Racing in Argentina: Turismo Carretera / TopRace V6 / TC2000

Please discuss here all your remarks and pose your questions about all racing series, except Formula One. Both technical and other questions about GP2, Touring cars, IRL, LMS, ...
Belatti
33
Joined: 10 Jul 2007, 21:48
Location: Argentina

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

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well, this happened yesterday...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEzRpVT0xhY
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna

Belatti
33
Joined: 10 Jul 2007, 21:48
Location: Argentina

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

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Just wanted to post a couple of pictures

Image

Image

These are NOT engine failures!
This is normal when a TC is downshifting!
Its due to the ´low´ carburettor jet that let some fuel pass when violent rpm increase sucks a lot of air.

Watching that spectacle a few meters away is priceless...
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna

kevster145
0
Joined: 08 Apr 2008, 19:52

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

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didn't you say you would post pitbabe pics as well? :D

Belatti
33
Joined: 10 Jul 2007, 21:48
Location: Argentina

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

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kevster145 wrote:didn't you say you would post pitbabe pics as well? :D
I´ll give you Morticia

Image
Last edited by Belatti on 17 May 2008, 18:02, edited 1 time in total.
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna

Belatti
33
Joined: 10 Jul 2007, 21:48
Location: Argentina

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

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Racing in a street circuit at night?
As ever, we could not be less...

http://www.tc2000.com.ar/noticias.php?id=2313

This weekend, TC2000 in Santa Fe night street circuit.
On monday I´ll post some pics. :wink:
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna

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Ciro Pabón
106
Joined: 11 May 2005, 00:31

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

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Well, I love TC, I just haven't that much to say about it. I follow it religiously, Belatti, you're not alone in this. As usual, I start with a little ;) history of south american racing, to give this thread some perspective.

South of Río Grande racing is big, but I'm afraid that we did not need tracks to race. You know, drivers here are commited to take risks.

The oldest south american race I can find is the 1934 Rio De Janeiro GP in Gavea street circuit, right across Ipanema. There was a similar street race in 1936 in Sao Paulo.

The first argentinian race in my memory is the 1936 race at the Benito Juárez track (a dirt track) in Buenos Aires.

First start for Juan Manuel Fangio (car number 19, second row)
Image

Fangio "stole" his father taxi to race in that competition. Someone went to his father right before the start to denounce him. His father only said, with typical latino non-chalance "Do you think that Juan will run well?"

The oldest series in the world, I believe, is TC, which has been running continously since 1937. In 2003 they completed their race number 1.000. So, this thread continues a tradition that is older than anything that americans or europeans can throw at us. Every major venue in Europe or North America has had its interruptions. We may be not that old in racing, but we're constant.

Argentinian TC car: by regulations it has to use parts of cars made in Argentina. Bump? What bump?
Image

As Belatti stated, TC started as road racing, in October 1937. It has included the 1940 International Grand Prix of the North (won by a young Juan Fangio), a little dash of 5900 miles, from Buenos Aires to Lima and back. You know, they didn't like lesser stints. The maximum I can recall is the Buenos Aires - Caracas race in 1948 mentioned by Belatti (my father told me the race passed through Bogotá). Actually, the rules stated that the races should be at least 1.000 km in length. In the pampas the speeds were incredible. There were races in the 50's with 240 kph average speed. Latinos don't race to go slow, it's that or bullfighting... :) Races are a huge thing in Argentina: I've seen a 65 cars grid which guarantees excitement.

The older track in Argentina must be the Palermo Park, used in 1940, and Rosario track used since that very same year, a few months later.

In Colombia we had the Autódromo Ricardo Mejía in 1968, and before that only street and road races. It held two Formula 2 races in 1971 (I think) won by Jo Siffert and Allan Rollinson.

The oldest chilean track must be Las Vizcachas and then Temuco (I have no idea when they were inaugurated).

Venezuela hold street races in 1950 and Guyana used the Atkinson Airport in 1960.

On a lighter note, the track at Brasilia was named "General Emilio Medici", current dictator in 1970. He was overthrown 6 weeks after the first and only GP (sort of)... ;)

If anyone can help me here with the history of South American races and tracks, welcome.
Ciro

Belatti
33
Joined: 10 Jul 2007, 21:48
Location: Argentina

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

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Excellent post Ciro =D>

I don´t know much about the history of south american racing (I should)
Only what I have posted and somethings you have.

