2008 Jerez/Algarve Winter Testing (8th Dec - 17th Dec)

Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.

Post Mon Dec 15, 2008 4:26 pm

Metar wrote:By a margin of a single win, and a single point - when one of those wins was taken from the opposing team.

Ferrari won more and were more consistent, and got the constructor's trophy. Hamilton scored, on average, more than Massa, and thus won. There's a thousand and one things that could be blamed for this result: Hamilton's three-stopper at Turkey could've backfired, Massa's Hungary engine could've survived, Hamilton's tyre might not have been punctured at Monaco, etc.. But when the margin is one point, I don't think we need to complain that "He won more", because a single win more, which was given from the other team, really doesn't make things unfair. A one-to-six situation, say, Kubica winning, might've been unfair. But this?

Massa won one more race (on paper), and he got two more points as a result - and on such a small margin, I don't see why this should be different. Perhaps we should increase that to another point, but an arbitrary bonus that disregards the difference - just one victory - would be less fair.


I believe that Ferrari had more DNF's than McLaren in 2008 and still won the WCC, and the bonuses are not arbitrary. If it is known at the beginning of the season what the year-end bonuses are, the teams will keep track of it. It is also quite possible that the bonuses would be "won" before the last race, so everyone would go into the last race already knowing where most of those points are going.

Whatever tho, I don't make the rules, and at this point may be boycotting F1 in 2009 simply so I don't shatter my illusions about what F1 is. I think that I would rather remember the last 2 years championship runs and cars than watch the "New F1" and ruin my beliefs.

Does anyone have any info on the "New IndyCar" Series? At least I can actually make it to a race, and I'm hoping that they are much like the 2005 CCWS cars...
Conceptual
 
Joined: 15 Nov 2007

Post Mon Dec 15, 2008 6:45 pm

Could we please get back onto the Testing topic? There's enough threads around to discuss 2008 shenanigans.
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'10-'11 Head of Powertrain - Glasgow University Formula Student
Scotracer
 
Joined: 22 Apr 2008
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland, UK

Post Mon Dec 15, 2008 11:43 pm

Scotracer wrote:Could we please get back onto the Testing topic? There's enough threads around to discuss 2008 shenanigans.


Sure thing!

Oh, this test is over, nothing but data collection came of it, and movin on to new ground which will probably open a different thread.

Thanks Scotracer, this topic was say off topic for a test that ended last week!
Conceptual
 
Joined: 15 Nov 2007

Post Tue Dec 16, 2008 12:59 am

I'm sure tests just one week apart can be combined into one thread. If you want to be pedantic about it, I'll edit the thread title ;)
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'10-'11 Head of Powertrain - Glasgow University Formula Student
Scotracer
 
Joined: 22 Apr 2008
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland, UK

Post Tue Dec 16, 2008 6:15 am

It sure is difficult to stay on topic, especially when one has so many concepts and 'stuff'... :idea:

Here are two great images of the F2008 and the MP4-23 at a similar angle, from Algarve:

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The Ferrari still in '08 specs, albeit on slicks when track conditions allowed.
The McLaren again running '09 aero simulation specs, but with a '09 front wing.

Image

Image

Shouldn't the monocoque bodywork flow into the sidepod entrance to maintain the pressure and flow of air inwards? BMW has the sidepod entrance seperated by a few centimeters from the monocoque bodywork, seemingly perpendicular to each other (similar to their front wing endplates).
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mx_tifoso
 
Joined: 30 Nov 2006
Location: North America

Post Tue Dec 16, 2008 6:48 am

mx_tifosi wrote:Shouldn't the monocoque bodywork flow into the sidepod entrance to maintain the pressure and flow of air inwards? BMW has the sidepod entrance seperated by a few centimeters from the monocoque bodywork, seemingly perpendicular to each other (similar to their front wing endplates).


Look at jet-fighter inlets, inlet is usually separated from bodywork to bleed boundary layer, in F1 it is probably not that important but on Ferrari F92A and F310 you may see that designers thought about that. Not very successful cars in their days but still...
timbo
 
Joined: 22 Oct 2007

Post Tue Dec 16, 2008 7:46 am

Well, aside from the three page pissing match.....
Does anyone with aero knowledge think we may begin to see a wider definition in the front nose, something like a duck-bill? (Platypus)

Would the rules allow teams to possibly form the front nose into the wing?
fastback33
 
Joined: 29 Aug 2007

Post Tue Dec 16, 2008 6:00 pm

Image

What's that black-white striped thing?
timbo
 
Joined: 22 Oct 2007

Post Tue Dec 16, 2008 8:44 pm

It looks like Mac are extending the inside of the front brake duct to smooth the flow around the inside of the tyre. Similar to the outboard extension seen in testing last week.

Front brake ducts can extend forwards to the forward perimeter of the tyre between lines roughly inline with the top and bottom of the wheel. They cannot extend backwards past the wheel.
scarbs
 
Joined: 8 Oct 2003
Location: Hertfordshire, UK

Post Wed Dec 17, 2008 1:19 am

scarbs do you know if anybody else plans to run the BMW hollow wheels for 2009?
I love to love Senna.
ginsu
 
Joined: 17 Jan 2006

Post Fri Dec 19, 2008 12:36 pm

fastback33 wrote:Would the rules allow teams to possibly form the front nose into the wing?


Nope, there's a minimum height for the nosecone.
Metar
 
Joined: 23 Jan 2008

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