General Honda F1 Topic

[mycadcae]

can be a pipe hose supplier to the engine

[lio007]

Future F1 throttle "pedal"
https://twitter.com/HondaRacingF1/statu ... 03488?s=19

[loner]

no doubt now the spec 3 delivered and i understood Honda boasting the jet team and IHI people .. it was weird after France but things are pretty clear now i think with spec 4 LH will be under serious threat from MAX.
its a mega formula and a predator creeping .. HONDA + RBR + MAX.

[etusch]

no doubt now the spec 3 delivered and i understood Honda boasting the jet team and IHI people .. it was weird after France but things are pretty clear now i think with spec 4 LH will be under serious threat from MAX.
its a mega formula and a predator creeping .. HONDA + RBR + MAX.

But Max must stay away from vettel who is driving with soul of maldonado

[loner]

no doubt now the spec 3 delivered and i understood Honda boasting the jet team and IHI people .. it was weird after France but things are pretty clear now i think with spec 4 LH will be under serious threat from MAX.
its a mega formula and a predator creeping .. HONDA + RBR + MAX.

But Max must stay away from vettel who is driving with soul of maldonado

[Pyrone89]

If RBR and Honda are smart they introduce spec 4 already with Torro Rosso in Hungary. Honda surely will already have 2 of the 4 units ready by then and since Honda does not fall under the mandatory factory shutdown it gives them 4 weeks extra to work on improving the mapping etc. after running it for the first time on track.

My view on the current PU relative to eachother: Maybe they can bridge the race spec HP gap, but Mercedes is still a long way ahead of the rest in my view if we look at more than HP.
1. Party mode: Merc clearly
2. Peak power race: Ferrari seems a bit faster
3. Fuel consumptiom: there is talk that the Merc is extremely efficient which allows them to run way lighter than the rest
4. Reliability: Mercedes again, Honda is still to do 7 races with 1 engine
5. Weight: unknown
6. Size: Honda, Ferrari and Mercedes seem equally good, Renault worse if we believe RBR
7. Coolimg: clear advantage for Ferrari, Honda also good vs Mercedes

[ispano6]

If RBR and Honda are smart they introduce spec 4 already with Torro Rosso in Hungary. Honda surely will already have 2 of the 4 units ready by then and since Honda does not fall under the mandatory factory shutdown it gives them 4 weeks extra to work on improving the mapping etc. after running it for the first time on track.

My view on the current PU relative to eachother: Maybe they can bridge the race spec HP gap, but Mercedes is still a long way ahead of the rest in my view if we look at more than HP.
1. Party mode: Merc clearly
2. Peak power race: Ferrari seems a bit faster
3. Fuel consumptiom: there is talk that the Merc is extremely efficient which allows them to run way lighter than the rest
4. Reliability: Mercedes again, Honda is still to do 7 races with 1 engine
5. Weight: unknown
6. Size: Honda, Ferrari and Mercedes seem equally good, Renault worse if we believe RBR
7. Coolimg: clear advantage for Ferrari, Honda also good vs Mercedes

Austria was 32C. Germany Hockenheim is forecast to be around 27.2C. Hungary is forecast to be 30C. Unless it is that teams have solved their heating issues, the next two races might be reminiscent of Austria. Marko said Monza and Tanabe says there is an agreed upon cadence so Honda will likely stay on the current spec until after the break. Now if they find that Albon's high voltage issue is possible in the other PUs there maybe a component level swap and penalty for all the Honda powered cars.

I think many people thought RB Honda overachieved in Austria but Silverstone proved them wrong. The current spec still has rough edges yet despite that, the package, even when crippled and shedding parts still finished on pace. Incredible.

[Singabule]

Yamamoto talk to Agag regarding 2021 FE entry, given the fact that it would only cost them 30-40 mio a year do you think Honda would pull off F1 again? Or they want to ensure just in case relationships with RB turn sour, they can move easily. As both race would be under FIA banner, do they want to bargain to FIA to not change the current PU spec as it would be expensive to develop new concepts one?

[ispano6]

Honda's plan was to return for 10 years initially, and since Marko and Tost were able to convince Honda to stay, at least for another 5 years, even with a change in regulations. From what I hear Honda is in it for the long haul, to win the championship with Red Bull Racing. Until they do, they will stay until F1 becomes irrelevant to the world, which it won't ever. Might be a different formula, there might not even be tires, but Honda will compete as long as there is racing.

Part of this plan is to raise Japanese drivers. We have a fairly capable one in Nobu. Though he kind of is like a Stroll or Latifi, being grandson and heir of Matsushita (Panasonic). Tadasuke Makino and Nirei Fukuzumi are on the rise. Naoki Yamamoto, Buttons SuperGT teammate is also fast, but had a down year when Gasly almost won Super Formula.
Eventually Honda needs a car for it's drivers, so it's either a seat in STR or a pay driver role in another team. I doubt Honda would buy out STR, but it's possible Honda funds half the costs if they were to fund their driver. Maybe another midfield team may opt to switch, or we may see a push for more privateer customer teams.
I don't see this happening until after Red Bull Honda win a championship together. If they do by 2020, who knows maybe RBH will have their own FE entry in the future.

