Ferrari's flexing floor + Rear Wing

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Wigan301072
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Ferrari's flexing floor + Rear Wing

Post by Wigan301072 » Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:12 am

Every season at least one team falls foul of accusations of illegal flexing parts. This season it's Ferrari's car.

At the race in Bahrain one of the commentators said that he saw something unusual going on with Ferrari's car, and that teams should look into it.. Within 24 hours Red Bull along with a couple of other teams were shouting foul.

It appears that some slow motion replays filmed at Bahrain and at the recent two day test in Bahrain, that Ferrari's floor us flexing in a limited area towards the track at high speeds, and that Ferrari's rear wing and defuser are also flexingdown towards the track.

There small area that appears to be flexing on Ferrari's floor, is located just below the Shell and UPS logos on both side pods. The tech drawings I have seen concerning this area of the show a small triangular Winglet, created by a slit cut into the floor. After viewing a number of videos, I must admit that this small area does seem to flex, but in my opinion the not enough to warrant further investigation.

However the rear wing issue is another issue.. As the car approaches about 3/4 of the Ferrari's top speed, it is clearly flexing down towards the race track.

Ferrari aren't new to this issue, a number of times they have faced allegations such as this, and over the years so have Red Bull, Honda amongst several others.

Yes Ferrari's Rear Wing and floor have passed inspection, but me there are some problems with the tests themselves!!!

Let's tackle the floor first, flex tests are performed towards the front of the floor and the floor area directly in front of the rear wheels. Ferrari's. The area where flexing allegations are rising from are not tested, despite there being no rule in the FIA's rules that say this area can't be tested.

The rear wing rules are clear though, the rear wing isn't allowed to flex. And in my opinion the FIA should act on this immediately.

Flexing rear wings can aid in increasing speed without decreasing down force to a level which effects handling especially in high speed corners, and help create a small amount of extra speed on the straights.

These problems could be solved if the FIA were to mount sensors on/in the areas of concerned, and then tested these cars at high speed.

Ferrari are also the only team with two vertical pylons that attach to the rear wing, which some teams have suggested aid in the movement of the rear wing. Each pylon disrupts airflow and having two doubles the negative effect on the rear wing.

I know that all cars have to pass a lot of tests inorder to race, but the area's where flexing a

wesley123
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Re: Ferrari's flexing floor + Rear Wing

Post by wesley123 » Sat Apr 22, 2017 8:40 pm

Wigan301072 wrote:
Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:12 am
Flexing rear wings can aid in increasing speed without decreasing down force to a level which effects handling especially in high speed corners, and help create a small amount of extra speed on the straights.
They flex and thus obviously have a reduced angle of attack, which means less downforce. The sole purpose is to reduce drag. Indirectly this would allow the team to run more downforce, as the drag would be lower.

I noticed the flexing too, and I don't get the hype. At least not anymore. Everyone has been doing this to some degree for the past 15 years(remember various incidents with rear wings breaking off between 2001-2005?). The problem is that you can't really do much against it, sure, you can raise static tests once more, but that does nothing for the trickery that is going on on the track.
"Bite my shiny metal ass" - Bender

SiLo
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Re: Ferrari's flexing floor + Rear Wing

Post by SiLo » Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:36 pm

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Felipe Baby!

mep
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Re: Ferrari's flexing floor + Rear Wing

Post by mep » Sun Apr 23, 2017 2:21 pm

Let´s be a bit more careful before calling a team cheater. Not everything is done deliberately, some of these parts are developed in really short time and last minute changes are common. Parts are pushed to be as thin as possible; some of them then turn out to be too soft. It might be that Ferrari does not want this floor to be flexible because it is aerodynamically worse. The cars are checked by scrutinizers, which can also demand a part to be improved for the next GP without a specific paragraph in the rules for it. This apparently has already happened because Ferrari reinforced the part with a metallic section. There is no intentional cheating behind, case closed.

F1NAC
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Re: Ferrari's flexing floor + Rear Wing

Post by F1NAC » Sun Apr 23, 2017 2:42 pm

remember that this thing also passed all the tests

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mt6OH-kD88M

Wigan301072
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Re: Ferrari's flexing floor + Rear Wing

Post by Wigan301072 » Wed Apr 26, 2017 3:35 pm

I never called a team a cheater, I said that they broke rules on flexing that clearly state rear wings must not flex.

Secondly, I do not believe that a team such as ferrari who have a wind tunnel and computer simulators, some of the best designers and engineers in F1 didn't see the effect these issues had on their car.

The computer simulations I have seen clearly show these issues occurring. Any one with eyesight can see these areas flexing.

I also stated that in my opinion the flexing floor is passable within the rules.

Rear Wings that flex, run a higher risk of rear wing failure, which has happened over the last ten years on several occasions. Which when they fail, throw a huge amount of carbon fibre onto the track endangering other drivers.

A classic example of the damage that can be caused by failing elements, was shown when the t-wing on bottas' car caused huge damage to the floor of verstappens car.

I also proposed a change in the way f1 cars are tested.

A) the area where the floor flexes on the Ferrari below the side pods, are able to be tested under current rules, despite the floors only being tested at the front and on the floor directly in front of the rear wheel.

B) Ferrari ran sensors on the rear wing and floor during pre season testing, and this could be applied by the FIA on all cars whilst on tract testing. The two sensors in these areas only need to measure the angle of flexing, and the speed of the car. Such sensor are small, and this method of testing could act along with the static tests.

Just a few seasons ago, Red Bull and Ferrari had front wings that flexed down to the track during races, despite the fact that their front wings passing the static weight tests. The FIA acted then and should act now...

F1NAC
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Re: Ferrari's flexing floor + Rear Wing

Post by F1NAC » Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:39 pm

It's just cleverly engineered. does it flex during scrutineering? Nope, it passes. People cried when RB had that uber flexi front wing during 2010 season, even video evidence and FIA raised the force on scrutineering. Car passed=legal.

Nickel
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Re: Ferrari's flexing floor + Rear Wing

Post by Nickel » Thu Apr 27, 2017 3:05 am

I don't agree. The rules are written around passing certain tests. If you pass those tests then you're meeting the letter of the rule. This whole spirit of the rule business is hogwash.

The rules state "must not flex more than X, with Y load applied at Z point"

If it meets the requirement then it's legal. The rule makers are free to change the rules I suppose but that doesn't mean anyone is cheating. In F1, you must push the envelope on all fronts.

ENGINE TUNER
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Re: Ferrari's flexing floor + Rear Wing

Post by ENGINE TUNER » Thu Apr 27, 2017 3:43 am

Ferrari went to court to have the DDD banned with their argument based on the "spirit" of the rules/regulations.... they lost.

There is NO such thing as the "spirit" of the rules.



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