Mclaren MP4-30 Honda

[Fede90]

Jenson Button McLaren-Honda 1:46.056 at 38°lap
Nico Rosberg Mercedes 1:42.062 at 43° lap

Diff = 3.994 sec

This means that they were at least with 200BHP less and we could presume that the chasiss is slow by 7 tenths. When Honda sorts out the problems McLaren will be batteling for the top 6.

I mark this down , we will see when and if McLaren will be able to run at max power

[maccafan]

Jenson Button McLaren-Honda 1:46.056 at 38°lap
Nico Rosberg Mercedes 1:42.062 at 43° lap

Diff = 3.994 sec

This means that they were at least with 200BHP less and we could presume that the chasiss is slow by 7 tenths. When Honda sorts out the problems McLaren will be batteling for the top 6.

Couple of laps before Alonsos macca broke down he was lapping 1.5s slower then hamilton. At that point in time he wad catching bulls by quite a margin per lap. This somehow indicates that they have a very good chassis, and i really hope they do not have a deficit of .7s in the chassis. I believe that they do not have a deficit in the chassis but their issue is only engine related. When they fix the engine i think they will be in the top five.

[maccafan]

Jenson Button McLaren-Honda 1:46.056 at 38°lap
Nico Rosberg Mercedes 1:42.062 at 43° lap

Diff = 3.994 sec

This means that they were at least with 200BHP less and we could presume that the chasiss is slow by 7 tenths. When Honda sorts out the problems McLaren will be batteling for the top 6.

Couple of laps before Alonsos macca broke down he was lapping 1.5s slower then hamilton. At that point in time he wad catching bulls by quite a margin per lap. This somehow indicates that they have a very good chassis, and i really hope they do not have a deficit of .7s in the chassis. I believe that they do not have a deficit in the chassis but their issue is only engine related. When they fix the engine i think they will be in the top five.

[Manoah2u]

Jenson Button McLaren-Honda 1:46.056 at 38°lap
Nico Rosberg Mercedes 1:42.062 at 43° lap

Diff = 3.994 sec

This means that they were at least with 200BHP less and we could presume that the chasiss is slow by 7 tenths. When Honda sorts out the problems McLaren will be batteling for the top 6.

Couple of laps before Alonsos macca broke down he was lapping 1.5s slower then hamilton. At that point in time he wad catching bulls by quite a margin per lap. This somehow indicates that they have a very good chassis, and i really hope they do not have a deficit of .7s in the chassis. I believe that they do not have a deficit in the chassis but their issue is only engine related. When they fix the engine i think they will be in the top five.

despite being genuinly disappointed by their position and not being the way they should from day 1, and despite being able to understand it either way - indeed, there is some promiss in the Mclaren.

i don't think they've 'advanced' that much in their chassis yet, there will probably be lots more to develop there but it's clearly hampered by the engine package. If their engine/ers did not cause so much setback, they could focus on the chassis more and improve that. Now, they'll have to deal with the engine/ers first. Problem imho is though, where is the cause? The tight chassis could very well be the main cause of the problems.

It's especially hurtful looking at the amount Ferrari has improved.

[Manoah2u]

Jenson Button McLaren-Honda 1:46.056 at 38°lap
Nico Rosberg Mercedes 1:42.062 at 43° lap

Diff = 3.994 sec

This means that they were at least with 200BHP less and we could presume that the chasiss is slow by 7 tenths. When Honda sorts out the problems McLaren will be batteling for the top 6.

Couple of laps before Alonsos macca broke down he was lapping 1.5s slower then hamilton. At that point in time he wad catching bulls by quite a margin per lap. This somehow indicates that they have a very good chassis, and i really hope they do not have a deficit of .7s in the chassis. I believe that they do not have a deficit in the chassis but their issue is only engine related. When they fix the engine i think they will be in the top five.

despite being genuinly disappointed by their position and not being the way they should from day 1, and despite being able to understand it either way - indeed, there is some promiss in the Mclaren.

i don't think they've 'advanced' that much in their chassis yet, there will probably be lots more to develop there but it's clearly hampered by the engine package. If their engine/ers did not cause so much setback, they could focus on the chassis more and improve that. Now, they'll have to deal with the engine/ers first. Problem imho is though, where is the cause? The tight chassis could very well be the main cause of the problems.

It's especially hurtful looking at the amount Ferrari has improved.

[diffuser]

Jenson Button McLaren-Honda 1:46.056 at 38°lap
Nico Rosberg Mercedes 1:42.062 at 43° lap

Diff = 3.994 sec

This means that they were at least with 200BHP less and we could presume that the chasiss is slow by 7 tenths. When Honda sorts out the problems McLaren will be batteling for the top 6.

That means absolutely nothing.
There is alot more involved that you're taking into consideration.

Button will not have adjusted the car in the same way than if he had 200 more HP. He may runs less down-force to compensate? Maybe he's carrying more fuel? Maybe he carrying less fuel cause he's not expecting to finish the race... who knows.

They've also said they have massive upgrades coming. They've been saying it since Barcelona and have yet to be able to do much cause of the PU issues. Those will eventually arrive and we have no idea how much of an improvement they will bring....


I hope you're right but you're basing your assumption on air.

[rich1701]

2004 all over again hopefully

[mikeerfol]

2004 all over again hopefully

Let's hope 2016 will be 2005 without reliability issues then

[FW17]

Alonso for spanish media; we were 3 digits down on horsepower.

What is 100HP in lap time,CCA?

