Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

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Mark4211
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by Mark4211 » Fri Oct 21, 2016 4:20 pm

Aero sensors during FP1

https://streamable.com/nihr
Watch the Annotated Wheel Adjustments series,
https://vimeo.com/mark4211.

lio007
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by lio007 » Thu Oct 27, 2016 8:44 pm

Additional cooling exits:

Morteza
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by Morteza » Fri Oct 28, 2016 10:30 am

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"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

dero
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by dero » Fri Oct 28, 2016 11:37 am

360° Video of Pit Stop Training.
At 2:23 you can see/hear the car using only an electric motor.
Maybe someone finds it interesting. I'm curious if they use the actual MGU-K, battery and inverter setup or of they have something more basic.
EDIT: After listening to it a few times it sounds like a very low rpm motor - of course we don't know the gearing and so on....

FPV GTHO
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by FPV GTHO » Sat Oct 29, 2016 11:25 pm

Renault and Ferrari can use the MGUK to restart the engine, wouldn't be surprised if Renault went ahead and still developed the electric only pit mode

carisi2k
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by carisi2k » Sat Nov 12, 2016 12:33 am

Anything interesting on the Red Bulls at Interlagos?

lio007
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by lio007 » Sat Nov 12, 2016 7:20 am

carisi2k wrote:Anything interesting on the Red Bulls at Interlagos?
I don't think so. The only thing I have seen is a ball, maybe a camera, in front of the TagHeuer Logo on Max' car:

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by AMuS

And a little bit of flow-viz on the diffusor on Max' car:
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Morteza
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by Morteza » Thu Nov 24, 2016 4:16 pm

Abu Dhabi - Thursday

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"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

Ozan
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by Ozan » Sat Nov 26, 2016 6:31 pm

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Abu Dhabi Saturday
copyrights: Autosport http://www.autosport.com/news/report.ph ... t-exciting

shady
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by shady » Tue Jan 10, 2017 10:02 pm

turbof1 wrote:But that effectively increases AoA. Given the current ruleset, I don't think you can construct a rear wing which increases AoA when rake lowers.

Look SR71, you have a bright mind. But from time to time you can be as stubborn as a stone pillar. There are 3 or 4 people all saying the same. Put your feelings on this aside and think it through.

moving on.
SR71 may have been stubborn but he was right in the end, and having the most relevant discussion towards the performance envelope of the car at the time...

SR71
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by SR71 » Sun Jan 22, 2017 11:31 pm

shady wrote:
turbof1 wrote:But that effectively increases AoA. Given the current ruleset, I don't think you can construct a rear wing which increases AoA when rake lowers.

Look SR71, you have a bright mind. But from time to time you can be as stubborn as a stone pillar. There are 3 or 4 people all saying the same. Put your feelings on this aside and think it through.

moving on.
SR71 may have been stubborn but he was right in the end, and having the most relevant discussion towards the performance envelope of the car at the time...
Wow, thank you. I may lack the technical lingo to defend my position but it still seemed quite obvious what they were doing.

Thanks again!

roon
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by roon » Mon Jan 23, 2017 12:25 am

SR71- I think for most people, including myself, its counterintuitive to imagine that a rear wing might tend to stall as you reduce angle-of-attack. Because stall is more often associated with too much AoA, rather than too little. However I think you were on to something. With a deeply cambered wing one can image that the topside could indeed stall behind the front lip if angle-of-attack is reduced. In a multi-element wing this might be even more critical. Such a 'dead zone' on the topside of the main element might block the entry into the slot gap, stalling the upper element.

One might also imagine that in the same scenario feeding too much air under the wing, as AoA is reduced, might encourage detachment sooner, although I'm less sure about this than I am about the effect of a stall-zone blocking off a slot gap entry.

Anyway, thanks for the interesting proposal. I think you were on the right track. If anyone's interested the discussion spanned pages 29-32. Thanks shady for bringing up the topic again.

turbof1
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by turbof1 » Fri Feb 03, 2017 11:09 am

SR71 wrote:
shady wrote:
turbof1 wrote:But that effectively increases AoA. Given the current ruleset, I don't think you can construct a rear wing which increases AoA when rake lowers.

Look SR71, you have a bright mind. But from time to time you can be as stubborn as a stone pillar. There are 3 or 4 people all saying the same. Put your feelings on this aside and think it through.

moving on.
SR71 may have been stubborn but he was right in the end, and having the most relevant discussion towards the performance envelope of the car at the time...
Wow, thank you. I may lack the technical lingo to defend my position but it still seemed quite obvious what they were doing.

Thanks again!
So my apologies to dismiss the subject that fast.

I'm not entirely sure what to believe in this subject, and given most of us did not give it enough thought and there's more behind it, I suggest we split the subject off into a separate thread to bring it bit more under the spotlight and to get a working understanding what is really going on. Anybody objections against that?

Big Mangalhit
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by Big Mangalhit » Fri Feb 03, 2017 2:54 pm

I think we just need Bhall to come here and explain, again, that if the wing stalls on the straight by reducing its angle of attack then the wing will lose DF and then the rake will increase again because the car is no longer squatting under high DF. That will put the wing on the original position with then will regain DF and squat again thus stalling thus.......

This will create a resonance effect that will have the car wobbling like that Ferrari front wing he always shows.

Its much more easy to have the car squatting to lose AoA and thus DF and drag (but not by flow separation) to a point it will no longer squat further and stay in that balance point, when it breaks it will regain the high rake and high AoA for the corner.

SR71
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Re: Red Bull RB12 TAG-Heuer

Post by SR71 » Fri Feb 03, 2017 5:47 pm

Big Mangalhit wrote:I think we just need Bhall to come here and explain, again, that if the wing stalls on the straight by reducing its angle of attack then the wing will lose DF and then the rake will increase again because the car is no longer squatting under high DF. That will put the wing on the original position with then will regain DF and squat again thus stalling thus.......

This will create a resonance effect that will have the car wobbling like that Ferrari front wing he always shows.

Its much more easy to have the car squatting to lose AoA and thus DF and drag (but not by flow separation) to a point it will no longer squat further and stay in that balance point, when it breaks it will regain the high rake and high AoA for the corner.
OR..... if you're using a trick suspensions and have more than enough DF to keep the car squatted from areas OTHER than the rear wing then you'll be able to maintain the stalled wing throughout the straight.

If the rear suspension gets Uber soft on the straights and the pivot point is close to the front axel the rear diffuser should be able to bring the rear down and maintain it while also being the most efficient DF produced on the car. A perfect situation basically. A very trick suspension is key here.

The situation you described is thinking inside the box and that's how we got into this mess in the first place. You can bet your house RB's pocket book buys engineers who do not think inside the box. A rare breed indeed.



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