Return Of The Mighty V-10?

[SectorOne]

Best way to fix the sound:
http://www.thebigidea.co.nz/files/ZED43 ... ixer_0.jpg
Which they do already for your regular news anchor and Pavarotti or Lady Gaga. That would work for the hundreds of millions that watch on TV about 20 times a year.
For the 1-2 million that once a year get to be present at the venue, this will not work.
There, we went back to marketing again with a solution that would work for 99.9% if the income generators.

First of all neither Gaga nor Pavarotti has two people commentating their work as they are singing.
If they did, the sound would be as bad as an F1 broadcast. Why? Because people need to hear the commentators.

So how do we solve this problem? Easy, just watch natural sound broadcasts without commentators.
Absolutely nothing wrong with the sound there.

Commentator+race sounds will always sound bad because you have to compromise.

[TAG]

As far as the sound argument, I'm not missing it on TV at all. I didn't go see a race this year so next year will be my first live experience. However... on the television now I can hear things like

People moving in the pits, wheel guns clinking down when they drop them, you can hear the cars screech out of their pit box, you can hear the tire squeal in oversteer situations, you can hear the actual brakes locking not just see it, and most importantly you can hear the crowds cheer when an overtake happens. A very emotional part of the sport that wasn't audible previously.

I think that's more than a fair exchange.

[dans79]

Personally, I don't see whats so great about the old naturally aspirated v10s other than the fact they were so loud they made your ears ring for hours after the race if you didn't wear hearing protection. I Was sitting at turn 1 in Austin last year and this year, and by far this year was much more enjoyable. people talked to each other and discussed the race, instead of just sitting their like mindless zombies staring at the track with ear muffs on.

[GitanesBlondes]

As far as the sound argument, I'm not missing it on TV at all. I didn't go see a race this year so next year will be my first live experience. However... on the television now I can hear things like

People moving in the pits, wheel guns clinking down when they drop them, you can hear the cars screech out of their pit box, you can hear the tire squeal in oversteer situations, you can hear the actual brakes locking not just see it, and most importantly you can hear the crowds cheer when an overtake happens. A very emotional part of the sport that wasn't audible previously.

I think that's more than a fair exchange.

Engine sounds were part of the allure of grand prix racing for over a century.

If all you could hear were tire squeals, and the periodic brake locks, grand prix racing never would have garnered the type of following it did. I could hear crowds cheering during big moments in the V10 era, but it also helps when the races actually have spectators in the stands as opposed to numerous half-empty grandstands.

If you want little to no engine sounds, I'm sure a FIA sanctioned Prius spec series can be conjured up to meet the needs of fans who look for some purported emotional part of the sport that never was.

[FrukostScones]

As far as the sound argument, I'm not missing it on TV at all. I didn't go see a race this year so next year will be my first live experience. However... on the television now I can hear things like

People moving in the pits, wheel guns clinking down when they drop them, you can hear the cars screech out of their pit box, you can hear the tire squeal in oversteer situations, you can hear the actual brakes locking not just see it, and most importantly you can hear the crowds cheer when an overtake happens. A very emotional part of the sport that wasn't audible previously.

I think that's more than a fair exchange.

Engine sounds were part of the allure of grand prix racing for over a century.

If all you could hear were tire squeals, and the periodic brake locks, grand prix racing never would have garnered the type of following it did. I could hear crowds cheering during big moments in the V10 era, but it also helps when the races actually have spectators in the stands as opposed to numerous half-empty grandstands.

If you want little to no engine sounds, I'm sure a FIA sanctioned Prius spec series can be conjured up to meet the needs of fans who look for some purported emotional part of the sport that never was.

last Formula E race was great! and yeah, it's was only the ear damging V12 especially V10 or V8 NAE screaming that made F1 glorious.. Rooaaar T-Rex!

[Hail22]

As far as the sound argument, I'm not missing it on TV at all. I didn't go see a race this year so next year will be my first live experience. However... on the television now I can hear things like

People moving in the pits, wheel guns clinking down when they drop them, you can hear the cars screech out of their pit box, you can hear the tire squeal in oversteer situations, you can hear the actual brakes locking not just see it, and most importantly you can hear the crowds cheer when an overtake happens. A very emotional part of the sport that wasn't audible previously.

I think that's more than a fair exchange.

Engine sounds were part of the allure of grand prix racing for over a century.

If all you could hear were tire squeals, and the periodic brake locks, grand prix racing never would have garnered the type of following it did. I could hear crowds cheering during big moments in the V10 era, but it also helps when the races actually have spectators in the stands as opposed to numerous half-empty grandstands.

If you want little to no engine sounds, I'm sure a FIA sanctioned Prius spec series can be conjured up to meet the needs of fans who look for some purported emotional part of the sport that never was.

Amen Gitanes!

Here is a video comparison without any FoM bias (Re: Mic levels etc)...the V10 Minardi two seater is short shifting as you're all well aware of:



Also noticed a fan say in the video "What? Can't hear you mate, can't hear you its too quiet"

This video was taken by a fan during FP2 at the Melbourne Grand prix in 2004, the stands are filled...when you compare it to the video above with the Mclaren and Red Bull Renault turbo going around during FP2 in 2014...its a massive difference.

