Pirelli Tests Nov 2010

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Post Fri Nov 19, 2010 10:04 pm

What's the advantage of tires that wear faster?
Grip is a four letter word.

2 is the new #1.
Jersey Tom
 
Joined: 29 May 2006
Location: Huntersville, NC

Post Fri Nov 19, 2010 10:26 pm

Jersey Tom wrote:What's the advantage of tires that wear faster?


None as far as "performance" goes, but in the scheme of improving the show, the 2010 Bridgestone in most cases is "too good" in that the team changes tire mostly depends on satisfying the rule, rather than needing to because the performance degrades. Crappier tire should mean more pitstop or having driving trying to drive and cope with a less than optimum car. That delta should produce more variations in the racing on track...

Its control tire, so really out and out performance should not be the overall concern...
RacingManiac
 
Joined: 22 Nov 2004

Post Fri Nov 19, 2010 10:37 pm

I guess, maybe.

Bear in mind... softer / stickier / faster wearing tires = more and bigger marbles all over the place. I know for a while some folks were going bananas thinking marbles and tire wear were ruining racing.

Whether or not that's true...

Also means they won't hold heat very long... and drivers always bitching about heat in the tires and all this crap. Threw a big stink about possibility of not having tire warmers.

Or if we're going to make the pit strategy argument with tire depredation.. then why get rid of refueling?

Just stuff to consider.
Grip is a four letter word.

2 is the new #1.
Jersey Tom
 
Joined: 29 May 2006
Location: Huntersville, NC

Post Fri Nov 19, 2010 10:55 pm

Jersey Tom wrote:What's the advantage of tires that wear faster?


Blistering control springs to mind.

Ben
ubrben
 
Joined: 28 Feb 2009

Post Fri Nov 19, 2010 11:30 pm

Well I'd certainly agree with that, particularly from the tire manufacturer's perspective... but I don't think many here are as as concerned with that aspect!

I just find it odd that we have some people clamoring "We need less marbles so there's more area to pass!" and at the same time "Tires should wear faster!"
Grip is a four letter word.

2 is the new #1.
Jersey Tom
 
Joined: 29 May 2006
Location: Huntersville, NC

Post Sat Nov 20, 2010 12:19 am

Jersey Tom wrote:
Or if we're going to make the pit strategy argument with tire depredation.. then why get rid of refueling?


Someone a lot smarter than me will know the answer, as I certainly don't know....

IMO 2010 could have been a very boring year, the ban on refueling hasn't really done much for the show. It just so happen though weather played a pretty big part this season, which always does a good job of throwing a wrench into a well run machine. Both how the year started and ended was showing how a "typical" race runs under the rule, good weather, car mandatorily pits for tire, and run formation to the end.
RacingManiac
 
Joined: 22 Nov 2004

Post Sat Nov 20, 2010 12:34 am

Jersey Tom wrote:I just find it odd that we have some people clamoring "We need less marbles so there's more area to pass!" and at the same time "Tires should wear faster!"

Maybe there are simply different people that say this.

I actually say I want tires that wear faster. If there are marble on track or not I don't care. The complaining about marbles prolly comes from the drivers and the guys here just repeat it. We should not forget that drivers are little babies that whine about everything.

Marbles don't necessary mean that overtaking is more difficult as both cars have to drive off line on some point.
For sure it will make driving a bit more difficult because you have to focus more on staying on the clean line.
Hey has anybody said driving a F1 car should be easy?
That’s one reason why I like Monaco track, soft tires, lots of marbles and very close guard rails. If a driver makes a little mistake and goes on the marbles he is out of the race and deserves it. The guys that finish the race are just better drivers.

Or if we're going to make the pit strategy argument with tire depredation.. then why get rid of refueling?

Refueling should be back anyway. The arguments of fast wearing tires and refueling go hand in hand.
mep
 
Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Location: Germany

Post Sat Nov 20, 2010 12:49 am

mep wrote:
Or if we're going to make the pit strategy argument with tire depredation.. then why get rid of refueling?
Refueling should be back anyway. The arguments of fast wearing tires and refueling go hand in hand.


I disagree - refuelling never added to the on track excitement, often instead leaving drivers just waiting for their pit stops to overtake. The problems with the on track racing this season were not due to the lack of refuelling but due to the teams having tyres that could last the entire race on pretty much any car in the pit lane. We didn't have any split strategies as they could all just go full race distance on those tyres.

Look at Canada this year - it was not made less exciting because they didn't have to sit in the pits waiting for more fuel, all the action was out on track thanks to different cars handing the degradation of the tyres differently, and some teams adopting differing strategies to try and combat the high wear rates. Hopefully the Pirelli tyres and the banning of the DDD next year will mean more great races like that and less boring precessions.
myurr
 
Joined: 20 Mar 2008

Post Sat Nov 20, 2010 1:16 am

Well on the other side you should keep in mind that when tires wear much faster drivers will also care much more about them and therefore will not race very hard. Instead of more overtaking you will just see drivers waiting until their competitors tires are gone.

