Sebring 12 hours 2009

Please discuss here all your remarks and pose your questions about all racing series, except Formula One. Both technical and other questions about GP2, Touring cars, IRL, LMS, ...

Post Fri Mar 20, 2009 10:11 pm

Too bad, Mod... You really missed something, not because the session itself was anything spectacular, but the free live stream provided by Speed TV was of great quality! =D> Thanks to them for that.

It's true that the diesels didn't try to clinch the pole, especially Peugeot, whose #8 car did a single lap (Klien made another one because he spun in turn 7 for his first attempt). Then they didn't even bother to get back on track for the reminding ten minutes... Audi didn't do much more, so Acura's pole position isn't as exiting as it could seem at first sight.

Still, they are very close to Peugeot on the long runs, and possibly better whenever grip is low. (that last statement is however countered by the stunning pace of the Pugs during yesterday's night session on a drying track).

My bet for the race is definitly for an Audi victory, as they are quicker, and nearly unbeatable in terms of strategy (especially in the US).

Then the battle between Acura and Peugeot will be decided by how much the lions will have learned from their defeats. Last time they fough Audi, at PLM, they got beated by Mc Nish, while Alan was starting the race two laps down and had a slower car! This prove how wrong they were in adapting to the US way of racing, with random full course neutralisation poping up whenever the leader is opening the gap... Under those circumstances being the fastest means nothing, as there's no escaping the field allowed. Only way to win is through reliability, consistency, tyre usage, traffic management, and luck (obviously).

Now I'm looking forward to the race tomorrow. Mod, be sure to be ready for 4.00 pm (Kyiv time, it 3.00 for GMT+1) or you'll be late again. :wink:
vyselegend
 
Joined: 20 Feb 2006
Location: Paris, France

Post Sat Mar 21, 2009 12:32 am

vyselegend wrote:Under those circumstances being the fastest means nothing, as there's no escaping the field allowed. Only way to win is through reliability, consistency, tyre usage, traffic management, and luck (obviously).

Now I'm looking forward to the race tomorrow. Mod, be sure to be ready for 4.00 pm (Kyiv time, it 3.00 for GMT+1) or you'll be late again. :wink:

Thanks for calculating that for me :D Although I did it about a week ago after I saw the promo video on motors-tv and I'm eagerly waiting since then. But I had no idea the quali was so early (by F1 standarts that is :oops: ).

I have 2 questions though:

1. what did you mean by no escaping allowed (quoted in bold). Is there a rule I'm not aware of?
2. will the video stream be available during the race? Some of my friends who can't watch it on TV would gladly use the speed-tv link.
modbaraban
 
Joined: 5 Apr 2007
Location: Kyiv, Ukraine

Post Sat Mar 21, 2009 2:07 pm

No, it's not a rule. Not an official one at least.

It's just that in ALMS you'll never see a car lap it's own class (ie a P1 lapping all the P1s) by sheer pace, because they allways find an excuse to bring a yellow flag (even if it's only dust on the track - and a neutralisation can last up to ten laps after the track have been cleared...) , which in the US means full course neutralisation. That means you have a safety car situation cancelling any gap opened by the leader every now and then.

I'll repeat the PLM 2008 exemple, the #2 Audi started the race with two and half a lap down (Mc Nish had crashed at the warm up!), and in the end it beated the 908 which was faster all the race long (bar the last five laps)! This was only due to Audi's experience in the US, they were able to optimise their strategy and were considerably faster for pit works. While the Peugeot was desperatly opening the gap at each restart, only to be forced to slow down everytime they had a significant advance.

That's what I meant by "there's no escaping the field allowed". :wink:

Race is starting in less than an hour! I can feel the pressure already. Man, I'd love to be in Florida right now! =P~

EDIT: for those who haven't Motors TV, the race should be dislpayed for free through: http://gms.speedtv.com/

Or there is this adress for streaming with an external player (works well with vlc usually): http://speed.edgeboss.net/wmedia-live/speed/8999/300_speed-lms_video_1_050720.asx

Credits to the users of the ten tenth forum for those links.
vyselegend
 
Joined: 20 Feb 2006
Location: Paris, France

Post Sat Mar 21, 2009 5:10 pm

I don't agree with your no lapping the whole field thing. I am not sure how many races you've watched in ALMS, but most of the cautions have a reason. They are not NASCAR-esque competition yellow. Most US tracks are a lot smaller than their European counterpart, and usually when something happens it takes a lot more time to clean up because you are working a lot closer to racing surface, and tons of cars on shorter tracks as well, so its not unusual to see accident....Peugeot's team last year was not the sharpest knife in the drawer, they tend to shoot themselves in the foot and that lost them the Sebring, the 24 hours, the PLM, and the Petit. Audi simple runs a tighter ship than they do....

For Sebring:
Tune in after 2pm Eastern(between 12-2 its NASCAR)
http://fr.justin.tv/nascarpovver

Speed On-Board Stream(whole race):
http://almsacura.globalmediaservices.tv/


Radio Le Mans:
www.radiolemans.com

The live timing on ALMS's site does not seem to be working...
RacingManiac
 
Joined: 22 Nov 2004

Post Sat Mar 21, 2009 9:38 pm

Ok maybe I exagerated a bit but I remember so many race ends ruined by unreasonably long neutralisations...

Anyway thank you very much for the links.

