General Honda F1 Topic

Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.
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Wouter
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Wazari wrote:
Wed Dec 27, 2017 9:44 pm
Wouter wrote:
Wed Dec 27, 2017 1:08 pm
Wazari wrote:
Wed Dec 27, 2017 1:10 am


Also the total headcount at Sakura is about 900 with about 250 dedicated to the F1 PU. Less than half of Mercedes PU team. However to me the right personnel is just if not more important than the shear number of employees. I know I sound like a broken record but Tanabe-san is a big assest and definitely sees eye to eye with "team wazari"...

Wazari, do you know if Mario Illien is working for Honda?
No he is not
Thank you very much Wazari for your answer. I was hoping he would, because Honda said that they would accept help from the outside. :(

restless
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Why should he?!
It was claimed that there was some collaboration in 2017 - perhaps they had some knowledge transfers with him - if they got what know-how was deemed needed/enough ...
splitting work on such complex project inside&outside of Sakura would be logistical nightmare

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Wouter
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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restless wrote:
Thu Dec 28, 2017 1:13 pm
Why should he?!
It was claimed that there was some collaboration in 2017 - perhaps they had some knowledge transfers with him - if they got what know-how was deemed needed/enough ...
splitting work on such complex project inside&outside of Sakura would be logistical nightmare
As long as you still have problems with reliability and speed, it seems wise to hire the best people out there, and Illien is one of the best.
They have the money to hire extra expertise, why not do it? Mercedes also hired him for the current engines and we have all seen the result.

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lio007
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Wouter wrote:
Thu Dec 28, 2017 2:28 pm
restless wrote:
Thu Dec 28, 2017 1:13 pm
Why should he?!
It was claimed that there was some collaboration in 2017 - perhaps they had some knowledge transfers with him - if they got what know-how was deemed needed/enough ...
splitting work on such complex project inside&outside of Sakura would be logistical nightmare
As long as you still have problems with reliability and speed, it seems wise to hire the best people out there, and Illien is one of the best.
They have the money to hire extra expertise, why not do it? Mercedes also hired him for the current engines and we have all seen the result.
I know it's offtopic, but i can't remember any report that mentioned Illien worked for Merc on the current V6's.

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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lio007 wrote:
Tue Dec 26, 2017 10:07 pm
HPD wrote:
Tue Dec 26, 2017 7:22 pm
..."One of the big problems with McLaren was the vibrations: it happened because they did not connect the turbo and the MGU-H at high speeds, the solution is on the way and they have been working it for months"....
That's (for me) the most interesting part that I absolutely don't understand: "...they did not connect the Turbo and the MGU-H..."

Something lost in translation? Can anybody give us some Explanation?

A nice soup bone for the Honda engine thread!
Translation: They had to cut the electrical load from the MGUH at high turbocharger shaft speeds

I will not assume it is related to the bearings problem or whether it just the epectrical design of the MGUH. That is yet to be confrimed. Maybe Wazari can clue us in.
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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techman wrote:
Tue Dec 26, 2017 11:43 pm

just got to show honda getting rid of hasegawa is the best interest of honda. if hasegawa is scared to say it straight out the problem and take the blame , what sort of leader is he really. no problem 2018 is the year that dragster will be exposed by redbull.
I think Hasegawa was wise.
Remember. Tanabe would not come back to F1 if his friend Hasegwa didnt invite him. I think Hasegawa was calmy keeping things stable and cool to allow Honda to work quietly. No point in slinging panties with McLaren at such a delicate time (restructuring).
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Squid
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Speaking of Hasegawa, sorry but this was a stupid comment for him to make:
"We haven't decided next year's complete specification but at least we have a back-up plan, which is the current engine. So I'm sure we can start the season well next year."
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/hond ... up-991771/

What the hell was he thinking? He's pouring a big can of fuel into the fire. Doesn't matter if it's true or not, this is not the image you want to pass.

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HPD
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Squid wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:16 pm
Speaking of Hasegawa, sorry but this was a stupid comment for him to make:
"We haven't decided next year's complete specification but at least we have a back-up plan, which is the current engine. So I'm sure we can start the season well next year."
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/hond ... up-991771/

What the hell was he thinking? He's pouring a big can of fuel into the fire. Doesn't matter if it's true or not, this is not the image you want to pass.
They are very old interviews. Normally, the media maintains interviews to be published little by little. Now that Hasegawa left, they are throwing away everything they had saved.
These news are no longer related to what is currently happening within Honda.

Squid
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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HPD wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:25 pm
Squid wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:16 pm
Speaking of Hasegawa, sorry but this was a stupid comment for him to make:
"We haven't decided next year's complete specification but at least we have a back-up plan, which is the current engine. So I'm sure we can start the season well next year."
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/hond ... up-991771/

What the hell was he thinking? He's pouring a big can of fuel into the fire. Doesn't matter if it's true or not, this is not the image you want to pass.
They are very old interviews. Normally, the media maintains interviews to be published little by little. Now that Hasegawa left, they are throwing away everything they had saved.
These news are no longer related to what is currently happening within Honda.
I'm aware. Still, that part about having this year's engine as backup didn't need to be said. Honda needs to pass the image that Honda is on the right track and is confident in next year's engine. Saying that this year's engine will be a back-up plan does not accomplish that.