@myurr
this is not the topic to discuss about refuelling, there is another one and most of the stuff has already been said there. I am tired to repeat things here.
Obvioulsy there are different views about what is exciting. Something that looks boring for you might look exciting for me.
mep
 
Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Location: Germany

Post Sat Nov 20, 2010 2:17 am

Pirelli testing: Day 2 line-up

Red Bull-Renault -- Mark Webber
McLaren-Mercedes -- Oliver Turvey
Ferrari -- Fernando Alonso
Mercedes GP -- Michael Schumacher
Renault -- Vitaly Petrov
Williams-Cosworth -- Rubens Barrichello
Force India-Mercedes -- Vitantonio Liuzzi
Sauber-Ferrari -- Sergio Pérez
Toro Rosso-Ferrari --Sébastien Buemi
Lotus-Cosworth -- Jarno Trulli
Hispania-Cosworth -- Pastor Maldonado
Virgin-Cosworth -- Lucas di Grassi


It will be interesting to watch how Schumacher and Alonso finish at the end of the day.

Are the drivers chosen with a specific reason??? like Rosberg over Schumacher --- Based on driving style so he gets to drive it first then Schumi or if Schumi was busy with PR, personal engagements...

Is is similar to other teams also because for Mclaren, both the drivers have yet to test on the new tyres... and I feel Jenson Button would be the best as he has a smooth driving style....
"Be the change that you wish to see most in your world" -- Mahatma Gandhi
mach11
 
Joined: 21 Aug 2009
Location: India

Post Sat Nov 20, 2010 3:15 am

raymondu999 wrote:They'll get 4 sets on both days, of softs and mediums... I wonder how they'll get feedback for the supersofts and the hards though :?

I thought Pirelli was going to produce only three compounds for next year - soft, medium and hard.
mith
 
Joined: 2 Feb 2010
Location: Wrocław, Poland

Post Sat Nov 20, 2010 3:54 am

mep wrote:Well on the other side you should keep in mind that when tires wear much faster drivers will also care much more about them and therefore will not race very hard. Instead of more overtaking you will just see drivers waiting until their competitors tires are gone.



I think that opens option for strategic maneuvering though. At some point the guy who went all out will be able to over come the pitstop gap and just plainly go faster than the guy who is saving tires. Just look at this year (Suzuka, for instance), some driver ran long on the tires, went for fresh set near the end, and was able to race back to positions that they held before the stop....
RacingManiac
 
Joined: 22 Nov 2004

Post Sat Nov 20, 2010 4:58 am

mach11 wrote:Pirelli testing: Day 2 line-up

Red Bull-Renault -- Mark Webber
McLaren-Mercedes -- Oliver Turvey
Ferrari -- Fernando Alonso
Mercedes GP -- Michael Schumacher
Renault -- Vitaly Petrov
Williams-Cosworth -- Rubens Barrichello
Force India-Mercedes -- Vitantonio Liuzzi
Sauber-Ferrari -- Sergio Pérez
Toro Rosso-Ferrari --Sébastien Buemi
Lotus-Cosworth -- Jarno Trulli
Hispania-Cosworth -- Pastor Maldonado
Virgin-Cosworth -- Lucas di Grassi


Errrm... where did you get this stuff? RBR is fielding Vettel again. Renault is fielding Kubica. Sauber fielding Koba in the morning, then Perez in the afternoon.
失败者找理由,成功者找方法
raymondu999
 
Joined: 4 Feb 2010

Post Sat Nov 20, 2010 10:37 am

mith wrote:
raymondu999 wrote:They'll get 4 sets on both days, of softs and mediums... I wonder how they'll get feedback for the supersofts and the hards though :?

I thought Pirelli was going to produce only three compounds for next year - soft, medium and hard.


I don't know if that was the case, but recent interviews state 4 compounds and specifically mention a super-soft.
myurr
 
Joined: 20 Mar 2008

Post Sat Nov 20, 2010 11:10 am

1 – Fernando Alonso – Ferrari – 1’40.529 – 47 giri
2 – Sebastian Vettel – Red Bull – 1’40.825 – 28 giri
3 – Rubens Barrichello – Williams – 1’41.294 – 52 giri
4 – Paul di Resta – Force India – 1’41.869 – 35 giri
5 – Oliver Turvey – McLaren – 1’42.046 – 29 giri
6 – Kamui Kobayashi – Sauber – 1’42.110 – 43 giri
7 – Michael Schumacher – Mercedes – 1’42.161 – 30 giri
8 – Robert Kubica – Renault – 1’42.178 – 47 giri
9 – Sebastien Buemi – Toro Rosso – 1’42.399 – 46 giri
10 – Jarno Trulli – Lotus – 1’44.839 – 44 giri
11 – Timo Glock – Virgin – 1’45.405 – 37 giri
12 – Pastor Maldonado – Hispania – 1’45.516 – 27 giri
csponton
 
Joined: 8 Sep 2009

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