General Honda F1 Topic

Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.
restless
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by restless » Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:35 am

In Australia and bahrein RB had something messed in the chassis, which was fixed in China
So hopefully in Baku they will make a step ahead

Wouter
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by Wouter » Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:48 am

1158 wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:48 am
Honda certainly has work to do, but the fact that RB has stated the chassis has issues putting the power down in low speed corners, such as turn 14, kinda suggests both sides have work to do.

Until someone in RB flat out says Honda is the reason they aren't winning there is nothing to see here.
A lot has to be done about the chassis now that they are running a Honda engine. For instance:
The less good starts from Max is due to the rear wheel suspension. If suddenly a lot of power is released, the rear wheels start to bounce quite a bit. So they have to change that rear wheel suspension slightly. Honda has nothing to do with this.
The car needs more DF and especially at the rear.
RBR needs to get used to the fact that they finally have a strong, reliable engine and that requires changes to the chassis.
The engine is too strong for their design. \:D/ :D

yener
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by yener » Wed Apr 17, 2019 1:29 pm

Wouter wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:48 am
1158 wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:48 am
Honda certainly has work to do, but the fact that RB has stated the chassis has issues putting the power down in low speed corners, such as turn 14, kinda suggests both sides have work to do.

Until someone in RB flat out says Honda is the reason they aren't winning there is nothing to see here.
A lot has to be done about the chassis now that they are running a Honda engine. For instance:
The less good starts from Max is due to the rear wheel suspension. If suddenly a lot of power is released, the rear wheels start to bounce quite a bit. So they have to change that rear wheel suspension slightly. Honda has nothing to do with this.
The car needs more DF and especially at the rear.
RBR needs to get used to the fact that they finally have a strong, reliable engine and that requires changes to the chassis.
The engine is too strong for their design. \:D/ :D
If the driveablility sucks and the engine peak is at low RPM, it has nothing to do with the mechanical grip, but the PU is the one who causes the spin :P . Not saying it is the cause right now, but just to let you know its both possible.
Alonso: All the time you have to keep the space!

Bill
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by Bill » Wed Apr 17, 2019 1:51 pm

Str are doing just fine with Honda pu Redbull has acknowledged chassis shortcomings so they is no room for speculations

amho
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by amho » Wed Apr 17, 2019 6:26 pm

yener wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 1:29 pm
Wouter wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:48 am
1158 wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:48 am
Honda certainly has work to do, but the fact that RB has stated the chassis has issues putting the power down in low speed corners, such as turn 14, kinda suggests both sides have work to do.

Until someone in RB flat out says Honda is the reason they aren't winning there is nothing to see here.
A lot has to be done about the chassis now that they are running a Honda engine. For instance:
The less good starts from Max is due to the rear wheel suspension. If suddenly a lot of power is released, the rear wheels start to bounce quite a bit. So they have to change that rear wheel suspension slightly. Honda has nothing to do with this.
The car needs more DF and especially at the rear.
RBR needs to get used to the fact that they finally have a strong, reliable engine and that requires changes to the chassis.
The engine is too strong for their design. \:D/ :D
If the driveablility sucks and the engine peak is at low RPM, it has nothing to do with the mechanical grip, but the PU is the one who causes the spin :P . Not saying it is the cause right now, but just to let you know its both possible.
Redbull's poor performance at slow speed corners is not necessarily caused by engine's driveability, if you check F1.com analysis you can see that STR has the second best performance in slow speed corners, it can't be reched with bad traction or weak drivability so you can't have an easy conclusion on Redbull issue.
There is no Might or Power except with Allah.

McMika98
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by McMika98 » Wed Apr 17, 2019 6:33 pm

amho wrote:
Wed Apr 17, 2019 6:26 pm

Redbull's poor performance at slow speed corners is not necessarily caused by engine's driveability, if you check F1.com analysis you can see that STR has the second best performance in slow speed corners, it can't be reched with bad traction or weak drivability so you can't have an easy conclusion on Redbull issue.
The F1.com articles are so misleading, it just does not add up. F1 tv apparently give real time telemetry which was available for Oz and Bahrain GP but could not find one for China.
On Bahrain even though the Bulls struggled with traction amd setup they were fast on slow corners on par with Ferrari.

