2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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NAPI10
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by NAPI10 » Wed Jun 14, 2017 4:48 pm

Perez insist, there was no team order & it's all media bullshit :D :D -
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-p ... rs-917912/

FI strategy grp & paddock leaders are equally responsible for this saga. Firm direction was lacking in all radio communications with drivers. Nevertheless, it was a good learning lesson.

drriapg
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by drriapg » Wed Jun 14, 2017 8:49 pm

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/5b/5b7e0fdd ... 9c4ce1.jpg
[/quote]

Okay here's why I think SFi need to really let Perez know that he has to get his act together:

From the start of the season he's been a bit too vocal from last year about how inept the car has been and even though SFi have improved and are the best in the midfield currently, he's saying he's been driving the wheels off the car to get a good result. Someone in this conversation thread pointed out brilliantly that in the Canadian GP Ocon one up'ed him, had great race pace, strategy and tire conservation to have a fair go at a rival and if you noticed throughout the season, he first struggled in qualifying but he's taken care of that aspect and with his race craft been doing so well thus far with the same machinery. I'm really impressed by this rookie and expect great things for him.

But I really felt Sergio let down the team, he was radioed 5 times and it was a fair deal, the place would have been swapped back! I didn't have that information beforehand and that's what made me mad, I read it on jamesallenf1 and they apparently looked up the radio logs to get this information. Like the article says, on any other given Sunday in the prior years SFi wouldn't have gotten so much spotlight for this gaffe but now that they are a solid mid-fielder and a potential podium finisher all eyes will be on them. So SFi should have been more assertive to give up the position temporarily or forced him to come into pits, but that's in hindsight like I mentioned already. I'm glad that Vijay Mallaya has tweeted about coming up with a strategy if such a situation does occur and the team can be more assertive.

On the other hand, just for comparison's sake, Sergio is a great talent but talent only takes you so far, but he's not a pay driver - he's paid a salary from SFi so he's a salaried employee for all intensive purposes, so if I were in his shoes I'd listen to my employer. He brings a bit of the sponsors from Mexico, so what? Tomorrow if Ocon gets it from France should he throw his weight around the team like what Sergio is doing?

Work ethic is another aspect that plays a big part in a racer's career. The one shining example I'd like to take is Michael Schumacher, remind me one time in his career he's talked negatively about the team or any actions that has shown him in that light? I think this is one of the reasons he's been so successful. I haven't seen that in Hamilton or Alonso - both were quick to talk about sabotage and team conspiring to make the driver lose a championship at one or more points in their career, but I do see a lot of Schumacher's ethic in Ocon, he's respectful and grateful of the team, good work ethic, talented and brings a lot of positive spirit to the team. I was just amazed how mature he was in his approach, "My time will come" wow, that's a winner right there.

Oh and also I'm not a Max Verstappen fan, in the previous iterations of the F1 car he might have looked spectacular with his moving under the braking stunt to block drivers, but I doubt you'll see all that tactics from cars of this generation (infact I haven't seen it all season thus far) simple reason being more downforce, grip and shorter braking distance, there's no time for all this monkey tricks.

That's my 2 cents, if Sergio wants to continue in this team, he should respect their decisions and I do sincerely hope SFi become more assertive, if he feels he's too good for the outfit, well I'd be the first to wish him good luck and be on his way. I'm very excited about Ocon and the prospect of getting either another great rookie or Kubica (wishful thinking) to take this seat, cheers!
[/quote]

Even though I do not completely agree with you, at least this time you're giving good arguments, what I did not liked at all (if I may say) was the previous comment where no ideas were exposed, just aggressive comments.

I apologize if I over reacted, I'm just frustrated to see that it does not matter how Checo does good things for a long time (like being 15 races in the points, like all the podiums, like all the points, like all the development efforts and good environment in the latest years), it all disappears the moment he does something "wrong" like trying to thrive, but he was just doing what he always does and what has given FI all the podiums they have but one. Stating that another rookie or Kubica would do a better job just makes me sad.


Another thing, I also believe that Ocon is awesome.

Once again, sorry to the forum and community for my aggressive entrance, I have passion for this sport and at least all this has make me finally register and start writing instead of just reading, since I've been reading you for a long time now.

raksf1
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by raksf1 » Thu Jun 15, 2017 7:26 am

Force India Formula 1 team considering name change...


http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/130141

Samraj_official
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by Samraj_official » Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:14 pm

raksf1 wrote:Force India Formula 1 team considering name change...


http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/130141
That would be bad,the name "Force india" reminds of old independent non-manufacturer F1 teams who didn't use the team owner's name in the team title,unlike today's Ferrari,Williams,Sauber,McLaren etc.,

IamLegend
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by IamLegend » Thu Jun 15, 2017 3:13 pm

Okay here's why I think SFi need to really let Perez know that he has to get his act together:

From the start of the season he's been a bit too vocal from last year about how inept the car has been and even though SFi have improved and are the best in the midfield currently, he's saying he's been driving the wheels off the car to get a good result. Someone in this conversation thread pointed out brilliantly that in the Canadian GP Ocon one up'ed him, had great race pace, strategy and tire conservation to have a fair go at a rival and if you noticed throughout the season, he first struggled in qualifying but he's taken care of that aspect and with his race craft been doing so well thus far with the same machinery. I'm really impressed by this rookie and expect great things for him.

