrator

I think Caterham F1 has now stopped to exist and we will not see the cars in Austin.

I fear that this is the next step towards "three-cars-per-team"
Last edited by matt21 on 24 Oct 2014, 13:50, edited 1 time in total.

Belatti
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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The future of Caterham was marked when a dentist was appointed to run it. What do you expect? :lol:
TF was not serious anyways, a "newly rich" who thought F1 was just another chance of getting more millionaire :lol:

Im looking foward to read Caterham story in F1 Rejects :P
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321apex
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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"How do you make a small fortune in motor racing?
- Start with a BIG one"

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FW17
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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the team was sold by Fernandes and the new owners would take on the debt. However, Fernandes sees the money that he invested in the team as being a debt to himself, and should be paid back. The new owners feel this was not clear during the sale, and is a substantial amount of money. This has meant that the team's debt is significantly larger than they believed, causing the financial difficulties.

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MOWOG
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Re: Caterham F1 team 2014

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A person who feels he got screwed in a business transaction is generally the same fellow who thought he was screwing the other parties to the transaction at the time the deal went down. #-o
Some men go crazy; some men go slow. Some men go just where they want; some men never go.

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