2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

[godlameroso]

This was in the Honda engine thread

http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/form ... 64120.html

Interesting things said by Hasegawa. Namely that he admits a weak engine, and the car has more downforce than last year. He also goes on to say that the engine is weak because that is it's limit for reliability reasons. That in terms of outright performance they're probably .5 seconds off Mercedes just like Renault, but cannot achieve that performance because of reliability reasons. Also interesting that they say that if the power unit became more powerful that maybe McLaren would go a different direction with the chassis.

"How far Honda's gone?
Hasegawa: On the racetrack, we are about 1.5 seconds behind Mercedes. This gap we can not close only to the engine safely. I join Renault's opinion and would say that pure half a second from a performance point. But if this half a second coming, McLaren may also react with the vehicle concept, and the tires are lighter in their work area. The one helps then the other."

"The new turbocharger was a further step in this direction?
Hasegawa: Yes, exactly. The turbocharger is now there to generate more electric power and feed it into the drive. We are now retrieve as much electric power capable as permitting regulations."

Does this mean the MGU-H can send 120KW straight to the MGU-K without the ES being involved?

"If the 2017er engine an evolution or a revolution be?
Hasegawa: I will not say that we are building a completely new engine now. It's not all bad. In some areas we need to make adjustments. In others, we need a new concept."

Finally
"Is a podium finish this year still possible?
Hasegawa: No. Only with luck. Our realistic goal is to regularly finish in the points."

[PlatinumZealot]

It is very annoying when people keep using the monaco race to benchmark Mclaren's chasssis. Really guys? If you were paying attention the MP4 had trouble to turn on its tyres.... Eric said it again and again; the car had great mecahnical balance and agility (a good measure of the chassis) but they made a mistake in the aero setup and they didn't get the tyres switched on. You can't blame the chassis for that. Remember even RedBull could not get the tyres switched on in Baku all becsuse the level of downforce they chose to run. Does that mean that their chassis is bad? No. It just mean the setup was compromised.

Let us wait for silverstone or even hungary. It should be easy to turn on the tyres there. No need for mcalren to compromise the downforce at that track.

Surely the whole point of the chassis is to get the most out of the tyres and as a secondary concern - be a mounting point for everything else.

If Mclaren have tyre problems that is their issue. Mclaren and TR are pretty even on both chassis and PU.

It changes race to race. In monaco merc had the issue on the US. In canada it was kimi. In Baku it was the bulls. A few other examples in other races this year with known top chassis. The chassis could have an influence on how easy the csr is to set up I agree. But there are times when the engineers just screw up (mercedes in singapore ). Eric boulkier admitted as such after Monaco so i eill give the McLaren chassis the benefit of the doubt for now.

[McG]

Read it. EFFICIENT AERO.
Anyone going to disagree with Alonso?

http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/alons ... ia-792183/

[techman]

do u believe what EB says, they are feeding alonso all sorts of wrong info to keep him happy and we found out how much inefficient the chassis was in monaco, when mclaren were horrible in pace there after falsely claiming 3rd best chasssis, next hungary is a track we should look out for, and where they really are. alonso is talikng about thr low DF rear wing brought to baku,, infact all team brought low DF setup to baku, maybe they will bring it in austria

[godlameroso]

Actually next track may suit them better, it's a very short lap and plenty of scope for recovery on the MGU-H side. Deployment won't be an issue so they may get more aggressive with the aero.

[diffuser]

http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/form ... gn=Formel1


The McLaren are in the top-speed table mostly behind. Is there only the engine fault, or the car has too much air resistance?
Hasegawa: Both. The car has more downforce this year. And our motor has too little power. Even if McLaren would take the same wing setting like the other teams, we would be in top speed and not forward.

I think what he's saying that is "if we had the same wings settings as everyone else, Our Top speed wouldn't be any further ahead that we are now.

Renault believes that they lie on the motor based half a second behind Mercedes. How far Honda's gone?
Hasegawa: On the racetrack , we are about 1.5 seconds behind Mercedes. This gap we can not close only to the engine safely. I join Renault's opinion and would say that pure half a second from a performance point. But if this half a second coming, McLaren may also react with the vehicle concept, and the tires are lighter in their work area. The one helps then the other.

Here he's saying that the PU unit like Renault's (on average) is .5 of a second a lap down. If Honda could give McLaren that .5 of a second per lap they might be able to make use of that and close the gap further.

[SameSame]

Wow so the only difference between McLaren and Red Bull is chassis according to him?

