Will Power Crash/Concussion

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countersteer
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Location: Spring Hill, TN

Will Power Crash/Concussion

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Will Power had a somewhat innocuous crash during 1st Practice at St. Petersburg. Walked away... Ended up on pole during Saturday's qualifying but he looked really bad when he got out of the car. Symptoms got worse overnight and he was replaced, for the race, by Oriol Servia. He's now been diagnosed with a concussion.



http://blackflag.jalopnik.com/pole-sitt ... 1764614253

http://www.racer.com/indycar/item/12709 ... concussion


Reminds me of Alonso's crash last year...
http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewto ... &start=810

BanMeToo
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Re: Will Power Crash/Concussion

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Did something break on the car or was it driver error? Looks strange on the onboard.


countersteer wrote:Reminds me of Alonso's crash last year...
How, at all, does it? Actually no pls don't answer

Jolle
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Re: Will Power Crash/Concussion

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Almost looks like he lost the grip on the steering wheel half way trough the corner or something. Strange accident.

But yes, both ALO and him had a side impact resulting in a concussion, but on ALO's car, nothing broke, while at Powers car the side was pretty smashed.

Could it be, strangely enough, because if the side impact head rest, the neck isn't able to act as a flexible low speed impact cushion and the head, although fairly well protected by helmet and impact headband, comes to a too sudden stop? could it be so simple to have a layer of low impact, low resistant material inside the cockpit headrest before the strong, high impact stuff to give the head (and brain) a bit more time to stop with a low-speed side impact?

I imagine, with all the high speed dense materials, the helmet and side impact head rest feels solid when you would hit it with a speed of 10 -20 km/h. Walk bearheaded into a wall, and you'll have a concussion as well.
So: first 5cm of a soft material and then 10 cm of dense material?

bhall II
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Re: Will Power Crash/Concussion

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Jolle wrote:...5cm of a soft material and then 10 cm of dense material?
They're already made from foam.

Image
...the neck isn't able to act as a flexible low speed impact cushion...
Incidentally, safety tends to demand as much immobilization as possible, because that sort of flexibility in a crash causes everything from whiplash to basilar skull fractures (what killed Dale Earnhardt).

countersteer
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Re: Will Power Crash/Concussion

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He admitted that he was adjusting the brake bias, hit a bump that gave him some snap oversteer and couldn't save it. http://www.racer.com/indycar/item/12700 ... er-crashes

Here's another shot of the car. Limited damage. Repairs were completed in 4 hours.
Image

countersteer
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Re: Will Power Crash/Concussion

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countersteer wrote:Reminds me of Alonso's crash last year...
How, at all, does it? Actually no pls don't answer[/quote]

Somewhat innocuous side impact resulting in head trauma sufficient to bench the driver.

bill shoe
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Re: Will Power Crash/Concussion

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BanMeToo wrote:Did something break on the car or was it driver error? Looks strange on the onboard.
In the middle of the corner, his left hand was off the steer-wheel to turn a knob or something on the dash, possible brake balance. Then the steering wheel spun away from his right hand due to steer-wheel torque over a bump or something like that. I understand this is not really the focus of the thread.

bill shoe
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Re: Will Power Crash/Concussion

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bhall II wrote:Incidentally, safety tends to demand as much immobilization as possible, because that sort of flexibility in a crash causes everything from whiplash to basilar skull fractures (what killed Dale Earnhardt).
Immobilize what? It's my understanding that if you constrain the head more to reduce neck stress then you typically increase the accel forces on the brain. It's a tradeoff. Concussions are much better understood now than 20 years ago, but in practical terms what does that mean for head restraint? Constrain more, constrain less, different decel profile, what?

When the FIA came up with the dimensions and spec of the modern racecar U-collar (~20 years ago?), they considered both injury modes (head and neck) and tried to find reasonable compromise. The FIA deserves credit for bringing safety equipment testing and specification into the age of reasoned science. I think that statement is not too strong.

For many many years all racers (even in close-top cars) wore helmets with no neck brace, no HANS, and no u-collar device. This surely caused more injury from helmet mass overstressing necks than it saved from reducing blunt trauma to the head. Dale Earnhardt is apt example there. The helmets over the years were subjected to progressively more severe impact testing which logically increased their weight. SNELL et al, did not consider the neck stress at all.

Many years of very sincere and earnest safety suggestions does not necessarily mean those suggestions are correct. A rating by a non-profit safety organization such as SNELL does not mean the rated equipment actually net saves lives. My personal opinion is that most safety-focused people in racing advocate x, y, or z because-
1. They want to feel like they are helping/saving someone, or
2. They want to emphasize that their field of interest (racing) is dangerous, in order to obtain a risk-seeking image.
3. And yes, sometimes plain old profit motive is involved.

If I raced in an era without the modern safety devices (collars, HANS, u-collars, etc.), and I was racing a closed-cockpit car, then I think the safest approach would be no helmet, but pad the heck out of any nearby roll-cage tubes with firm foam to reduce blunt-force trauma from hitting them.

