2017 Sauber F1 Team - Ferrari

[Sevach]

They already have Wehrlein so they have a line with Toto.

Or they go back to Ferrari and offer to take Leclerc.

[GhostF1]

“I want to motivate you so I'll end a contract for a 2018 spec PU and will give you uncertainty in a point of time where you will be starting the design for next year's car"

He literally just said, we'll have a current spec engine... and it won't be a Honda. There is no one with any common sense who think Honda won't be the worst engine next year as well, they aren't going to suddenly hit a home run and everyone else is improving as well.

So either everyone is already thinking oh god, a Honda, why even bother next year we'll be even further back and we won't finish half the races we have done this year... or you tell everyone we won't be in that situation and soon we'll have a 2018 engine from Ferrari or Renault sorted for next year. If anyone can take that as bad news or bad for motivation, wow.

I'm not going to say that isn't a possibility next year, but you've written exactly like anyone else who underestimates their competition, regardless of the current circumstances it's a fools move to guarantee something like that so far off.

[Vasconia]

They've either been able to secure Merc or Ferrari 2018 PU's or AT MINIMAL have the starting of fruitful conversations behind the scenes, or in my opinion they've made a big mistake. We haven't got the full picture, it's starting to get quite late for next years development to begin and now with Honda out, if they have no concrete engine choice in sight, it's looking grim. In light of these events and what Vasseur has said, I expect the Ferrari relationship to continue but they'll move back up to current spec PU's. But they'll need to sort this out fast.

Reading Vasseur´s comments I guess they have an agreement with Ferrari to use a current version of the PU and not an old one.

[etusch]

Motorsports says sauber ferrari deal confirmed. I think Vasseur's first act as sauber boss is wrong. I think he will be like what he was at Renault.

[basti313]

Motorsports says sauber ferrari deal confirmed. I think Vasseur's first act as sauber boss is wrong. I think he will be like what he was at Renault.

Why?
Sauber is funded by sponsors. Sponsors want the car to be driving round the circuit...something a Honda engine contradicts. On the other hand a good Ferrari deal might even end up in competitiveness.

[Sevach]

https://twitter.com/SauberF1Team/status ... 5418060801

[wesley123]

He said to Kravitz that he will make a statement as to what engine they will have before the summer break. So not much more uncertainty to go. Less so than even if they stuck with the Honda deal that's for sure.

Fair enough, let's see what happens. They'd need certainty quick on this part.

Why?
Sauber is funded by sponsors. Sponsors want the car to be driving round the circuit...something a Honda engine contradicts. On the other hand a good Ferrari deal might even end up in competitiveness.

As long as they don't have the funds, they wont be competitive. And with the Honda engine they'll probably get a lot more technical support as it is Honda's wish to make more km's with their engine, which certainly would be an advantage. I don't think Ferrari sends enough support staff to extract the maximum from the engine

[wesley123]

He literally just said, we'll have a current spec engine... and it won't be a Honda. There is no one with any common sense who think Honda won't be the worst engine next year as well, they aren't going to suddenly hit a home run and everyone else is improving as well.

So either everyone is already thinking oh god, a Honda, why even bother next year we'll be even further back and we won't finish half the races we have done this year... or you tell everyone we won't be in that situation and soon we'll have a 2018 engine from Ferrari or Renault sorted for next year. If anyone can take that as bad news or bad for motivation, wow.

Why would it be a guarantee that Honda would be the worst engine? While you're at it, can you tell me what I'll do in 2019?

The problem you are missing is that there is more to running the team than having an engine in the back. Ferrari, Renault and Mercedes have no interest in delivering engines to an extra team, whereas Honda does. This'll mean that they'll probably get a whole lot more technical support than they would get with the other manufacturers.

Sauber isn't very strong financially, and having a Mercedes, Ferrari or Renault engine in the back doesn't change anything to that. They'll receive an engine with which they have little experience, and have to allocate resources to extract the maximum from the engine, resources they do not have to spare. This is a large reason why they picked the 2016 Ferrari engine for this season; Certainty on the engine side, they knew the engine and its performance.

And considering the manufacturers at some point in the future Honda would consider a factory team of their own, which is where Sauber would be very available, which is something that would also benefit Longbow.

Honda would have given them the possibility to take a step forwards, with the other manufacturers they'd just stay in the same position they are in now, where they have literally no chance of being competitive as they dont have the resources to actually do anything.

[Sniffit]

Sauber will continue with Ferrari engines for the 2018 Formula 1 season after the collapse of its Honda deal.

Less than 24 hours after Sauber confirmed it would not be going through with its original plan of switching to Honda, it announced a new deal with current supplier Ferrari.

Sauber has had to use year-old Ferrari engines this season, but its new deal is for latest-specification power units.

Team principal Fred Vasseur said: "I am very pleased to confirm that we will continue to work with Scuderia Ferrari as our engine supplier in form of a multi-year agreement.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.ph ... d-of-honda

[Santozini]

Sauber will continue with Ferrari engines for the 2018 Formula 1 season after the collapse of its Honda deal.