[Sayeman]

"HONDA: PODIUM OR A VICTORY WITHIN THE NEXT TWO YEARS"
“We are not satisfied, but our results this year have been reasonable, considering where we came from,” he told Auto Motor und Sport. “Yes, we are on schedule. And we are optimistic about a podium or a victory within the next two years.”

http://www.grandprix247.com/2016/06/27/ ... two-years/

[Sayeman]

"HONDA PLANNING F1 ENGINE SUPPLY TO SECOND TEAM"

“That way, you generate more data and experience and learn more quickly,” the Japanese told Auto Motor und Sport. “But in our current situation, there are not many teams who want our engine, and each team already has an engine.

“But we are planning on expanding our organisation so that when there is interest, we could supply a second team,” Hasegawa added.

http://www.grandprix247.com/2016/06/27/ ... cond-team/

Dennis needs to let go, mclaren is hurting Honda's progress, let them supply to a second team, Mclaren will be the first to reap the benefits.

[godlameroso]

https://youtu.be/J_xzgIJXrM8?t=3m23s The McLaren isn't far off aero wise, just has a Honda engine. No point in badmouthing them, it is what it is. Honda simply has to do a better job, it's frustrating that it's going to take them so long, and even that isn't a guarantee. 11 Tokens can change a lot, then again all they could be doing is also laying the groundwork for a new concept. If the concept revolves around combustion, they may need to rearrange the block architecture in certain aspects, as well as the ancillaries intake and fuel system before they can implement the combustion upgrade. On top of that they'd have to introduce a new turbo, with corresponding piping to match the new combustion characteristics. This takes moderately more than the tokens they have available, not to mention it would leave no scope for any ERS upgrades should they become available. If Mclaren fails to overtake Toro Rosso by Silverstone, it's safe to say they've gone full steam ahead 2017.

[SameSame]

Good footage thanks. Wow that section is extremely high speed.

Not saying McLaren aero is good/bad but a comparison like this during qualifying would have been great as its equal fuel loads and tyre life. Hopefully they can do well in S3 in Austria and we can see more onboard footage in Silverstone.

[techman]

cant wait till next year. hopefully the fia release the power index of all engines, and then we can debate properly, which teams is lacking good aero,. Its the best move by fia to show the world the difference is all going to be made through the chassis. it pretty evident when EB tells to public about how good the chassis is and will extremelycompetitive in monaco given its nautre, only to be a laughing stock in monaco this time, shows how much EB is scared to expose their own inefficiencies thus blaming it on honda and holding them to prevent them supplying teams like TR. Next year the truth will be out.

[diffuser]

Wow so the only difference between McLaren and Red Bull is chassis according to him?

Yeah.....politcally what does he have to gain by saying they're worse?

[Thunder]

Honda will be 'very close' to Mercedes in 2017, says McLaren
http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/honda ... en-793133/

While i would wish that everyone around the Team would refrain from saying things like the Headline that Article gives hope that Honda is on the right way for next Year and just how much more Time Merc had to develop the PU.

“But now we have to be realistic about what we are doing and we are building up. When you look at Mercedes, it took them four years to build the engine before they got the to track and nobody knew what they are doing before. So they turned up and did a good job.

“For us it is three years only, but for two years we are under the radar of racing, so people are saying, ‘what are you doing?’ But we are just doing the same, going the same path. It takes time.”

And about poaching outside Engineers and the change of Leadership at Honda.

Boullier said he was also encouraged by how Honda had reacted under new management, following the arrival of Yusuke Hasegawa as its new F1 chief earlier this year.

“These people have more of a racing mindset,” he said. “We have a very good relationship with them and their understanding of issues and expectations are easier.”


Boullier did suggest, however, that there had been some compromise in Honda’s previous reluctance to hire staff from other companies to help its progress.

“It [hiring outsiders] is not key to improve, but it helps," he said. "They have a different approach now, everything moved halfway and it is fine.”

[ALO_Power]

Well, my view is the same. That they are on good route (both of them) and that probably 2017 will see the team in a top position. However, these claims from Honda that podium/win will come during 2 years time quite worries me a bit. (Next year was supposed to be a fight for the title or constant top performance) That shows that they don't know exactly which route to take and if it's gonna work or not. Supplying other teams is not a bad idea, Mercedes does it, Ferrari does it, didn't hurt anyone (the opposite). However, if your goal is to get one victory or one podium in 2 years then the game is lost already...

Anyway, I will still wait eagerly for 2017.