But I really felt Sergio let down the team, he was radioed 5 times and it was a fair deal, the place would have been swapped back! I didn't have that information beforehand and that's what made me mad, I read it on jamesallenf1 and they apparently looked up the radio logs to get this information. Like the article says, on any other given Sunday in the prior years SFi wouldn't have gotten so much spotlight for this gaffe but now that they are a solid mid-fielder and a potential podium finisher all eyes will be on them. So SFi should have been more assertive to give up the position temporarily or forced him to come into pits, but that's in hindsight like I mentioned already. I'm glad that Vijay Mallaya has tweeted about coming up with a strategy if such a situation does occur and the team can be more assertive.

On the other hand, just for comparison's sake, Sergio is a great talent but talent only takes you so far, but he's not a pay driver - he's paid a salary from SFi so he's a salaried employee for all intensive purposes, so if I were in his shoes I'd listen to my employer. He brings a bit of the sponsors from Mexico, so what? Tomorrow if Ocon gets it from France should he throw his weight around the team like what Sergio is doing?

Work ethic is another aspect that plays a big part in a racer's career. The one shining example I'd like to take is Michael Schumacher, remind me one time in his career he's talked negatively about the team or any actions that has shown him in that light? I think this is one of the reasons he's been so successful. I haven't seen that in Hamilton or Alonso - both were quick to talk about sabotage and team conspiring to make the driver lose a championship at one or more points in their career, but I do see a lot of Schumacher's ethic in Ocon, he's respectful and grateful of the team, good work ethic, talented and brings a lot of positive spirit to the team. I was just amazed how mature he was in his approach, "My time will come" wow, that's a winner right there.

Oh and also I'm not a Max Verstappen fan, in the previous iterations of the F1 car he might have looked spectacular with his moving under the braking stunt to block drivers, but I doubt you'll see all that tactics from cars of this generation (infact I haven't seen it all season thus far) simple reason being more downforce, grip and shorter braking distance, there's no time for all this monkey tricks.

That's my 2 cents, if Sergio wants to continue in this team, he should respect their decisions and I do sincerely hope SFi become more assertive, if he feels he's too good for the outfit, well I'd be the first to wish him good luck and be on his way. I'm very excited about Ocon and the prospect of getting either another great rookie or Kubica (wishful thinking) to take this seat, cheers!
[/quote]

Even though I do not completely agree with you, at least this time you're giving good arguments, what I did not liked at all (if I may say) was the previous comment where no ideas were exposed, just aggressive comments.

I apologize if I over reacted, I'm just frustrated to see that it does not matter how Checo does good things for a long time (like being 15 races in the points, like all the podiums, like all the points, like all the development efforts and good environment in the latest years), it all disappears the moment he does something "wrong" like trying to thrive, but he was just doing what he always does and what has given FI all the podiums they have but one. Stating that another rookie or Kubica would do a better job just makes me sad.


Another thing, I also believe that Ocon is awesome.

Once again, sorry to the forum and community for my aggressive entrance, I have passion for this sport and at least all this has make me finally register and start writing instead of just reading, since I've been reading you for a long time now.
[/quote]


Do make sure you read the post carefully to find links etc before calling someone out, also you don't have to agree to what ever I have to say and are entitled to your opinions just like the fact that I don't to yours, all the great things he's done, he's done so being a part of a team. He needs to remember and reciprocate that way in a "team sport".

adrianjordan
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by adrianjordan » Thu Jun 15, 2017 4:18 pm

Samraj_official wrote:
Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:14 pm
raksf1 wrote:Force India Formula 1 team considering name change...


http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/130141
That would be bad,the name "Force india" reminds of old independent non-manufacturer F1 teams who didn't use the team owner's name in the team title,unlike today's Ferrari,Williams,Sauber,McLaren etc.,
I assume a level of sarcasm there?? Please tell ne there was...

Just in case there wasn't, you do realise how old Ferrari, Williams and McLaren are as teams don't you and that "old independent non-manufacturer teams" usually had the owner's name in the team name, such as Brabham, Tyrrell, Stewart et al...
In 2007 I had the chance to go to a meet-and-greet with an F1 test driver. I decided not to as I didn't think he'd even amount to much...he was the BMW Sauber test driver and his name was Sebastian Vettel...

