2016 Sauber F1 Team - Ferrari

[Jolle]

I don't want to be too dark, but if they are late on payments now, at the moment they should invest quite a lot in the development of the 2017 car (the major costs of each new set of rules comes in the year before and you got to have it spot on, else you'll be trailing behind for the whole period of that set of rules), they could be right at the back of the field next year, if they are still in F1...

[FW17]

I have a note saying that things are happening at Sauber, but CEO Monisha Kaltenborn is saying nothing until deals are done. That is the smart way to do deals. My instinct says that a new investor will be taking over Peter Sauber’s shares, but that the deal will mean that the team keeps the same name, which is a good solid F1 brand, with much potential for development. Sauber is a group of companies including an engineering business and the wind tunnel and I see the firm following the route taken by McLaren and Williams to build up engineering businesses to support the F1 team. This is a guess but I don’t see Kaltenborn backing away from the sport any time soon. There is a reason that Peter chose her to lead the company forward and most of that is the fire and the desire to be successful.

[hollus]

I just watched the post-race interview of both Nasr and Ericsson. It's really sad - the team is financially struggling and yet the drivers have no sense to follow a direct team-order that is there to ensure that they better they chances of securing points and positions. This applies to both Ericsson and Nasr. They need to function as a TEAM, if there is any hope of at least reaching their potential and what is realistically achievable.

When your team has recently had 4 drivers under contract and only two seats, well, surprise surprise that beating your teammate takes priority over beating guys in other teams!

[Vasconia]

According to Rafael Lopes, an important brazilian F1 blogger, Marcus Ericson confessed to Monisha that he intentionally crashed into Nasr yesterday. He claims having a " source very close" to Sauber.

Link, in portuguese:

http://globoesporte.globo.com/blogs/esp ... -nasr.html

Nonsense. People who have a blog think they can write whatever they want, just to have more visits. This is annoying.

[Phil]

When your team has recently had 4 drivers under contract and only two seats, well, surprise surprise that beating your teammate takes priority over beating guys in other teams!

I fail to see the point you are making here. Those seats were signed and overbooked, not because they were 'better drivers' but because they brought in more money, and importantly that money was essential to the survival of the team in even making the grid.

We can debate the moral of this part until the sun turns black, but the point I was much rather trying to make is that the survival of this team is dependent on success - success in the maximizing chances, getting to better positions, better standings etc. And this part of success is of up most importance - without it, the team will likely be forced to quit f1 and with that, also the seats of these two drivers. And the attractiveness of these two drivers (to be signed by other teams) is not likely to go up if they collide in just about every race they have a go at each other. And this has happened far too many times so far.

The problem the team is facing is that both drivers are obviously of the opinion that they are crucial of that survival by "paying to drive" (and therefore to some degree they are more customers rather than employees), so do not feel they are obliged to make room. This thinking unfortunately will mean the end, as team-work is absolutely crucial and essential. Given that these two drivers are bringing in quite a bit of money, it's hard to say how much the team can actually force them to comply without upsetting their sponsors. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Very unfortunate situation for all involved.

[hollus]

My point was that both know first hand that the team will give their seats to the next pay driver without hesitation, the team has made that as clear as it can be. In that case, ythe best option for keeping your seat is to make the other guy worse than you, so that when one must go, it is him instead of you. Making both (the team) better is likely to end up in your seat being for sale instead of your team mate's. I agree that they should help the team, but in this particular prisoner's dilemma, the team has made the price to pay for that too high.

[FW17]

My point was that both know first hand that the team will give their seats to the next pay driver without hesitation, the team has made that as clear as it can be. In that case, ythe best option for keeping your seat is to make the other guy worse than you, so that when one must go, it is him instead of you. Making both (the team) better is likely to end up in your seat being for sale instead of your team mate's. I agree that they should help the team, but in this particular prisoner's dilemma, the team has made the price to pay for that too high.

Why does it matter, one who brings more money of the two gets to keep his seat.

[quidam]

Banco do Brazil : 24 millions $

[Manoah2u]

When Nasr goes to Renault next year, he'll take his Banco do Brazil with him and Renault will welcome that money like they welcomed Pastor's money.
That means no Nasr next year @ Sauber (Guaranteed after this incident and the current environment at Sauber, he'll flee fast) and no BdB money.
If Sauber is not bought this year, then at the end of this year, it's all over for the venue.