Here is the first link one googler would read (spanish WIKI)
http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turismo_Carretera

Here the Contreras webpage, a family that has been taking TC photos since 1959 (they are like the Argentinian Schlegelmilchs, but older :wink: )
http://www.fotocontreras.com.ar/historia/index.asp

A nice video where you can see TC history resumed in 2:35 minutes...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oiowJwj8 ... etera.html

Enjoy!
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna

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Ciro Pabón
106
Joined: 11 May 2005, 00:31

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

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Thanx, Belatti, nice links, I loved the video. A question I could not answer and has always intrigued me. It's the pit babes. Why do every driver carries around two girls that pose behind him for the camera using caps with the sponsors logo, one on each shoulder, on every TV interview? "Las chicas de coro" or "Promotoras" (the "chorus girls" or "promoters").

That's one of the unique customs of TC... :) Yes, yes, I know they're promoting some franchise, but the take of the camera is always the same. Who started this custom? Why is it (apparently) mandatory for the camera guy? They never show their incredible bodies.

Bonano and his promoters. This is not a good picture, they normally stand behind the guy, their heads showing over his shoulders on each and every interview.
Image

What do they do with girl drivers? Do they carry two guys? ;)

Sorry for this picture, it's kind of a joke (in spanish only)

Image

Another thing not mentioned: the strong competition between Ford and Chevrolet fans. It's worse than Boca-River antagonism, or so it seemed to me at Rosario.

TC has several latino customs, not easy to understand to other series fans:

Friday, before the race, all the edges of the track are occupied by RV vehicles that arrive from far away (in Argentina, anything in the provinces is far away), weeks in advance to get the better spot.

The smart organization only charges one ticket for each family either on the stands or parking zones. This way, the racing "thing" includes BBQ, wine (unthinkable in other series), long family debate and a very latino "what do I know" conclusion to it when the three days of craziness end and the people goes away. The track invasion after the race is amazing: I've seen people rolled over by cars. Well, just once and it was a huge scandal for the organizer, but imagine that: the race hasn't finished yet and a crowd of thousands literally race to the pits to be besides their beloved drivers.

And what a group of drivers they have! “Pato” Silva, the “Bocha” Ciantini, the “Gurí” Omar Martínez, the Di Palma family, with their different races and generations, Norberto Fontana, ex F1, Ortelli, Bessone, Ponce de León, Moriartis, Aventín, Ledezma, y many others are as popular as football players. It's really easy to make an "argentinian selection", at least for me.

Besides TC Carretera and TC Pista (Road and Track), that is some kind of B class, they have TC 2000, modified tourism with super-high technology (as only argentinians have in South America, totally "native") and high investment. The mechanics are like Yoda in overall, some times you find guys that are as old as your grandpa, but covered in grease. They also have a V6 class, dozens of one-brand races, "Topolino" (Fiat 600) nostalgic races AND Citroën 2CV (hi, Tom, long time no see, how's your trip to the Caribbean? You did forget everything about the uni in our beaches, didn't you?), incredibly crowded competitions for historical cars including pasta, meat and goals (they play football while they race!) everything on the same sunday.

Beyond a five times world champion, of having Froilán González in the unique role of the first Ferrari winner in F1, of almost getting (and more than deserving) another WDC with the impressive Carlos Reutemann, of being a permanent venue for the WRC and having a very active Formula Renault championship, few people understand why they don't have race drivers in F1, while the humble Colombia has had JPM.

The reason is simple: for an argentinian, to be a king in its home is more important, believe it or not. They earn pretty well, they race weekly, there are not so much demand for young drivers, because it is a mature age racing and it is deeply popular.

The fans are the more knowledgeable fans I've ever met, much more than NASCAR or NHRA fans (who are incredibly wise and understand every nuisance of their racing, imagine the level of argentinians). Each week every track seems to be full to the flags and it's the most entertaining thing to have a chance to share family time with them. I felt at home, everybody is a friend in five minutes, everybody shares his meat and wine with you. Compared with that, the parade of F1 is... well, I don't know what to say, but you, really, truly, don't feel "warm inside" in F1 the way you feel in TC racing: you end smiling for half of the race (it must have been the wine and the lovely, nice, sympathetic girls!). I've never had a better time in a track.