HondaPOD
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by HondaPOD » Wed Apr 17, 2019 7:41 pm

Verstappen knows what Red Bull Racing needs: 'About 30 horsepower'. What's that means, they lack 30 hp !!!!
https://www.f1maximaal.nl/nieuws/max-ve ... -dertig-pk

Last year Verstapen said they are lacking 70hp. it can be true.

Snorked
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by Snorked » Thu Apr 18, 2019 1:02 am

Reading the Google translated comments for this interview, it seems the 20 bhp next race came from the Honda vice president?

https://members.f1-life.net/race/81677/

Image

PlatinumZealot
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by PlatinumZealot » Thu Apr 18, 2019 1:55 am

20hp needed is still good if you ask me.. Granted it could probably be 30hp to match Mercedes and another 20 on top of that to catch Ferrari... But still good progress. Impressed with the reliability most of all.
"The true champions are also great men. They are capable of making difficult decisions, of admitting their mistakes and of pushing harder than before when they get up from a fall."

- Ferrari chairman Sergio Marchionne

Bill
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by Bill » Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:39 am

They is really nothing special about Ferrari pu they have a slippery car which fast on straight,Mercedes said Honda is behind them by 10 hp they could have out qualified or split the Ferrari in China with that long back straight if Max did his second run in his q3 lap in fact his 1st lap did just that. Unless anybody can show us really figures who is ahead in power stake is all pure speculation Honda could be well ahead of merc in Baku

_cerber1
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by _cerber1 » Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:54 am

Bill wrote:
Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:39 am
They is really nothing special about Ferrari pu they have a slippery car which fast on straight,Mercedes said Honda is behind them by 10 hp they could have out qualified or split the Ferrari in China with that long back straight if Max did his second run in his q3 lap in fact his 1st lap did just that. Unless anybody can show us really figures who is ahead in power stake is all pure speculation Honda could be well ahead of merc in Baku
Do not be so naive, Mercedes just praised Honda for the work, but this does not mean that the real difference is 10 hp. #-o

dxpetrov
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by dxpetrov » Thu Apr 18, 2019 7:21 am

PlatinumZealot wrote:
Thu Apr 18, 2019 1:55 am
20hp needed is still good if you ask me.. Granted it could probably be 30hp to match Mercedes and another 20 on top of that to catch Ferrari... But still good progress. Impressed with the reliability most of all.
I don't think there would left that much difference.
I believe the main problem and differentiation between these engines is the power delivery.

Wouter
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by Wouter » Thu Apr 18, 2019 7:55 am

PlatinumZealot wrote:
Thu Apr 18, 2019 1:55 am
20hp needed is still good if you ask me.. Granted it could probably be 30hp to match Mercedes and another 20 on top of that to catch Ferrari... But still good progress. Impressed with the reliability most of all.
Max said yesterday:

"The team must make the car even better. We still have too little grip, both in front and behind. We have to take steps there."

They don't need 50 HP to beat Ferrari. There is no 20 HP difference between Mercedes and Ferrari.
Ferrari is driving with low downforce. RBR needs to fix the much too little grip in front and behind, that makes the difference.
Once they solve this, probably in Barcelona, then the gab to Ferrari and Mercedes is much smaller.
In Baku they get already +/- 20 HP from Honda. Max confirmed the Honda upgrade. I asume this comes mostly from a new fuel.

etusch
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by etusch » Thu Apr 18, 2019 8:28 am

It is unlogical to talk about new fuel by saying engine update. If it said pu update it must be power unit.

dxpetrov
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

Post by dxpetrov » Thu Apr 18, 2019 8:50 am

I guess it's software / mapping / fuel combined.