Regarding the updates, i'm confident Sauber is not spending even a dollar on developing the car as it has no use for the 2017 changes. They'll want to save money
on parts too so destruction derby drivers are not appreciated. The only hope one can have for Sauber is that they're struggeling because they cut their funds with
the intention of using it for a decent 2017 contender, which would make some sense.

however, Kaltenborn has been nothing but a curse and a disease for the once glorious team. What a shame. I still can't see how Peter Sauber has her still running.
She must have done some pretty good contract finelining or she has some other skills. There are plenty far more capable and potential people available or were
available to run the team decently. what a waste.

[Phil]

however, Kaltenborn has been nothing but a curse and a disease for the once glorious team. What a shame. I still can't see how Peter Sauber has her still running.
She must have done some pretty good contract finelining or she has some other skills. There are plenty far more capable and potential people available or were vailable to run the team decently. what a waste.

Who? David Copperfield? Any other magician? You? I honestly don't get the hate Kaltenborn gets - she is in an incredibly difficult situation limited by the means available. Who could do better with the current situation? Unless that person also has a tree growing money or some kind of magic sponsorship backing, I really fail to see who the armchair expert suggests would be far more capable for the job at hand.

[Sniffit]

When Nasr goes to Renault next year, he'll take his Banco do Brazil with him and Renault will welcome that money like they welcomed Pastor's money.

Not a chance, Nasr has had a misserable season so far being out qualified and out raced by his team mate. There is no way Renault would waste time with him when they have promising drivers in the pipeline/championship, after all a Renault works team has a vastly different set of requirements then a cash-strapped Lotus one.

[flmkane]

however, Kaltenborn has been nothing but a curse and a disease for the once glorious team. What a shame. I still can't see how Peter Sauber has her still running.
She must have done some pretty good contract finelining or she has some other skills. There are plenty far more capable and potential people available or were vailable to run the team decently. what a waste.

Who? David Copperfield? Any other magician? You? I honestly don't get the hate Kaltenborn gets - she is in an incredibly difficult situation limited by the means available. Who could do better with the current situation? Unless that person also has a tree growing money or some kind of magic sponsorship backing, I really fail to see who the armchair expert suggests would be far more capable for the job at hand.

I mostly agree with you. She is in a difficult place.

However, she deserves the hate. Defrauding Guido Van Der Garde, letting the team get uncompetitive from 2012-2013 and her constant uncompromising whining on media.

[Stalker1]

However, she deserves the hate. Defrauding Guido Van Der Garde, letting the team get uncompetitive from 2012-2013 and her constant uncompromising whining on media.

Saubers upturn in results in seasons 2011-2013 were partially due to their technical director James Key, who joined the team in the end of 2009 and left in February 2012. Later in 2012, he signed contract with Toro Rosso.

[flmkane]

However, she deserves the hate. Defrauding Guido Van Der Garde, letting the team get uncompetitive from 2012-2013 and her constant uncompromising whining on media.

Saubers upturn in results in seasons 2011-2013 were partially due to their technical director James Key, who joined the team in the end of 2009 and left in February 2012. Later in 2012, he signed contract with Toro Rosso.

I knew that. Doesn't make a difference. A team is more than one person. People used to say Williams and McLaren became uncompetitive because Newey left. However, Ferrari, Renault and Mercedes have won without the greatest designer in modern F1.

Its not just about engineering, it's about project management.

[efuloni]

Not a chance, Nasr has had a misserable season so far being out qualified and out raced by his team mate. There is no way Renault would waste time with him when they have promising drivers in the pipeline/championship, after all a Renault works team has a vastly different set of requirements then a cash-strapped Lotus one.

I would not say that so soon. He had a very impressive debut season, really good. And this season he's facing a hard time with the breaks and used an out of date chassis in the first races. Of course he is doing very badly by now and I don't think he can't achieve anything good with his current level of performance, but if he improves just a bit and, may be, grab a point here or there, I believe he might end in Renault, Force India or even Williams. If he continues doing bad, he'll go to Manor.