A toast to TC.

If you ever go to Argentina DO... NOT... MISS... IT.
Ciro

Belatti
33
Joined: 10 Jul 2007, 21:48
Location: Argentina

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

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Well, to everyone in the forum, believe me that TC is just as Ciro is telling.

I had the opportunity to go to every TC race from 1994 till 1999 as pit crew, because my cousin raced, first with a Nissan 300 in ST3000 (a one-brand serie) and then in TC Pista (TC B series). His major achievement was a 2nd place with a Chevrolet in La Plata, and that was quite good if you take into account that all was made by family effort, with a very low budget and friends as mechanics (no wage, only the privilege to be and work inside the pits :wink: ). His name is Rafael Martell, here a local newspaper from the date:
Image
http://pdf.diariohoy.net/1999/04/19/cla22y23.pdf
BTW, my family rented Gustavo (not Norberto) Fontana, the race winner´s house for more than 5 years. Once I went to the roof of that house and found a couple of abandoned F.Renault nosecones and rear wings... :?

Imagine that in 1994 I was only 12 years old, so I was basically the pet of the team, I drove a 50cc bike pulling a little home made cart inside the pits cause was in charge of tyres (carry them to change in the manufacturer facility and checking pressure) and fuel (buying and bringing it to the pit). Also I had to stand in a keypoint inside the circuit in the curve my cousing wanted and afer the practice session inform him about different drivers turning ratios, just to analize time splits. (that was our telemetry :lol: ) In that time I learnt how to regulate valves, how to adjust a torsion bar, and most important, every 2 weeks I missed school for a couple of days :D

Also had the opportunity to be in some drivers briefings, to eat in the same table with people like "El loco Luis Ruben Di Palma" (RIP) and sons, Aventin, Bessone, Pappo (a famous blues and heavy metal guitarrist who died as he wanted, drunk driving a Harley-Davidson, a guy that went to races with his band, played all night before the race to raise funds for his cause, a guy who walked in slips thru the pits, whose motorhome was only a bus with a huge bed, black lights and a couple of groupies :lol: ). All you can read about him will make you laugh hard, he was a great colourful character
http://www.jardindegente.com.ar/index.p ... prensa_178

To reply some of your thoughts, Ciro, first let me say that I wonder the same as you: "Why there are always a couple of girls smiling all the time at the camera, standing next to the drivers?" And yes, their bodies are something from another planet, I used to pay more attention to that instead of the cars and drivers...

About the strong competition between Ford and Chevrolet fans. It's not that worse than Boca-River antagonism, because in TC there is no Violence. Ford and Chevy fans can sit to share BBQ and wine together, laugh at each other, discuss, watch the race and then some celebrates, others go home insulting but you will never see one guy get shot there.

About drivers, you forgot Matias Rossi, a 22 year old brat that is the TC2000 Champ and TC No2 car. He lives in my city so I guess I must cheer for him, beyond me being a Dodge fan.

Regarding the dozens of one-brand series, in the article I posted you can read about Women Chevrolet Corsa Cup, where only girls where allowed to race. A fine spectacle to watch, before TC final race, let me tell you those chicks can be rude at the wheel :P
Here a pic of a Fiat 600 series "ALMA 1100" and the website, featuring the technical rulebook if you want to build and race one of those cars.

Image
http://www.webalma.com.ar/tc_1100/reglamentos.html

About the lack of F1 drivers, the country was heading somewhere with the 90´s GPs, Fontana and Tuero. The first one didn´t have a proper chance and the last one didn´t have "the balls" (from my humble point of view) and said "NO" to Giancarlo Minardi. Its still a mystery why did he do such a thing. After that, we suffered Mazzacane in 2001 and a severe economic crisis that carried 1USD=$1 to 1USD=$3 in 2002, two things that made us bite the dust. Now the companies had to pay 3 times the money needed to sponsor a driver racing in Europe and, to be honest, not much people watch European or American series, let F1 alone. I mean, after all they have got TC here!
At least I could cheer for Juan Pablo in the last years...