[Pyrone89]

Honda's plan was to return for 10 years initially, and since Marko and Tost were able to convince Honda to stay, at least for another 5 years, even with a change in regulations. From what I hear Honda is in it for the long haul, to win the championship with Red Bull Racing. Until they do, they will stay until F1 becomes irrelevant to the world, which it won't ever. Might be a different formula, there might not even be tires, but Honda will compete as long as there is racing.

Part of this plan is to raise Japanese drivers. We have a fairly capable one in Nobu. Though he kind of is like a Stroll or Latifi, being grandson and heir of Matsushita (Panasonic). Tadasuke Makino and Nirei Fukuzumi are on the rise. Naoki Yamamoto, Buttons SuperGT teammate is also fast, but had a down year when Gasly almost won Super Formula.
Eventually Honda needs a car for it's drivers, so it's either a seat in STR or a pay driver role in another team. I doubt Honda would buy out STR, but it's possible Honda funds half the costs if they were to fund their driver. Maybe another midfield team may opt to switch, or we may see a push for more privateer customer teams.
I don't see this happening until after Red Bull Honda win a championship together. If they do by 2020, who knows maybe RBH will have their own FE entry in the future.

Why not both. Honda is the largest engine manufacturer in the world. Surely they can fund both.

[Bullwinkle]

Honda's plan was to return for 10 years initially, and since Marko and Tost were able to convince Honda to stay, at least for another 5 years, even with a change in regulations. From what I hear Honda is in it for the long haul, to win the championship with Red Bull Racing. Until they do, they will stay until F1 becomes irrelevant to the world, which it won't ever. Might be a different formula, there might not even be tires, but Honda will compete as long as there is racing.

Part of this plan is to raise Japanese drivers. We have a fairly capable one in Nobu. Though he kind of is like a Stroll or Latifi, being grandson and heir of Matsushita (Panasonic). Tadasuke Makino and Nirei Fukuzumi are on the rise. Naoki Yamamoto, Buttons SuperGT teammate is also fast, but had a down year when Gasly almost won Super Formula.
Eventually Honda needs a car for it's drivers, so it's either a seat in STR or a pay driver role in another team. I doubt Honda would buy out STR, but it's possible Honda funds half the costs if they were to fund their driver. Maybe another midfield team may opt to switch, or we may see a push for more privateer customer teams.
I don't see this happening until after Red Bull Honda win a championship together. If they do by 2020, who knows maybe RBH will have their own FE entry in the future.

Why not both. Honda is the largest engine manufacturer in the world. Surely they can fund both.

FE is pretty inexpensive as worldwide series go. That has been part of its "charm" to manufacturers like BMW, Audi, Nissan, Porsche, etc.

Just for comparison, here are some other series that Honda competes in, all in the same general price range as FE:

* IndyCar (around $25 Million USD annually). If as rumored Indycar adds a hybrid element for 2022, that price could rise
* IMSA Sports Cars (similar amount as Indycar for both a Factory DPI, Customer NSX GT3 and Civic TCR combined)
* SuperGT surely costs more than FE
* SuperFormula probably costs something less than Indycar
* MotoGP and WSBK. Not sure about costs of those but SuperMan's cape is not inexpensive.

None of this takes into account the staggering number of feeder series both in bikes and cars that Honda supports, There are more than a dozen of those in the US alone. And then there os the small fleet of cars Honda enters in the Pikes Peak Hillclimb every year.

So if a formula E program is $30 million, Honda could absorb it pretty easily. It could easily do something like what BMW did, which is to buy the naming rights to what had been the Andretti Autosport FE team. There are still teams on the grid that don't have strong ties to big manufacturers. Or Honda could start its own team.

[Thunder18]

They heavily invest in R&D outside of the sport and with MotoGP going fairly well, remember Honda are a motorcycle manufacturer first and foremost, do they need this overly expensive and complex engine system especially when they do pretty well in other motorsport categories, IndyCar for example. F1 and the investment in Alonso and McLaren only to be tarnished by them was looking like a poor decision and wasted funds. The European shift towards EV is obviously where more experience is needed for their engineers and R&D.

Personally I hope they stay long term

[Bill]

Honda are an engine builder first and foremost

[Thunder18]

Yeah I know but they sell more bikes than cars, planes and snowblowers!!

[Big Tea]

AS Fe is more or less a spec series, why not Honda just taking an existing team and 'badging it'? They could possibly go to building their own motor, or again badge one as Honda, someone has to produce one for their ecars