IamLegend
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by IamLegend » Thu Jun 15, 2017 4:25 pm

adrianjordan wrote:
Thu Jun 15, 2017 4:18 pm
Samraj_official wrote:
Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:14 pm
raksf1 wrote:Force India Formula 1 team considering name change...


http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/130141
That would be bad,the name "Force india" reminds of old independent non-manufacturer F1 teams who didn't use the team owner's name in the team title,unlike today's Ferrari,Williams,Sauber,McLaren etc.,
I assume a level of sarcasm there?? Please tell ne there was...

Just in case there wasn't, you do realise how old Ferrari, Williams and McLaren are as teams don't you and that "old independent non-manufacturer teams" usually had the owner's name in the team name, such as Brabham, Tyrrell, Stewart et al...
Don't see the bigger hypocrisy having teams HQ'd in good ol England but having constructors flags from different countries? Mercedes, SFi, Red Bull Racing to name a few.

I don't see a point in the name change especially at this point in time. It's a brand, although it itches a few people the wrong way to have "India" in it.

Samraj_official
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by Samraj_official » Thu Jun 15, 2017 4:49 pm

I don't see a point in the name change especially at this point in time. It's a brand, although it itches a few people the wrong way to have "India" in it.

Your last sentence nailed it!!

marmer
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by marmer » Thu Jun 15, 2017 4:51 pm

time to change we lost the Indian GP years ago they have no customer base there no significant number of Indian staff other than the owner. if its costing them money keeping the name it should be changed.

OneAlex
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by OneAlex » Thu Jun 15, 2017 5:37 pm

I have mixed feelings about a name change

On one hand, while the nationalistic branding made sense when India was an up and coming f1 market, it's always been a clunky name and I've never been a fan of nationalistic marketing for random countries. It makes sense for Williams and Ferrari to be "the British" and "the Italian" teams because they're actually based in Britain and Italy with strong racing support, but FIndia and F1 in general has no strong connections to India outside of VJM himself.

On the other hand, you have to reach back to Jordan's glory days to match FIndia's current success. It's become a successful brand (in racing terms), so it seems almost wrong to take its name away for marketing purposes.

Unless it gets a cool name of course, then it's all fine.

adrianjordan
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by adrianjordan » Thu Jun 15, 2017 5:52 pm

Maybe return to Jordan Grand Prix or similar 😝
In 2007 I had the chance to go to a meet-and-greet with an F1 test driver. I decided not to as I didn't think he'd even amount to much...he was the BMW Sauber test driver and his name was Sebastian Vettel...

marmer
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by marmer » Thu Jun 15, 2017 6:10 pm

there was a story about brabham was there not maybe they will buy the naming rights

ringo
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by ringo » Sun Jun 18, 2017 5:40 am

Just back tracking to the Perez discussion.
Perez is a top driver, and i believe the treatment he is given for doing what a real racer would do is uncalled for.
Haters gonna hate i guess, but Sergio is a Ferrari quality driver and he has proven that time and time again putting the force india on the podium. Ocon had 1 good race and people are going crazy over it and throwing checo under the bus.
I won't say racism is a factor, but maybe some subliminal form of european jingoism :lol:
Perez is the real deal and if i were in his shoes i would do the same thing. I'm not going to step aside and let any rookie driver have a go at a position that i've worked for. Ocon's time will come; for now i would bully him and start the mind games. You cannot give an inch in formula 1 and Perez knew exactly what he was doing. If ocon wants a podium he needs to fight for it. These new drivers come with this entitlement personality, and think it was rather refreshing that perez made ocon cry near the end of the race about "he cannot do that" oh yes he can! :lol:
We have seen the same thing from drivers like Alonso, Vettel, Rosberg, Kimi, Hamilton. Perez has that ruthlessness that a champion should have. He did the right thing, and i do indeed believe that his actions make him more desirable for a top team. It only adds to his good results.
For Sure!!

IamLegend
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by IamLegend » Tue Jun 20, 2017 4:22 pm

ringo wrote:
Sun Jun 18, 2017 5:40 am
Just back tracking to the Perez discussion.
Perez is a top driver, and i believe the treatment he is given for doing what a real racer would do is uncalled for.
Haters gonna hate i guess, but Sergio is a Ferrari quality driver and he has proven that time and time again putting the force india on the podium. Ocon had 1 good race and people are going crazy over it and throwing checo under the bus.
I won't say racism is a factor, but maybe some subliminal form of european jingoism :lol:
Perez is the real deal and if i were in his shoes i would do the same thing. I'm not going to step aside and let any rookie driver have a go at a position that i've worked for. Ocon's time will come; for now i would bully him and start the mind games. You cannot give an inch in formula 1 and Perez knew exactly what he was doing. If ocon wants a podium he needs to fight for it. These new drivers come with this entitlement personality, and think it was rather refreshing that perez made ocon cry near the end of the race about "he cannot do that" oh yes he can! :lol:
We have seen the same thing from drivers like Alonso, Vettel, Rosberg, Kimi, Hamilton. Perez has that ruthlessness that a champion should have. He did the right thing, and i do indeed believe that his actions make him more desirable for a top team. It only adds to his good results.
I couldn't decide which parts of the article to paste here, so I'm pretty much copy-pasted half of the article. A rookie with 9 full GPs under his belt, he looks like the future champ to me outshining even the (dare I say it) Max Verstappen.