Half way through the race, the #08 is leading the race with a very marginal gap, while it is constantly doubling it's tyres stints. What a tight fight between Audi & Peugeot!
Acura has a disapointing pace, and have hit problems also.

the P2 fight is already over, that's a shame.
vyselegend
 
Joined: 20 Feb 2006
Location: Paris, France

Post Sun Mar 22, 2009 2:17 am

Acura is just like a sitting duck on the straight against the diesels. but damn those diesels sound awful.
freedom_honda
 
Joined: 23 Jul 2007

Post Sun Mar 22, 2009 3:43 am

Well, the race just finished, and WHAT A RACE!!!!

Audi beating Peugeot for only 20 seconds at the end of a 12 hour race, that's not our usual F1 race, where the winner is decided on the first corner... saying "Audi beating...", I should well say "McNish", who showed once again to be one of the finest drivers ever... and a puncture on the fastest 08 car didn't help Peugeot, who seems unable to have an uneventful race. Bourdais was also magnificent on its stints, too bad the 07 Peugeot didn't escape much trouble (A/C fan problem and a gearbox-related retirement), I feel bad for Lamy and specially Klien, who once again showed a fantastic pace.

So, no R15 domination after all, and a promise of a thrilling Le Mans to come, given the 3 R15's + 2 R10's that will be there against 3+1 908's... I feel I could well hibernate until June, in terms of exciting racing to watch...
dumrick
 
Joined: 19 Jan 2004
Location: Portugal

Post Sun Mar 22, 2009 3:55 am

I think they need to ban the diesels. Not only because they are far too fast compared to the petrol cars but because they sound horrid - totally against the ethos of racing. We need to stick some DBR9 V12s in the back of them :mrgreen: [-o<
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'10-'11 Head of Powertrain - Glasgow University Formula Student
Scotracer
 
Joined: 22 Apr 2008
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland, UK

Post Sun Mar 22, 2009 1:59 pm

That's the comment one should expect from a mind tarnished by the depressing last years of motorsport :D !!! That's a FIA motto: to ban! Ban nothing, allow eveything, have great races with V8's against V10's against V12's (why not Wankels and 4-in-line?), open cars against close cars, Diesels against Otto's and electrics and hydrogens, that's what I say!

I'm fed up with great sounding spec-series (Superleague Formula, anyone?), bans and regulating CG's from engines (or ideas like passing all engines in the dyno and evaluating them against a standard). The only feuds of great racing are the ACO-regulated series, where you can see Acuras struggling to be quick overtaking, because of small capacity petrol engines, in Sebring, but must be dominating in slower, tighter circuits. Also, it's amusing to compare F1 style "night racing" with brighter-than-sun floodlights with true racing, yesterday at Sebring Tom K. said that in the darkness, with trackside lights and all the bumps, he just couldn't see where he was going in turn 1... that's big balls racing for you! :wink:
dumrick
 
Joined: 19 Jan 2004
Location: Portugal

Post Sun Mar 22, 2009 2:03 pm

I love being to hear the turbo's on those diesels.

You guys can stick with loud and slow... Im down with the quiet assassin turbo diesels.
ISLAMATRON
 
Joined: 1 Oct 2008

Post Sun Mar 22, 2009 2:10 pm

Ban the diesels? :o Keep them, they made that race really exciting! Although I just had it on the radio with really poor commentators ("look at that", "he's just over-taken him" and no description [-X ) I was getting a sense of the close racing, I was only listening until 2 hours to go, so I missed McNish's final stint.

Excellent racing! I look forward to Le Mans when we'll have 3 fast diesels (R10, R15 and 908) racing, hopefully each of them for the win [-o<
"It could be done manually. It would take quite a while, but it could be done. There is however a much more efficient and accurate way of getting the data. Men with lasers." Wing Commander Andy Green
roost89
 
Joined: 10 Apr 2008
Location: Highlands, Scotland


Post Mon Mar 23, 2009 1:05 am

The track record shattered, and distance record shattered. I think if Le Mans has good weather this year it might be the same story, again....Good to see Peugeot has improved on their racecraft, though not at Audi's level yet...
RacingManiac
 
Joined: 22 Nov 2004

Post Mon Mar 23, 2009 2:42 am




great stuff in those videos. I would love to know what Audi and Peugeot were paying for a season like 2008. I bet it was a lot less than Mercedes for F1. Le Mans was great and it is a shame that I missed Sebring.

This year Le Mans will probably once again be a thriller. I love those Diesel protos.
Formula One's fundamental ethos is about success coming to those with the most ingenious engineering and best .............................. organization, not to those with the biggest budget. (Dave Richards)
WhiteBlue
 
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Location: WhiteBlue Country

Post Tue Mar 24, 2009 2:33 am

freedom_honda wrote: but damn those diesels sound awful.


ISLAMATRON wrote:I love being to hear the turbo's on those diesels. You guys can stick with loud and slow... Im down with the quiet assassin turbo diesels.


I must say the best sounding engine (in this particular field of cars) was the gargauntuan V-8 of the Corvettes! As Clarkson would say, "it sounds like the god of thunder gargling with hammers!" Not only did I think it sounded the best, but it was by far the most unique. Aside from the diesels, the casual spectator might not know the difference between the Acura, Ferrari, Mazda, Porsche, etc. But by god everyone knows when a Corvette rumbles on through! Great sound! Oh and great race btw :lol:
Best regards. I guess this explains why I'm not at my post!
tk421
 
Joined: 12 Jan 2009

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