Less than 24 hours after Sauber confirmed it would not be going through with its original plan of switching to Honda, it announced a new deal with current supplier Ferrari.

Sauber has had to use year-old Ferrari engines this season, but its new deal is for latest-specification power units.

Team principal Fred Vasseur said: "I am very pleased to confirm that we will continue to work with Scuderia Ferrari as our engine supplier in form of a multi-year agreement.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.ph ... d-of-honda

Quite a straight forward decision if you ask me.... 2018 Ferrari PU or 2018 Honda PU? Not much to consider

[Sniffit]

Sauber will continue with Ferrari engines for the 2018 Formula 1 season after the collapse of its Honda deal.

Less than 24 hours after Sauber confirmed it would not be going through with its original plan of switching to Honda, it announced a new deal with current supplier Ferrari.

Sauber has had to use year-old Ferrari engines this season, but its new deal is for latest-specification power units.

Team principal Fred Vasseur said: "I am very pleased to confirm that we will continue to work with Scuderia Ferrari as our engine supplier in form of a multi-year agreement.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.ph ... d-of-honda

Quite a straight forward decision if you ask me.... 2018 Ferrari PU or 2018 Honda PU? Not much to consider

I agree, however I can see that Honda has more development potential due to the diminishing returns that the established manufacturers run in to. Also I would haev liked Sauber to run Hona just to get a more diverse field.
But yes, having a latest specc Ferrari Engine is a much safer bet and something the staff at Hinwil deserve.

[RS200E]

He literally just said, we'll have a current spec engine... and it won't be a Honda. There is no one with any common sense who think Honda won't be the worst engine next year as well, they aren't going to suddenly hit a home run and everyone else is improving as well.

So either everyone is already thinking oh god, a Honda, why even bother next year we'll be even further back and we won't finish half the races we have done this year... or you tell everyone we won't be in that situation and soon we'll have a 2018 engine from Ferrari or Renault sorted for next year. If anyone can take that as bad news or bad for motivation, wow.

Why would it be a guarantee that Honda would be the worst engine? While you're at it, can you tell me what I'll do in 2019?

The problem you are missing is that there is more to running the team than having an engine in the back. Ferrari, Renault and Mercedes have no interest in delivering engines to an extra team, whereas Honda does. This'll mean that they'll probably get a whole lot more technical support than they would get with the other manufacturers.

Sauber isn't very strong financially, and having a Mercedes, Ferrari or Renault engine in the back doesn't change anything to that. They'll receive an engine with which they have little experience, and have to allocate resources to extract the maximum from the engine, resources they do not have to spare. This is a large reason why they picked the 2016 Ferrari engine for this season; Certainty on the engine side, they knew the engine and its performance.

And considering the manufacturers at some point in the future Honda would consider a factory team of their own, which is where Sauber would be very available, which is something that would also benefit Longbow.

Honda would have given them the possibility to take a step forwards, with the other manufacturers they'd just stay in the same position they are in now, where they have literally no chance of being competitive as they dont have the resources to actually do anything.

Because IT IS the worst engine.

You looked far too much into it.

[cramr]

...

Sauber isn't very strong financially, and having a Mercedes, Ferrari or Renault engine in the back doesn't change anything to that. They'll receive an engine ....

...

If that isn't strong enough for you I really don't know what it is...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/csylt/2016 ... 91ba27f9b1

[wesley123]

Because IT IS the worst engine.

You looked far too much into it.

It is the worst engine? How can that ever be possible when the 2018 spec PU isn't even built?

Or are you assuming that the 2018 spec Honda PU will be the worst of the field because it is this year?

If that isn't strong enough for you I really don't know what it is...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/csylt/2016 ... 91ba27f9b1

I don't doubt the finances of Longbow, they have more than enough money. But the concern is if they are willing to actually invest in Sauber? Having the money and wanting to spend said money are two very different things. And considering how the owners are an investment firm, which in the end are just looking to make money, I have serious doubts with them actually wanting to cough up the money to be competitive.

[RS200E]

Because IT IS the worst engine.

You looked far too much into it.

It is the worst engine? How can that ever be possible when the 2018 spec PU isn't even built?

Or are you assuming that the 2018 spec Honda PU will be the worst of the field because it is this year?

If that isn't strong enough for you I really don't know what it is...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/csylt/2016 ... 91ba27f9b1

I don't doubt the finances of Longbow, they have more than enough money. But the concern is if they are willing to actually invest in Sauber? Having the money and wanting to spend said money are two very different things. And considering how the owners are an investment firm, which in the end are just looking to make money, I have serious doubts with them actually wanting to cough up the money to be competitive.

It's a safe presumption that it will be. Vasseur made the correct decision.

And Longbow have coughed up the money for 2018 Ferrari engines. I really don't get where you are coming from here. Seems like you're willing to bet on Honda being better than the Ferrari 2018.