And, to finish, maybe TC fans are that knowledgeable because probably 90% of them had, has or will have a Ford Falcon, Chevrolet SS 250, Dodge Polara or Torino. If you go and count cars in the track parking lots, you will make some conclusions. You´ll see lots of tuned-modified cars with engines sounding just as angry as a TC.
Here´s a link to the magazine TC Urbano (or Urban TC) and you´ll know what I mean.
http://www.tcurbanoweb.com.ar/

Thanx for your patience!
Thanx Ciro again! =D> (next time you visit my country tell me and I´ll get you into the pits :wink: )
Cheers!
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna

Belatti
33
Joined: 10 Jul 2007, 21:48
Location: Argentina

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

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As Carlos told me, Tc Urbano (The Magazine that gathers articles and pictures from the best machines of all TC fans) link is broken or something, here some of the biggest clubs from TC motorheads:

"Club de amigos del Chevrolet" (Chevrolet friends club)
http://www.chevroletba.com.ar/fotos_.php

"Club de amigos del Falcon" (Falcon friends club)
http://clubfalcon.netfirms.com/

"Club Dodge"
http://www.clubdodge.com.ar/

Torino Argentino
http://www.torino-argentino.com.ar/
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna

Belatti
33
Joined: 10 Jul 2007, 21:48
Location: Argentina

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

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"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna

Belatti
33
Joined: 10 Jul 2007, 21:48
Location: Argentina

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

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TC2000 street night racing! :P

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hInNwwkf ... re=related

This video was from Friday practice. It was just a test, too prepare for next year night race.
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna

Belatti
33
Joined: 10 Jul 2007, 21:48
Location: Argentina

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

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Ciro Pabón wrote: The older track in Argentina must be the Palermo Park, used in 1940, and Rosario track used since that very same year, a few months later.

In Colombia we had the Autódromo Ricardo Mejía in 1968, and before that only street and road races. It held two Formula 2 races in 1971 (I think) won by Jo Siffert and Allan Rollinson.

The oldest chilean track must be Las Vizcachas and then Temuco (I have no idea when they were inaugurated).

Venezuela hold street races in 1950 and Guyana used the Atkinson Airport in 1960.

On a lighter note, the track at Brasilia was named "General Emilio Medici", current dictator in 1970. He was overthrown 6 weeks after the first and only GP (sort of)... ;)

If anyone can help me here with the history of South American races and tracks, welcome.
Yesterday I returned from Sao Paulo.
Having breakfast one morning in the Hotel I read this on a sugar envelope:

"A primeira corrida de carros no Brasil aconteceu no circuito de Itapecerica da Serra, em SP, no dia 26 de Julho de 1.908"

Wich traduced states: "The first car race in Brazil took place in Itapecerica da Serra circuit, Sao Paulo, a 26 of July, 1.908"

Isn´t that older than Indy500? :wink:
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna

Carlos
11
Joined: 02 Sep 2006, 19:43
Location: Canada

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

Post

Just barely :D
Although interestinly the first race at Indy was a balloon race :D

The founders, Carl G. Fisher, James A. Allison, Arthur C. Newby and Frank H. Wheeler, pooled their ideas and resources to build the Indianapolis Motor Speedway, which would become the world's greatest racecourse. Fisher's vision was to build an automobile testing ground to support Indiana's growing automotive industry.
"June 5, 1909: The first competitive event to take place at the Indianapolis Motor Speedway was actually a gas-filled balloon race. In the handicap division, Dr. Goethe Link and Russ Irvin's "Indianapolis" won. John Berry and Paul McCullough won the National Championship race with the "University City"

http://www.indianapolismotorspeedway.co ... y_Timeline
______________________________________________
Primas Sum: Primatum Nil Ame Alienum Puto = Motto of all Primatologists

Belatti
33
Joined: 10 Jul 2007, 21:48
Location: Argentina

Re: TC: Turismo Carretera

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http://msn.foxsports.com/fsi/fse/story/ ... Id=8530958

I will try to be there and take some pics!
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna