2018-2020 Tyres Thread

[PlatinumZealot]

When you groove the tyre you remove material. For a given compound less material means less grip, easier to heat, less thermal mass (less stable surface temperature), it may degrade faster and of course it will wear down faster.

[hollowBallistix]

What's pathetic about the current tyre is the fact drivers still can't push 100% of a lap for the entirety of a lap without the tyre falling out of its operating window.

[BrunoH]

less kind of rubber, ultra, super, soft, medium hard. maybe just 4 kinds, or 3 kinds for year round, but each with a wider window of temps so they can run hard for the full wear of the tyre.. and place a bigger gap in performance between the 3 or 4 compounds..

[PlatinumZealot]

Monaco definitely needed the Hyper-soft.

[marmer]

they got it spot on in Russia the ultra was falling away at the end of a qualification lap which is exactly what you want from a tyre a 3.6 mile track 4th longest on the calendar
i know there are other factors to consider than length of track but based on length i think it would be correct to add a softer option for next year maybe even 2 steps softer as in terms of distance it might be possible current ultra could do all races apart from SPA

next years tyrs could look something like this perhaps if designed to offer an advised max grip based on mileage when being pushed to the limit (slightly over heating)
Ultra 2.0 - 2.5 mile max performance
Supersoft - 2.5 -3 mile max
soft - 3 - 3.5
medium 3.5 - 4
hard 4+

for the race they should offer longer life by staying within optimal temp range and the temp being the same for all tyres

Ultra - 55
Super - 65
Soft - 75
Medium - 85
Hard - 95

if these where max life for each tyre every race could be a two or a 3 stopper have the cross over points in speed at 10 miles less than max life likethe old cliff ten miles before max life tyre would be slower than the next compound

do Ultra - 45 super 55 soft 65 back to ultra to finish
this may seem like teams would just use the softest all the time but a two stopper using hard choices and the fact that the starting tyre might be a hard or medium for actual lap speed when being pushed you would not want ultra at spa when being pushed by the guy behind you would run out of to performance by half a lap and trying to keep that pace up would reduce the miles left on the tyre massively reduced

[mrluke]

I think pirelli would be the first to agree with a desire to have tyres that are soft enough to last for a lap or two in quality, a hard tyre that would do the race distance with one stop and something else in between.

That's what everybody wants.

The problem is making that work across different tarmacs, temperatures, corner loads, altitudes etc all with the same compounds that have to be made around a year in advance of the race.

All that while knowing that the current cars will be a lot faster next year but no real idea of how much.

No opportunity to test or tweak compounds.

And to top it all off with a media and fan Base that will crucify you if the tyres are too hard or too soft.

The problem is not deciding what we want to have, the problem is achieving it given all of the other constraints.

[mertol]

What do you mean no oportunity to test? They get tested by 20 cars for 300+km every race. Every season they create a shitty tire and there are always people trying to excuse them. This year their tires are horribly wrong again they heat up and overheat in no time like a very soft compound yet they can go a full race distance like a very hard compound. At least they don't randomly blow up but I suspect it has more to do with the mandated minimum pressure than pirelli actually fixing their tires.

[zac510]

You can't call races tests when they're "not allowed" to modify the compounds mid-season. I say "not allowed" because when in the past they've modified tyres mid-season they've been accused of bias and favouritism towards some teams, or teams veto changes because they fear breaking the status quo. The tyre designs are basically fixed from pre-season testing then.

Who would want to be a tyre supplier? You just get abused all the time, no matter what you do! At least you can celebrate a victory every race

[marmer]

The only way to stop people moaning about the tyre is to have tyre war. Even then the tyre worse off will still be complained about

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[mertol]

Actually thanks to Alonso driving in indy 500 I watched the race and tires were never in the spotlight. I couldn't even tell you the brand that supplies them or how many are they based only on the broadcast.

[Just_a_fan]

Actually thanks to Alonso driving in indy 500 I watched the race and tires were never in the spotlight. I couldn't even tell you the brand that supplies them or how many are they based only on the broadcast.

In fairness, the Indy 500 tyre is a one off special and is designed, tested and adjusted specifically for the race. It only ever has to do 70 miles (fuel tank range of the car) and they know it will be hot weather and they know the track surface intimately.

Take the Indy 500 tyre to a street circuit and it will be talked about. Ask it to do twice the distance and see what happens then.

No comparison with the situation that Pirelli faces. If they could design, test and then adjust tyres for each track then we'd see something very different to now. But they can't so they do what they can with what they have.

[turbof1]

Actually thanks to Alonso driving in indy 500 I watched the race and tires were never in the spotlight. I couldn't even tell you the brand that supplies them or how many are they based only on the broadcast.

In fairness, the Indy 500 tyre is a one off special and is designed, tested and adjusted specifically for the race. It only ever has to do 70 miles (fuel tank range of the car) and they know it will be hot weather and they know the track surface intimately.

Take the Indy 500 tyre to a street circuit and it will be talked about. Ask it to do twice the distance and see what happens then.

No comparison with the situation that Pirelli faces. If they could design, test and then adjust tyres for each track then we'd see something very different to now. But they can't so they do what they can with what they have.

Correct.

The Monaco GP also got it's low wear issue further exacerbated by the new asphalt layer, decreasing grip and decreasing wear furthermore. That's way too specific of a case to build a tyre around.

But, as stated before, from what we have seen up until now is that tyres generally are too hard. In each and every grand prix the hardest tyre that is brought along is systematically unused.

[zac510]

Another point is that a tyre war is just the same as a chassis war, aerodynamic war or an engine war, all of which we have now and are heavily criticised when one party does exceptionally better or exceptionally worse than another. (I'm not endorsing one or the other, just making an observation).

[piast9]

Monaco definitely needed the Hyper-soft.

I think it should be named Ludicrous-soft.

[PlatinumZealot]

The only way to stop people moaning about the tyre is to have tyre war. Even then the tyre worse off will still be complained about

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I think a tyre war is only possible if all the artificial constraints, such as "make a trye designed to degrade" are removed. It would be madness for two different companies to chase such a requirement without obvious differences in tyre performance.

In my view of the hypothetical tyre war, the new directive from FIA would be:

"make the fastest tyres that you can."
"Three compounds must be selected for each race."
The maximum number of compounds for the season is five (5)."
"The tyre compounds must not be altered over the course of the season unless approved by the FIA"

In this way.. even if the competing tyre companies make harder/softer sets it will average out over the year and track to track. On some tracks you just can't get away with a tyre that is too soft or too hard. After a while, just like the cars the performance will converge. And the cycle repeats and we end up back at one supplier again. lol