FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

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zac510
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by zac510 » Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:41 am

It's my observation that it's mostly the bottom half of the grid go off the track. If there were any entertainment in a driver getting stuck in the gravel, it will instead be immediately written off as poor driving by a driver in a low grid position. The top drivers just don't go off the circuit nearly as often so this fantasy that top drivers will get punished for mistakes will rarely come alive.

Giblet
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by Giblet » Fri Apr 21, 2017 11:32 am

The current level of safety in the sport is because of people in the sport constantly looking to make it safer.

Either you think no safety regs ever should have been installed, or you think that for some reason, current F1 is exactly as safe as it needs to be.

After Jules accident, should the FIA have NOT come up with the VSC?
Before I do anything I ask myself “Would an idiot do that?” And if the answer is yes, I do not do that thing. - Dwight Schrute

cplchanb
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by cplchanb » Fri Apr 21, 2017 1:55 pm

Giblet wrote:
Fri Apr 21, 2017 11:32 am
The current level of safety in the sport is because of people in the sport constantly looking to make it safer.

Either you think no safety regs ever should have been installed, or you think that for some reason, current F1 is exactly as safe as it needs to be.

After Jules accident, should the FIA have NOT come up with the VSC?
Imo the idea of vsc is good
But the implementation and execution if it needs to be improved. It is being used way too liberally the last couple of years where it has decided races and championships for incidents where it wasn't really necessary to use it. Do they even use double waved yellows anymore or has Fia become so distrustful of a drivers ability to adhere to the flag rules that they throw vsc every time there's a car off "near" a corner....

The_table
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by The_table » Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:23 pm

What is the problem with vsc again? the fact that they "waste" laps? maybe they should freeze the lap count while under vsc?
(The problem is that they would probably end up in trouble for fuel :/ ... )

cplchanb
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by cplchanb » Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:02 pm

The_table wrote:
Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:23 pm
What is the problem with vsc again? the fact that they "waste" laps? maybe they should freeze the lap count while under vsc?
(The problem is that they would probably end up in trouble for fuel :/ ... )
IMO theres no need to slow down the rest of the lap... just impose the VSC on the sector or 1 flag zone before and after...They have the tech to track speeds

Jolle
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by Jolle » Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:08 pm

With this the horrible F4 accident in mind and the motorbike deaths in the last few years (drivers getting run over), maybe the next level of safety is a more active one. So far the FIA only worked on building more structures, better chassis, more equipment around the drivers heads and a few procedures (like the VSC). What if, trough the ECU there is a max speed differential on certain parts of the track?

If a driver slows down a lot, it's picked up by GPS and other drivers are first warned (a few corners ahead, a racetrack is pretty predictable) and an automatic speedlimit on that section (for instance, "slow car + 50km/h)

This system could also be used to "punish" driving outside the lines, on the tarmac where once gravel traps were.

with taking an active role in not crashing (to hard), F1 on a road safety level gets more relevant as well.

The_table
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by The_table » Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:50 pm

I guess the back of a F4 car is a very weird structure to crash into compared to a concrete block (is that still how nosecones are tested?) and in the footage you could see that the car was not flat on the ground when the other car crashed into it, it got lifted up, it looked like the other car went half into it and half underneath it, splitting the nosecone of the car in half horizontally. (The top half shattering and the bottom half not, or at least not as intended.)

cplchanb
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by cplchanb » Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:47 pm

Jolle wrote:
Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:08 pm
With this the horrible F4 accident in mind and the motorbike deaths in the last few years (drivers getting run over), maybe the next level of safety is a more active one. So far the FIA only worked on building more structures, better chassis, more equipment around the drivers heads and a few procedures (like the VSC). What if, trough the ECU there is a max speed differential on certain parts of the track?

If a driver slows down a lot, it's picked up by GPS and other drivers are first warned (a few corners ahead, a racetrack is pretty predictable) and an automatic speedlimit on that section (for instance, "slow car + 50km/h)

This system could also be used to "punish" driving outside the lines, on the tarmac where once gravel traps were.

with taking an active role in not crashing (to hard), F1 on a road safety level gets more relevant as well.
I don't think it would work well....the sudden deceleration from 200km to 50 will for sure damage the drivers neck. Even if it was possible I don't think the system would be able to react in time to this type of situation. At that point there wouldn't be much point in using this system since by then there would be enough time in 99% of the cases to see and react to the situation.

cplchanb
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by cplchanb » Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:50 pm

The_table wrote:
Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:50 pm
I guess the back of a F4 car is a very weird structure to crash into compared to a concrete block (is that still how nosecones are tested?) and in the footage you could see that the car was not flat on the ground when the other car crashed into it, it got lifted up, it looked like the other car went half into it and half underneath it, splitting the nosecone of the car in half horizontally. (The top half shattering and the bottom half not, or at least not as intended.)
I think in this situation the only way of mitigating damage and injury for a head on collision is to improve the crash structure. The driver wasn't particularly driving at insane speeds but the nose was just not designed to sustain a full force impact like that. Unfortunately though that would mean a spike in costs which will hinder young amateur driver careers

cplchanb
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by cplchanb » Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:51 pm

The_table wrote:
Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:50 pm
I guess the back of a F4 car is a very weird structure to crash into compared to a concrete block (is that still how nosecones are tested?) and in the footage you could see that the car was not flat on the ground when the other car crashed into it, it got lifted up, it looked like the other car went half into it and half underneath it, splitting the nosecone of the car in half horizontally. (The top half shattering and the bottom half not, or at least not as intended.)
I think in this situation the only way of mitigating damage and injury for a head on collision is to improve the crash structure. The driver wasn't particularly driving at insane speeds but the nose was just not designed to sustain a full force impact like that. Unfortunately though that would mean a spike in costs which will hinder young amateur driver careers

strad
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by strad » Fri Apr 21, 2017 9:35 pm

You do realize the ultimate conclusion of constantly pushing for more and more safety is in the end driverless cars with no spectators allowed anywhere near the track.
Motorsport without danger is like cooking without salt
Sir Stirling Moss

Jolle
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by Jolle » Fri Apr 21, 2017 9:52 pm

strad wrote:
Fri Apr 21, 2017 9:35 pm
You do realize the ultimate conclusion of constantly pushing for more and more safety is in the end driverless cars with no spectators allowed anywhere near the track.
Maybe they should hook up all the simulators and run it throug a big Renderman stack so it looks real, feels real but all CGI :P

Andres125sx
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by Andres125sx » Sat Apr 22, 2017 10:22 am

strad wrote:
Fri Apr 21, 2017 9:35 pm
You do realize the ultimate conclusion of constantly pushing for more and more safety is in the end driverless cars with no spectators allowed anywhere near the track.
That would provide some spectacular racing cars. Imagine if those could corner at 15G safely :twisted:

The_table
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by The_table » Sat Apr 22, 2017 2:09 pm

strad wrote:
Fri Apr 21, 2017 9:35 pm
You do realize the ultimate conclusion of constantly pushing for more and more safety is in the end driverless cars with no spectators allowed anywhere near the track.
I bet the ultimate conclusion of constantly pushing for faster and faster cars is exactly the same... :mrgreen:
(Weight reduction, comfort of your driver,etc)

strad
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Re: FIA ruining F1 in the name of safety

Post by strad » Sat Apr 22, 2017 6:25 pm

That would provide some spectacular racing cars. Imagine if those could corner at 15G safely :twisted:
It would be boring as hell.
Motorsport without danger is like cooking without salt
Sir Stirling Moss