2013 Bahrain GP - Sakhir

[muhammadtalha-13]

Yes, it was. That's why Alonso had to stop additional two times.

Does driving with open DRS outside DSR zones break any regulation?

Yes. It breaks Regulation.You can't use DRS outside the specified zones. Also, a huge amont of downforce will also be lost with DRS activated all the time.

[beelsebob]

Yes, it was. That's why Alonso had to stop additional two times.

Does driving with open DRS outside DSR zones break any regulation?

Yes. It breaks Regulation.You can't use DRS outside the specified zones. Also, a huge amont of downforce will also be lost with DRS activated all the time.

More so, in this instance, because it was inverted, it's likely that the upper element was generating positive lift, not just generating no downforce.

[Shrieker]

@Phil,

I agree with what you say about Rosberg and generally about Mercedes. Rosberg would've looked very bad if he didn't put up a fight to defend his position in a race where he started on pole however. Mercedes likewise. Unfortunately it was a lose-lose situation for Rosberg and Mercedes. It most definitely would've looked very bad for the team and the driver if he fell like 7-8 places in a few laps just to make the strategy work. And now look where he ended up. A double edged sword really.

[SilverArrow10]

Basically Alonso wasn't punished... because everyone was so shocked he managed to stop it from flying off the track around the corners with so much less down force. It was some epic driving to keep it going at a reasonable speed, and I think two pit stops that he didn't need to make for a mechanical failure was punishment enough so no penalty.

[Rikhart]

"epic driving"?

He was just missing the upper flap of the rear wing, its not that different, as proven easily by the fact he didnt immediately fall down the order, and didnt even go off... Its only a 10 km/h on the straights difference, not that big of a deal...

[beelsebob]

"epic driving"?

He was just missing the upper flap of the rear wing,

Except that any DRS these days is designed such that the air will separate from the main plane if the DRS is open, and stall out the whole rear wing. That, plus the fact that it was inverted meant that the rear wing as a whole was generating lift, not downforce most likely. That's a very significant difference.

[Shrieker]

Was about to say that, but then again couldn't have put it as well as you did.

I'm thinking maybe the team noticed it in time and they let Alonso know ? Even still, I'm inclined to believe that Alonso had to negotiate at least 2-3 corners without any kind of warning from the team whatsoever. I don't know if he went off or not; if he didn't it is an impressive feat, maybe aided a little bit by the fact that the drivers aren't pushing very hard when they have full or near full tanks at the 1st stint of the races.

[raymondu999]

One thing that surprised me was that with the telemetry still out cold, they don't seem to be able to police the DRS activation, or simply didn't bother.

For example, Alonso activated his DRS actually way before the activation line on the pit straight on Lap 3. In fact his DRS deployment was a 2011/2012-style qualifying deployment where he basically mashed KERS and DRS as soon as he was full throttle:


Meanwhile, you can see that he hasn't quite passed the DRS marker board/DRS line to signify the DRS zone (black thingamabob to the left):


Rosberg, however, activates his DRS properly, at the proper timing:


Worth noting that Alonso's DRS was still capable of closing at this time, as seen here, before and after the DRS zone:



I picked up on it during the race, but was surprised to see no one else mention it yet (or if it has been mentioned - I missed it)

[Cam]

One thing that surprised me was that with the telemetry still out cold, they don't seem to be able to police the DRS activation, or simply didn't bother.
I picked up on it during the race, but was surprised to see no one else mention it yet (or if it has been mentioned - I missed it)

Big +1 (will have to give it to you on another thread). Very nice pickup. Why then was this overlooked? A mechnaical issues and flagrant disregard, are two separate things. Certainly Ferrari are prepared to have results overturned after the fact (see: Brazil 2012). Worth a protest?

[Pierce89]

One thing that surprised me was that with the telemetry still out cold, they don't seem to be able to police the DRS activation, or simply didn't bother.
I picked up on it during the race, but was surprised to see no one else mention it yet (or if it has been mentioned - I missed it)

Big +1 (will have to give it to you on another thread). Very nice pickup. Why then was this overlooked? A mechnaical issues and flagrant disregard, are two separate things. Certainly Ferrari are prepared to have results overturned after the fact (see: Brazil 2012). Worth a protest?

Blatant disregard? The DRS is supposedly controlled by FIA software to not be allowed to open up outside a DRS zone. You can't blame a software glitch on Ferrari.

[Cam]

One thing that surprised me was that with the telemetry still out cold, they don't seem to be able to police the DRS activation, or simply didn't bother.
I picked up on it during the race, but was surprised to see no one else mention it yet (or if it has been mentioned - I missed it)

Big +1 (will have to give it to you on another thread). Very nice pickup. Why then was this overlooked? A mechnaical issues and flagrant disregard, are two separate things. Certainly Ferrari are prepared to have results overturned after the fact (see: Brazil 2012). Worth a protest?

Blatant disregard? The DRS is supposedly controlled by FIA software to not be allowed to open up outside a DRS zone. You can't blame a software glitch on Ferrari.

I guess that's what I'm asking - who's at fault here. They all knew not to depress the DRS though, didn't they? It was certainly stated that was the case on the commentary. Here, you can see Alonso clearly deploy the DRS miles in front of the line...

I can understand a few meters either side of the line, but still on the last corner...... there's taking a liberty, then there's taking the pi55.

How does it normally work? Do they simply push the button and once they hit the line it triggers?

[zorog]

The button is supposed to do nothing until you are in the DRS zone, If you press it early (and the FIA system is working) there should be no effect.

[raymondu999]

Blatant disregard? The DRS is supposedly controlled by FIA software to not be allowed to open up outside a DRS zone. You can't blame a software glitch on Ferrari.

That's like saying "cheating is supposedly controlled by the invigorating to not be done during tests. You can't blame that on the student."

Sure the FiA system was broken. But the facts are that Fernando pushed the button where he shouldn't have. To me that leaves one of two possible explanations:
- he (genuinely) didn't remember that the activation was some way down, and just remembered to use DRS "on the pit straight" - in which case you have to wonder if their qualifying lap was then legal.
- he knew he had an excuse to plead memory shortage against the FiA, and knew that he had a get out of jail free card by saying, "how was I supposed to remember?"

If it was on purpose, I believe we can call it, as Cam says, "blatant disregard." If it was a genuine error - then less of the blame (in a moral/ethical sense) on Fernando. But I'm quite sure Vettel in Abu Dhabi 2012 qualifying and Hamilton in Spain 2012 qualifying were genuine underfueling mistakes too.

[Mandrake]

One thing that surprised me was that with the telemetry still out cold, they don't seem to be able to police the DRS activation, or simply didn't bother.
I picked up on it during the race, but was surprised to see no one else mention it yet (or if it has been mentioned - I missed it)

Big +1 (will have to give it to you on another thread). Very nice pickup. Why then was this overlooked? A mechnaical issues and flagrant disregard, are two separate things. Certainly Ferrari are prepared to have results overturned after the fact (see: Brazil 2012). Worth a protest?

I think I can remember a second case where DRS was activated without being allowed to. I cannot remember when and who it was, but he passed Rosberg on the straight and rosberg opened his DRS. There was no car in front and rosberg only openend the DRS halfway down the straight.

Can you confirm that Ray?

[radosav]

From Alonsos's Twitter interview :

@gabiolivaresb If in a non-DRS area you press the DRS botton does it activate?
FA: No, it doesn’t activate. The DRS is programmed only for the straights where it’s allowed to be used.