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Wouter
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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@WAZARI.

Is it true what is written in this artikel ? You said that Illien isn't working for Honda,
but are they continue accept (the same) help from outside now and next year?

In 2017, Honda took advantage of input from outside consultants to help it fast track improvements, although it will not reveal who it has been working with.

From next year, Honda plans to continue with those partnerships and even extend them.

"We started many collaborations with other partners, the identity of which we don't normally disclose," said Hasegawa.

"We can see results from that project.

"We will continue those collaborations. There's no reason to stop. We even have to enhance the collaboration more.

"I understand most people think Honda has tried to do it by themselves. But it's not right. We're happy to invite outside resource, and we do.

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PlatinumZealot
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Are consultants seen as outside help though?
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shingles
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Squid wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:43 pm
HPD wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:25 pm
Squid wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:16 pm
Speaking of Hasegawa, sorry but this was a stupid comment for him to make:



https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/hond ... up-991771/

What the hell was he thinking? He's pouring a big can of fuel into the fire. Doesn't matter if it's true or not, this is not the image you want to pass.
They are very old interviews. Normally, the media maintains interviews to be published little by little. Now that Hasegawa left, they are throwing away everything they had saved.
These news are no longer related to what is currently happening within Honda.
I'm aware. Still, that part about having this year's engine as backup didn't need to be said. Honda needs to pass the image that Honda is on the right track and is confident in next year's engine. Saying that this year's engine will be a back-up plan does not accomplish that.
My guess is that the comment was literally a throw away comment... as in "yup, we are working hard, the 18 engine is looking great. But you never know with these things... we always have this years engine as a back up if we absolutely needed it, if disaster occurs.". Also, know that the "quotes" that the reporters publish aren't always the EXACT quote. I have personal experience here. They tend to cut out the context of the comment and just quote what THEY think is interesting.

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Wazari
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Wouter wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 1:03 pm
@WAZARI.

Is it true what is written in this artikel ? You said that Illien isn't working for Honda,
but are they continue accept (the same) help from outside now and next year?

In 2017, Honda took advantage of input from outside consultants to help it fast track improvements, although it will not reveal who it has been working with.

From next year, Honda plans to continue with those partnerships and even extend them.

"We started many collaborations with other partners, the identity of which we don't normally disclose," said Hasegawa.

"We can see results from that project.

"We will continue those collaborations. There's no reason to stop. We even have to enhance the collaboration more.

"I understand most people think Honda has tried to do it by themselves. But it's not right. We're happy to invite outside resource, and we do.
You asked if one individual was still working with Honda and he isn't. I understand that it was his decision.

All manufacturers use "outside consultants" to some degree or another. I was an "outside consultant" along with our entire group. Some are still there. Also you work closely with your supply partners. However, too many "leaders" IMO spoil the soup. I always stated that Honda never refused outside help as many believed this rumor.

Also how old was this interview with Hasegawa-san?
If you can make the opposition flinch, you have already won.

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Wazari
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Wazari wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 5:07 pm
Wouter wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 1:03 pm
@WAZARI.

Is it true what is written in this artikel ? You said that Illien isn't working for Honda,
but are they continue accept (the same) help from outside now and next year?

In 2017, Honda took advantage of input from outside consultants to help it fast track improvements, although it will not reveal who it has been working with.

From next year, Honda plans to continue with those partnerships and even extend them.

"We started many collaborations with other partners, the identity of which we don't normally disclose," said Hasegawa.

"We can see results from that project.

"We will continue those collaborations. There's no reason to stop. We even have to enhance the collaboration more.

"I understand most people think Honda has tried to do it by themselves. But it's not right. We're happy to invite outside resource, and we do.
You asked if one individual was still working with Honda and he isn't. I understand that it was his decision.

All manufacturers use "outside consultants" to some degree or another. I was an "outside consultant" along with our entire group. Some are still there. Also you work closely with your supply partners. However, too many "leaders" IMO spoil the soup. I always stated that Honda never refused outside help as many believed this rumor. I think some confuse doing things "Honda's way" as not using outside help and that is not the case. The path taken to achieve a goal and the people that take that path are two different issues.

Also how old was this interview with Hasegawa-san?
If you can make the opposition flinch, you have already won.

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Wouter
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Re: General Honda F1 Topic

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Wazari wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 5:07 pm
Wouter wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 1:03 pm
@WAZARI.

Is it true what is written in this artikel ? You said that Illien isn't working for Honda,
but are they continue accept (the same) help from outside now and next year?

You asked if one individual was still working with Honda and he isn't. I understand that it was his decision.

All manufacturers use "outside consultants" to some degree or another. I was an "outside consultant" along with our entire group. Some are still there. Also you work closely with your supply partners. However, too many "leaders" IMO spoil the soup. I always stated that Honda never refused outside help as many believed this rumor.

Also how old was this interview with Hasegawa-san?

Thank you Wazari. This interview was written in an article today on Autosport. It wasn't mentioned when the interview took place.
"It's a great help [to stick with the same concept]," Honda's outgoing F1 project leader Yusuke Hasegawa told Autosport.
https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/13370 ... new-season