General Honda F1 Topic

Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.
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ispano6
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Thu Jun 17, 2021 3:46 pm

Your translations? I see. Good work.

We had a guy called Muramasa who was doing a bit of translating too. He had a little tiff with another Japanese user but haven't seen him since.
Yup, the article on Kumasei-mekki. But I've decided not to do them anymore.

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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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ispano6 wrote:
Fri Jun 18, 2021 1:12 am
bigblue wrote:
Thu Jun 17, 2021 12:05 pm
If it's been published, it's in the public domain. I don't think Honda would release information to a Japanese publication, with the intent that no other manufacturer will find out, because it's encrypted in Japanese ! Anyway, you are free to have your own opinion on this, and exercise your judgement as you see fit, and thanks for the bits you shared.
Let's just say that just because it's released in the "public" domain doesn't mean that anyone has access to it. It is after all privileged information that can only be attained by having access to the publication by purchasing or subscribing to it. The documentary by NHK, for instance, is not allowed to be broadcast or reproduced outside of Japan. There is an inherent naivety on the part of the Japanese to think that no one outside of Japan is interested or paying attention - the galapagos effect - which is certainly a trait (good or bad) on the part of the Japanese. Personally I'm of the opinion that Honda should stay quiet and not allow these articles or documentaries to reveal their innovations, but then it wouldn't be the Honda that everyone expects and respects.
I love your contributions mate. It's always really appreciated. But to be honest, it's naive to think "no one else purchased the publications". I am living proof of that...

Aside from types like us and this forum, you can bet some media high profiles with a huge interest like Craig Scarborough or Sam Collins etc, not to mention those in known media outlets, would of spent the small fee on that publication. I'd go so far as to say they aren't doing their job if they didn't.

The information Honda have released might seem like a lot and I see plenty of people expressing surprise, but it's still very superficial stuff. All the really special, fine details are all left out. Sure, tell us you've moved the camshafts closer together to aid packaging and change combustion chamber shape. Tell us you have an experimental new coating that's unlocked your ICE's limit, tell us you've made vast improvements to the Turbo to compensate for ICE efficiency gain, tell us you made a breakthrough with the MGU-H, it's cross-block shaft and it's balancing, tell us you've found big gains in your battery development in Milton Keynes and tell us you've got a unique combustion concept.

This is all extremely exciting stuff to hear and it gives me great satisfaction waking up in the morning to see a new article regarding Honda. And it's something no other manufacturer really does with sharing this, but at the same time they are giving us next to no detail whatsoever, well not enough that would be very useful to rivals or something that risks exposing their concepts. So I wouldn't call the Japanese naive, they aren't sharing their IP. All of it is clear they err on the side of caution with what they share, but this also lets them publicly celebrate the engineering prowess they've displayed. Honda has done a huge justice for the V6 Hybrids. Celebrating the majesty that they are in a way that no other manufacturer on the field has and doing so very publicly while acknowledging the excellence of their engineers. Kudos from me.

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ispano6
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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GhostF1 wrote:
Fri Jun 18, 2021 2:15 am
ispano6 wrote:
Fri Jun 18, 2021 1:12 am
bigblue wrote:
Thu Jun 17, 2021 12:05 pm
If it's been published, it's in the public domain. I don't think Honda would release information to a Japanese publication, with the intent that no other manufacturer will find out, because it's encrypted in Japanese ! Anyway, you are free to have your own opinion on this, and exercise your judgement as you see fit, and thanks for the bits you shared.
Let's just say that just because it's released in the "public" domain doesn't mean that anyone has access to it. It is after all privileged information that can only be attained by having access to the publication by purchasing or subscribing to it. The documentary by NHK, for instance, is not allowed to be broadcast or reproduced outside of Japan. There is an inherent naivety on the part of the Japanese to think that no one outside of Japan is interested or paying attention - the galapagos effect - which is certainly a trait (good or bad) on the part of the Japanese. Personally I'm of the opinion that Honda should stay quiet and not allow these articles or documentaries to reveal their innovations, but then it wouldn't be the Honda that everyone expects and respects.
I love your contributions mate. It's always really appreciated. But to be honest, it's naive to think "no one else purchased the publications". I am living proof of that...