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Pierce89
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Re: Will Power Crash/Concussion

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People, he missed the race because of a virus, not the crash. It was his decision to race or not. The "mild concussion" had nothing to do with Will Power's missing the race.
“To be able to actually make something is awfully nice”
Bruce McLaren on building his first McLaren racecars, 1970

“I've got to be careful what I say, but possibly to probably Juan would have had a bigger go”
Sir Frank Williams after the 2003 Canadian GP, where Ralf hesitated to pass brother M. Schumacher

countersteer
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Re: Will Power Crash/Concussion

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Pierce89 wrote:People, he missed the race because of a virus, not the crash. It was his decision to race or not. The "mild concussion" had nothing to do with Will Power's missing the race.
"“Following his on-track incident on Friday Will Power displayed no signs of injury and was evaluated and cleared by the INDYCAR Medical team. Per INDYCAR protocol we also evaluated the data collected from his ear accelerometers, which provides data specific to the impact on a driver’s head, and nothing gathered from that data indicated further evaluation was required. After learning of Will’s symptoms following qualifications Saturday he was required to submit to another evaluation by INDYCAR Medical Director Geoffery Billows, at which point he was diagnosed with a mild concussion. Power has been entered into INDYCAR’s concussion protocol and will need to be re-evaluated prior to being cleared to drive.”

http://www.racer.com/indycar/item/12709 ... concussion

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Pierce89
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Re: Will Power Crash/Concussion

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countersteer wrote:
Pierce89 wrote:People, he missed the race because of a virus, not the crash. It was his decision to race or not. The "mild concussion" had nothing to do with Will Power's missing the race.
"“Following his on-track incident on Friday Will Power displayed no signs of injury and was evaluated and cleared by the INDYCAR Medical team. Per INDYCAR protocol we also evaluated the data collected from his ear accelerometers, which provides data specific to the impact on a driver’s head, and nothing gathered from that data indicated further evaluation was required. After learning of Will’s symptoms following qualifications Saturday he was required to submit to another evaluation by INDYCAR Medical Director Geoffery Billows, at which point he was diagnosed with a mild concussion. Power has been entered into INDYCAR’s concussion protocol and will need to be re-evaluated prior to being cleared to drive.”

http://www.racer.com/indycar/item/12709 ... concussion
I'm too lazy to look for links but one story said Will passed the concussion protocol but couldn't race because of the virus. Oriole Servia in a story on motorsport.com makes it pretty clear it was the virus. The concussion is people trying to come up with an article after the fact. Indycar fans who follow the series, knew before practice ever started there was a good chance Power wouldn't be able to race
“To be able to actually make something is awfully nice”
Bruce McLaren on building his first McLaren racecars, 1970

“I've got to be careful what I say, but possibly to probably Juan would have had a bigger go”
Sir Frank Williams after the 2003 Canadian GP, where Ralf hesitated to pass brother M. Schumacher

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bdr529
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Re: Will Power Crash/Concussion

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Pierce89 wrote: I'm too lazy to look for links but one story said Will passed the concussion protocol but couldn't race because of the virus. Oriole Servia in a story on motorsport.com makes it pretty clear it was the virus. The concussion is people trying to come up with an article after the fact. Indycar fans who follow the series, knew before practice ever started there was a good chance Power wouldn't be able to race
I'm guessing this is the story
Oriol Servia says he will know soon whether he is to substitute for St. Petersburg polesitter Will Power,
who has been struck with a stomach virus.
http://www.motorsport.com/indycar/news/ ... 79244/?s=1

bhall II
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Re: Will Power Crash/Concussion

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bill shoe wrote:Immobilize what? It's my understanding that if you constrain the head more to reduce neck stress then you typically increase the accel forces on the brain. It's a tradeoff. Concussions are much better understood now than 20 years ago, but in practical terms what does that mean for head restraint? Constrain more, constrain less, different decel profile, what?
Given the context that prompted my reply...
Could it be, strangely enough, because if the side impact head rest, the neck isn't able to act as a flexible low speed impact cushion and the head, although fairly well protected by helmet and impact headband, comes to a too sudden stop?
...what I meant is that it's not a good idea to allow the neck to bear the brunt of a rapid deceleration. That's the reason for HANS, like you mentioned, and why seats in closed-cockpit race cars greatly restrict head movement.

Image

Image

Otherwise, there's not a whole lot that can be done about concussions - as the NFL is slowly learning - aside from eliminating altogether the contact, thus deceleration, that causes them. But, I'm faaaaaar from being a doctor, so.....

bill shoe
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Re: Will Power Crash/Concussion

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Pierce89 wrote:I'm too lazy to look for links but one story said Will passed the concussion protocol but couldn't race because of the virus. Oriole Servia in a story on motorsport.com makes it pretty clear it was the virus. The concussion is people trying to come up with an article after the fact. Indycar fans who follow the series, knew before practice ever started there was a good chance Power wouldn't be able to race
No comment on accuracy of this statement.

However, the Power crash is now similar to the Alonso accident in that they both have a conspiracy theory element.

It's also similar to the Alonso accident because in both cases the conspiracy claimed a lack of actual concussion, combined with a false claim of concussion to cover up something else. In any other sport on any other day it's the other way around: false stories are invented to cover up possible real concusions. A concusion is typically considered the worst possible outcome from a health and PR point of view. Auto racing PR flacks are apparently getting something backwards...

********************

bhall II, I sometimes think I should vaguely disagree with you more just to provoke more of your excellent graphics. :)

bhall II
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Re: Will Power Crash/Concussion

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Yeah, I'm aware my "unique" thought process - to put it nicely - doesn't always language clear yield crystal. Pictures help.