According to Andrew Benson at BBC http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/formula1/31942251

1bhp is worth approximately 0.016s

100bhp = 1.6s

So as per Andrew Benson if the engine Had 800 HP less then, the Car still would be only 12.8 seCs slower

[taperoo2k]

Jenson Button McLaren-Honda 1:46.056 at 38°lap
Nico Rosberg Mercedes 1:42.062 at 43° lap

Diff = 3.994 sec

This means that they were at least with 200BHP less and we could presume that the chasiss is slow by 7 tenths. When Honda sorts out the problems McLaren will be batteling for the top 6.

That means absolutely nothing.
There is alot more involved that you're taking into consideration.

Button will not have adjusted the car in the same way than if he had 200 more HP. He may runs less down-force to compensate? Maybe he's carrying more fuel? Maybe he carrying less fuel cause he's not expecting to finish the race... who knows.

They've also said they have massive upgrades coming. They've been saying it since Barcelona and have yet to be able to do much cause of the PU issues. Those will eventually arrive and we have no idea how much of an improvement they will bring....


I hope you're right but you're basing your assumption on air.

Tbh it seems like McLaren Honda are using the first 4 races as one long extended test programme to gather data and find out precisely what's going on with the PU, all the while developing upgrades for the Chassis and the Power Unit. Alonso pace before his retirement was encouraging given where McLaren Honda started from. I doubt we've really seen what the MP4-30 is capable of due to the power unit issues, little point in bringing major updates to the car if they have to be modified later on to fit redesigned power unit components or to give away aero concepts that other teams can and will likely try to copy. Once Honda brings the upgrades, then I expect we'll see the Chassis start to be developed a lot more aggressively by McLaren. I've always thought that 2015 is a development year for McLaren Honda on the chassis and Power Unit side, with the aim of being competitive against the top teams in 2016.

[stevesingo]

Are the sector times from the race available? Comparing the MP4-30 to other cars at similar points in the race would indicate where the deficiencies are. If, as I expect S2 is good and S1&3 are bad, that would indicate a decent level of downforce and good chassis, but a lack of power.

[gary123]

First Button was on medium tyres. Same as rosberg. Second a left the 7 tenths to the chassis because they arent putting so much downforce. Button said that after the pit when he mounted the mediums he added more downforce to the front wing and the car changed massively. So they were carrying enough fuel to finish the race but the engine is very detuned. If you visit f1analisitecnica.com there is an article that shows mclaren stints. The maintained a very consistent pace and the degradation on mediums was better than Mercedes Williams or red bull.
My analyse was very poor only to demonstrate the lack of power that the Honda Power unit haves.

[stevesingo]

Downloaded the race on the F1 App.

Comparisons for up to L41.

S1 Fastest LH(H) 25.916
17th JB(M) 26.680 +2.86%. Faster than Alonso (Retired) and Merhi only

S1 has the 2nd 2/3 of the pit straight, a couple of low speed corners and a large sweeper ond only one acceleration zone.


S2 Fastest LH(H) 35.236
10th JB(M) 36.546 +3.585%. 0.25 behind the fastest Lotus 0.2 Faster than the fastest Force India

S2 has a good mix of low/med/high speed corners with 3 acceleration zones


S3 Fastest SV(H) 41.755
16th JB(M) 43.353 +3.687%. Perez, Verstappen (19 lap old Hards) and Mehri the only cars slower.

S3 has a couple of med speed corners and a couple of low speed corners, but 2 acceleration zones and a lond straight.

It would seem the MP4-30 is really losing out in the accelleration zones and straights. It is difficult to concluse what it is like on the med/high speed corners as the sector with the most med/high speed corners also has 3 acceleration zones.

It will be interestin to see how this changes through the season.

[stevesingo]

Comparisons for sector times on L24 against the midfield cars. (H6) denotes tyre fitted and laps done on that tyre. (S+-10) denotes the speed difference at the sector line.

S1
JB(M2) S269 26.801
RG(M8) S+19 26.202 -1.06%
FM(M19) S+15 26.971 +0.63%
MV(H3) S+7 26.781 +0.03%
DR(H5) S+15 26.390 -1.53%
SP(H6) S+23 26.475 -1.22%


S2
JB(M2) S127 36.814
RG(M8) S-2 37.146 +0.90%
FM(M19) S-4 37.810 +2.70%
MV(H3) S-4 36.724 -0.24%
DR(H5) S-1 37.315 +1.36%
SP(H6) S-1 37.085 +0.73%

S3
JB(M2) S261 43.353
RG(M8) S+6 43.379 +0.06%
FM(M19) S+8 43.937 +1.34%
MV(H3) S+8 43.338 -0.03%
DR(H5) S+12 43.343 -0.02%
SP(H6) S+9 43.654 +0.07%

Unfortunately, McLaren were on a different strategy to all except Lotus. Surprising to see that the Lotus is not much faster in S1 where we have 2/3 of the pit straight. This could be because they were not running a lot of down force which would pay dividends on the straight (they were 10kph faster in qualifying) and 19kph faster on the straight after turn 3 so presumably losing out in the long turn 3. This may imply that the MP4-30 is a little better in the corners when we consider the MP4-30 is faster than the Lotus in S2 and by the speed trap speeds may have better traction as the MP4-30 is 2kph up on the Lotus at the sector end speed trap. The MP4-30 is also surprisingly quicker in S3 with the full length back straight. Despite a 10kph speed advantage on the back straight in qualifying, the MP4-30 must be overcoming that speed deficit in turns 11-14. This again points to better cornering ability.

IMO, with more power the MP4-30 should be able to overcome the Lotus.

[aleks_ader]

Deleted WiFi problems