"Six top-10 finishes later and more than a year-and-a-half left on Ocon's Force India deal, the team's decision looks like a genuine masterstroke.


There's frequently a lot of scepticism surrounding any emerging young talent in F1 – some warranted, some less so – if the driver is perceived to be over-hyped.

In Ocon's case, you could mention that he's only beaten Sergio Perez once in qualifying so far, with help from yellow flags in Q1 in Bahrain. He's also only finished ahead of the Mexican once, in Monaco, the only race where Force India didn't score with both or either car.

But his team bosses won't care one bit and Ocon himself surely can't be too disheartened by trailing Perez by 17 points, given how the season so far is unfolding for drivers of similar experience levels.

In a campaign where teammate gaps have largely ballooned across the board thanks to F1's new quicker and tougher-to-drive cars, Ocon has started the season as his team's second driver – but he was closer than many to his number-one teammate and he's been gaining ground inescapably.

In three Q3 appearances, Ocon was a tenth off Perez in Russia, a couple of tenths off in Spain, a tenth off in Canada. The Mexican has an edge still but it is no longer an obvious one.

The Canadian GP row with Perez, which will have shined a spotlight on Ocon's progress, was admittedly helped by the pair being on different strategies, but it is hard to imagine such a situation occurring in the near future at Williams, Renault or McLaren – and not just because two of those three teams are probably not fighting for podiums any time soon.

Equally important is that Ocon has managed to limit the kind of mistakes that you would expect from a relative newcomer in F1's new-generation cars.

The only somewhat major blot on his copybook so far has been a costly FP3 off in Monaco that compromised his qualifying run, but even in that race the Frenchman was still very possibly heading for the points until his race was ruined by an unlucky puncture.

Otherwise, he has been superb, playing a big part in what teammate Perez dubbed as Force India's early-season "big miracles" as the team capitalised on every opportunity – and further bolstering its points reserves now that the car has improved.

Ocon's consistency is no huge surprise to those who recall his title-winning GP3 season, in which the Frenchman – in a series that uses the reversed-grid rule – strung together an extremely unlikely streak of nine consecutive second-place finishes.

And, on a more general note, it would be a massive disservice to the junior single-seater ladder to be at all caught out by the fact that a driver who triumphed in European F3 and GP3 on his first attempt and has been on various F1 teams' radars for ages is - big shock - actually pretty good.

But Ocon seriously stands out compared to 2017 F1 drivers of similar grand prix experience levels – Stoffel Vandoorne's muted start to life at McLaren has been a major source of frustration to those who have seen him dazzle in Formula Renault 3.5 and GP2; Lance Stroll has yet to fully find his feet since his F1 graduation, a confidence-boosting Canadian GP result aside; and Palmer, who acquitted himself decently towards the end of last year, has so far been nowhere near new teammate Hulkenberg.

Yet calling up 20-year-old Ocon, a driver who had nine grands prix under his belt before arriving at the fourth-best team in F1, feels like a bigger gamble than the aforementioned, even with the benefit of hindsight.

So far, the decision has more than paid off. In a team that is seen by many as the best value-for-money operation in Formula 1, the Frenchman has fit in perfectly, maximising opportunities and making sure the outfit can rely on him as a consistent source of valuable points.

He's been progressing rapidly, too, and is on a two-year deal – with deputy team principal Bob Fernley having insisted, even before the season, that Ocon would see out the contract.

A solid start is no guarantee of anything, of course – ask Force India's 2011 rookie Paul di Resta, who impressed early in his F1 career but was out after three seasons.

But for now there's every reason to get excited – and, for Force India, every reason to feel it has won big in the 2016-17 edition of the F1 driver market's game of musical chairs."

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-o ... on-919987/

ringo
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Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post by ringo » Wed Jun 21, 2017 4:52 am

Iamlegend,

I agree that Ocon is the best young driver in the batch. i too would put him above pascal and the others such as sianz and max. Its because he is so flawless and understands to race so well and get points driving to the maximum pace of the car, as to why Perez had to out his flames. Perez has a right to protect his reputation against a threatening driver.
What i like most about Ocon is that he goes about his business quietly, and he is deadly on track.
For Sure!!



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