[Vettel Maggot]

That just makes me want to cry watching the old V10s and the new engines. What have they done?

Also look how many more grandstands and people there are in the old days. Track was PACKED.

[Hail22]

That just makes me want to cry watching the old V10s and the new engines. What have they done?

Also look how many more grandstands and people there are in the old days. Track was PACKED.

2004 the circuit was overfilled, if you noticed in the 2nd video most fans are packing up the ramp to the grandstands...standing room was at a premium those days.

[seinfeld]

the sound isnt that bad. I really love hearing them take off out the Pits. the turbo whistles and whooshes. then you hear the MGU's motor sound WICKED. its only when they are out on track is when it gets a big quieter. its because they dont have sensitive enough microphones, cause as I said. sounds great when a cameraman is right next to one leaving the pits. but on track cant hear them, they need to put a microphone either in each car. or put them in the corner rumble strips instead of behind the safety barriers/ walls where the marshallls stand as its too far away

[WaikeCU]

I like her screaming when I ride her, but I don't mind her roaring either

[turbof1]

A significant point I have not come across the simple fact a new
V10 with ers systems will never make as much noise as the V10's in the 2000's. Manufacturers have learned how to make engines, any engine, more efficient. Less energy wasted means less energy being translated into noise.

If you want the exact same noise back from the 2000's, then forget it. Not going to happen. You'll get more noise then current PU's, but you'll get underwelmed with such expectations.

[MOWOG]

you'll get underwelmed with such expectations.

As is so often the case in life, no?

[turbof1]

I'm only telling what the case will be. F1 went into a direction where efficiency counts the most. Even if you reverse the whole deal, manufacturers will still implement what they've learned and that is getting the most out of every drop of fuel. You can't unlearn what is learned.

And that is the correct way to go. After all, noise is nothing more then wasted energy for them. But that will also translate into more efficient, less noisy V10's. I hope everybody realises that.

[Andres125sx]

If all you could hear were tire squeals, and the periodic brake locks, grand prix racing never would have garnered the type of following it did. I could hear crowds cheering during big moments in the V10 era, but it also helps when the races actually have spectators in the stands as opposed to numerous half-empty grandstands.

Sorry but that´s only your assumption, IMO yes it would have garnered teh same type of following it did. Sound has never been the main aspect about racing it´s changed a lot during F1 history, and I didn´t see the stands half-empty at the end of the 80´s (when every top team used turbocharged engines) because turbo engines didn´t sound like previous ones

As I didn´t see more spectators after that period, when turbo was banned, so I only can think engine sound is just an add-on, but has never been as important as some of you state


OTOH I´ve seen stands half-empty last and previous seassons, and that was with V8 engines whose sound was pretty cool, not like V10s but much closer to those than to current V6, but even so stands were half-empty, so sorry but no, sound is not the problem, main problem is lack of competitiveness so the return of V10s will never solve anything

[GitanesBlondes]

If all you could hear were tire squeals, and the periodic brake locks, grand prix racing never would have garnered the type of following it did. I could hear crowds cheering during big moments in the V10 era, but it also helps when the races actually have spectators in the stands as opposed to numerous half-empty grandstands.

Sorry but that´s only your assumption, IMO yes it would have garnered teh same type of following it did. Sound has never been the main aspect about racing it´s changed a lot during F1 history, and I didn´t see the stands half-empty at the end of the 80´s (when every top team used turbocharged engines) because turbo engines didn´t sound like previous ones

As I didn´t see more spectators after that period, when turbo was banned, so I only can think engine sound is just an add-on, but has never been as important as some of you state


OTOH I´ve seen stands half-empty last and previous seassons, and that was with V8 engines whose sound was pretty cool, not like V10s but much closer to those than to current V6, but even so stands were half-empty, so sorry but no, sound is not the problem, main problem is lack of competitiveness so the return of V10s will never solve anything

Sound is an integral part of motorsports. Always has been, and always will be.

Trying to disregard sound as a non-starter for the whole race experience is foolish. F1 in particular garnered a huge reputation based purely on the design of the engines they were fielding (displacement, cylinders, rev range) and also the sound the engines were producing. I've never really understood this recent on-going rationalization by many to try and pretend that engine sound is irrelevant to the experience. Even at Le Mans during the Audi diesel domination, fans of racing would talk about how marvelous it would be to hear the sounds of the American pushrod V8's in the Corvette's howling down the Mulsanne Straight. Sound sells Andres, Bernie knows this, the race circuit promoters know this, and a fairly large amount of fans know this.

Try and think of F1 less as a pure engineering experience and more of a a mix of engineering and entertainment. It's not a road relevant race series, and never was. The entertainment part is really key as this is what drives a lot of what Bernie's currently doing. Everything is intertwined, but to make money, you have to address the entertainment side of things. Slipping ratings is something that's not going unnoticed by both Bernie and CVC as that directly impacts them when they need to renegotiate new TV deals. You cannot command the current figures if any TV broadcaster can point to a decrease in ratings. RTL's considerations of pulling out of F1 broadcasting has huge implications as it creates a domino effect.