Aside from types like us and this forum, you can bet some media high profiles with a huge interest like Craig Scarborough or Sam Collins etc, not to mention those in known media outlets, would of spent the small fee on that publication. I'd go so far as to say they aren't doing their job if they didn't.

The information Honda have released might seem like a lot and I see plenty of people expressing surprise, but it's still very superficial stuff. All the really special, fine details are all left out. Sure, tell us you've moved the camshafts closer together to aid packaging and change combustion chamber shape. Tell us you have an experimental new coating that's unlocked your ICE's limit, tell us you've made vast improvements to the Turbo to compensate for ICE efficiency gain, tell us you made a breakthrough with the MGU-H, it's cross-block shaft and it's balancing, tell us you've found big gains in your battery development in Milton Keynes and tell us you've got a unique combustion concept.

This is all extremely exciting stuff to hear and it gives me great satisfaction waking up in the morning to see a new article regarding Honda. And it's something no other manufacturer really does with sharing this, but at the same time they are giving us next to no detail whatsoever, well not enough that would be very useful to rivals or something that risks exposing their concepts. So I wouldn't call the Japanese naive, they aren't sharing their IP. All of it is clear they err on the side of caution with what they share, but this also lets them publicly celebrate the engineering prowess they've displayed. Honda has done a huge justice for the V6 Hybrids. Celebrating the majesty that they are in a way that no other manufacturer on the field has and doing so very publicly while acknowledging the excellence of their engineers. Kudos from me.
I get what you're saying. I'm not saying that no one else is purchasing the Japanese publications. These are publications that do not have English versions published. So even as you say those like Craig Scarborough and Sam Collins are purchasing the Japanese language publications such as AS-web, they are via print or PDF only, and unless you have the high quality PDFs or the magazines scanned and a sophisticated image to text translation software, they are having people read the articles and manually translating them, as there are no English versions available. I felt a great deal of reservation writing about the things written in the publications, and honestly some details aren't as superficial as you might think. I can accept that it's reflective of their confidence in their technology and when I say the naivety of the Japanese I'm not talking about Honda - that is a comment with regard to NHK and As-web!

Also, if you're able to find the March NHK documentary on Kumamoto plating and know of where it can be re-watched I'd like to know. The only article I read was the Q&A of Asaki during the press conference but I seemed to have lost my recording of the documentary and wanted to look up some names mentioned in it.

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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I ran one of these articles through a translator a few times. It's not so hard actually to connect the dots because the information is mostly superficial and usually Honda posts a lot imagery around it.

The most complex release they made was the one in 2016(2017?) On the MGUK management and extra harvest. I didn't need perfect translation even thought concopt was so complex because they had beautiful telemtry and numbers. And you know what they say in engineering.... Our language is numbers and diagrams.
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Wouter
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Toyoharu Tanabe

Honda Racing F1

This was the first day of practice at a permanent race track since the Spanish Grand Prix weekend in early May. We had fine weather with relatively high air and track temperatures during the sessions, particularly in the afternoon. For this race, at Red Bull Racing Honda, Max Verstappen and Sergio Perez ran new PUs, as did Pierre Gasly at Scuderia AlphaTauri Honda and we had no major issues throughout the day, going through the basic programme and function tests for a new PU, in addition to the usual job of gathering data. It looks as though the competition will again be very close with our nearest rivals. In this situation very small gaps can make a big difference to the final result, so we will be paying close attention to the smallest details with both our teams to optimise our PU performance for qualifying and the race.
https://honda.racing/f1/post/practice-france

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ispano6
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Fri Jun 18, 2021 5:43 pm
I ran one of these articles through a translator a few times. It's not so hard actually to connect the dots because the information is mostly superficial and usually Honda posts a lot imagery around it.

