Mercedes Power Unit Hardware & Software

[wuzak]

MGU-K needs almost 17 seconds to charge the battery.
If breaking is shorter than 17s, maybe it's beneficial to start harvest a bit sooner

Not sure what your calculations are, but legally the MGUK can only contribute half of the battery's 4MJ.

2MJ/120kW = 16.67s.

[Moose]

The MGUK is deploying 4MJ+ regardless of the harvesting strategy, I wouldn't think that would have a big impact on the unit size.

If you only need to do it to deploy, you have lower cooling requirements. That's pretty significant in the era of "cool all the things".

[sosic2121]

MGU-K needs almost 17 seconds to charge the battery.
If breaking is shorter than 17s, maybe it's beneficial to start harvest a bit sooner

Not sure what your calculations are, but legally the MGUK can only contribute half of the battery's 4MJ.

2MJ/120kW = 16.67s.

I can't find any information on breaking time per lap, but I think there are tracks with less than 16s.

[FW17]

Not sure what your calculations are, but legally the MGUK can only contribute half of the battery's 4MJ.

2MJ/120kW = 16.67s.

I can't find any information on breaking time per lap, but I think there are tracks with less than 16s.

For reference if you like

http://www.brembo.com/en/company/news/f ... 1-gp-spain

[sosic2121]

2MJ/120kW = 16.67s.

I can't find any information on breaking time per lap, but I think there are tracks with less than 16s.

For reference if you like

http://www.brembo.com/en/company/news/f ... 1-gp-spain

So 18% in Spain means 16s max. Not enough.
Tank you for the link

[godlameroso]

Again don't assume they're using 100% harvesting energy, as this introduces oversteer on entry. The MGU-K controller may apply full harvesting at the start of the braking phase, and ramp down slowly as the driver approaches the apex to keep the car stable, mid corner the MGU-K rate will vary, maybe use a little fuel to counteract the oversteer tendency, and keep wheel spin in check by applying negative torque to smooth out power delivery.

I'd say on average the MGU-K harvests at 70-80% of its rated capacity overall per lap, and rarely does it contribute the full 2MJ of energy. The MGU-H is more important than people realize but the fact of the matter is these units are shrouded in just as much secrecy as the engine itself, perhaps more.

At a yearly price of ~€8,000,000 euros for 5 MGU-H units, believe me we're lucky we've seen the casing, let alone know about any of it's inner workings. They'll only get better despite the team lies about it only being worth hundredths of a second per lap to develop them.

[ENGINE TUNER]

Not sure what your calculations are, but legally the MGUK can only contribute half of the battery's 4MJ.

2MJ/120kW = 16.67s.

I can't find any information on breaking time per lap, but I think there are tracks with less than 16s.

Hence lift and coast

[sosic2121]

Again don't assume they're using 100% harvesting energy, as this introduces oversteer on entry. The MGU-K controller may apply full harvesting at the start of the braking phase, and ramp down slowly as the driver approaches the apex to keep the car stable, mid corner the MGU-K rate will vary, maybe use a little fuel to counteract the oversteer tendency, and keep wheel spin in check by applying negative torque to smooth out power delivery.

I'd say on average the MGU-K harvests at 70-80% of its rated capacity overall per lap, and rarely does it contribute the full 2MJ of energy. The MGU-H is more important than people realize but the fact of the matter is these units are shrouded in just as much secrecy as the engine itself, perhaps more.

At a yearly price of ~€8,000,000 euros for 5 MGU-H units, believe me we're lucky we've seen the casing, let alone know about any of it's inner workings. They'll only get better despite the team lies about it only being worth hundredths of a second per lap to develop them.

I agree with you about breaking and about MGU-H.
I also assumed that on most tracks there is not enough breaking to fill battery(2MJ), but I believe that there is performance to be gained by generating at the end of the straights. That might be the reason why Ferrari is losing speed.

Can any energy be harvested from MGU-H during breaking?
I assume teams keep trothlebodies open during breaking and compressor keeps pumping air into the engine. Is this air compressed enough by the engine to keep turbo spinning and eliminate turbo lag? Or maybe compressed so much there is enough energy to harvest?

[PlatinumZealot]

Are you saying that a third of the engine cost is the MUG-H?

[FPV GTHO]

2MJ/120kW = 16.67s.

I can't find any information on breaking time per lap, but I think there are tracks with less than 16s.

Hence lift and coast

How does lift and coast affect the MGUK or braking

[godlameroso]

Are you saying that a third of the engine cost is the MUG-H?

How else will you make an electric motor generator be so small and so powerful, and deal in such a hostile environment of temperature extremes, unless you're using extremely exotic materials and techniques to fabricate them?

[godlameroso]

I can't find any information on breaking time per lap, but I think there are tracks with less than 16s.

Hence lift and coast

How does lift and coast affect the MGUK or braking

By lifting, the mgu-k can harvest a max energy, slow the car down, and then allow the driver to use the brakes for the rest of the braking phase. Mercedes was doing little lift and coast if any this year however.

[FPV GTHO]

I thought lift and coast was just when they're neither braking or accelerating. Hence the coast.

[wuzak]

I thought lift and coast was just when they're neither braking or accelerating. Hence the coast.

Yes, using the aero to slow the car.

But in the current era it would also be used to charge the battery via the MGUK.

[wuzak]

Are you saying that a third of the engine cost is the MUG-H?

How else will you make an electric motor generator be so small and so powerful, and deal in such a hostile environment of temperature extremes, unless you're using extremely exotic materials and techniques to fabricate them?

Volts. Amps. RPM.

And liquid cooling.