The most complex release they made was the one in 2016(2017?) On the MGUK management and extra harvest. I didn't need perfect translation even thought concopt was so complex because they had beautiful telemtry and numbers. And you know what they say in engineering.... Our language is numbers and diagrams.
Good for you, whatever it was that you were trying to learn or find out. Did you use a human translator or an image to text software? Or Google translate? Sure nothing was lost in translation?
As they say, the devil is in the details.

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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At the time i was looking at the energy graphs and the layout of the engine. Certain key words would tell me enough becauase Honda aren't going to say anything too detailed anyway.

For example to this day, no one knows what combustion method honda is using in F1.
We saw some patents about TJI with one injector for a Motorcylce engine, but nothing about F1.

Wazari was also a bit mumm about the exact method of combustion. He spoke a bit about the cylinder firing order and balancing and oil management etc.
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Wouter
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Max secures the 82nd pole position for a Honda-powered car in Formula 1
Circuit Paul Ricard
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Toyoharu Tanabe
Honda Racing F1

With Max taking his and the team’s second pole of the year, after the one at the season-opener in Bahrain and having three Honda powered cars in the top six, the result of today’s qualifying for the French Grand Prix was very good for us. Max had already been quickest in FP2 and 3 and made no mistakes in qualifying, and to be 0.258 seconds ahead of the second placed driver is an exceptional performance. Sergio secured fourth place with a time that is very close to that of the third placed driver. Having both Red Bull Racing Honda’s sharing the front two rows with the two Mercedes is also important in terms of tomorrow’s race strategy. In his home Grand Prix, for Scuderia AlphaTauri Honda, Pierre made progress through all the sessions and he is also in a strong position, sixth behind Perez. He has done an excellent job recently, this being the third consecutive time he has qualified in the top six. He has shown consistent race pace all season and so we can expect him to move up the order tomorrow. Yuki had a disappointing qualifying, crashing out right at the start of Q1. But in free practice, he has been quick, he knows this track and so he can have a solid race and most importantly for him, finish the race. Overall, it is very satisfying to take pole now that we are back at a permanent race track and just as we go into a series of three races on consecutive weekend. But tomorrow is what matters and anything can happen, so we will be simulating various scenarios tonight.

Max Verstappen

Red Bull Racing Honda

To be able to put it on pole here, on a track that has not been our favourite in terms of performance, is very promising and a big boost for the Team. We really did not expect it so I am of course very happy. Everything has been working really well all weekend and from today even compared to yesterday we made a good improvement through hard work and maximising set-up. I was confident after FP3 but you never really know where you are or what everyone else will bring in Qualifying, so we should be very happy with this performance so far. There is a long run to Turn 1 so we have to get a good start tomorrow and for sure they will be very close but our long run pace in FP2 looked good so I expect another tight battle.
A word from the other Honda drivers ................

https://honda.racing/f1/post/qualifying-france

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Wouter
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Capharol
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Wouter wrote:
Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:02 pm




you have to post it in every relevant thread?
Strive for continuous improvement, instead of perfection.
"Most people seem to turn off their brain when they turn on the computer and log in to social media."

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nzjrs
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Capharol wrote:
Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:25 pm
you have to post it in every relevant thread?
Personally, I like it, Wouter is very fast at posting these updates for people like me who don't use twitter.

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bigblue
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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No big deal, but prefer a single thread to be chosen.

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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Three wins on the bounce =D>

Let's have both drivers on the podium in the Austrian races and I'll start to believe the WCC is on. I couldn't care less about the WDC, I just want Honda to win the championship before they go [-o<

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Wouter
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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bigblue wrote:
Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:31 pm
No big deal, but prefer a single thread to be chosen.

And what thread would that be? :)

Honda is happy with it >>>>> General Honda thread.

RBR is happy with it. >>>>> RBR thread.

The race winner and finally two RBR drivers on the podium. >>>>> Race topic.

I can't choose. :lol:

Finally after all those years of Mercedes dominance not two Mercedes drivers on the podium. Its about time.

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Wouter
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Capharol wrote:
Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:25 pm
Wouter wrote:
Sun Jun 20, 2021 4:02 pm
.....................
you have to post it in every relevant thread?

See my previous answer to @Bigblue. :D