Vettel says VSC delta has a loophole

[strad]

I think the problem is they monitor speed not distance.
The racing line while quicker at racing speed is in some corners the longer route. Swinging from inside to outside and such to achieve the racing line covers distance.
Picture drag racing where the quickest time is achieved by going dead straight and it costs you time to drive the extra distance if you weave on your way to the finish line.
In this case you can make up time by covering the less distance by hugging the tightest line rather than the racing line. Every time you change your position on the track to achieve the racing line you travel farther.
To Vettel the non-racing line is this "ridiculous" line.

everybody's aware you can have a faster way to go under VSC than just follow the delta - by saving distance," Vettel said.

[Phil]

From the FIA Formula 1 2018 sporting regulations...

(I am on mobile, pdf can be found easily on fia.com)

40.5

All competing cars must reduce speed and stay above the minimum time set by the FIA ECU at least once in each marshalling sector (a marshalling sector is defined as the section of track between each of the FIA light panels). In addition, any driver entering the pit lane whilst the VSC procedure is in use must be above the minimum time set by the FIA ECU at the first safety car line as he enters the pit lane.

All cars must also be above this minimum time when the FIA light panels change to green (see 40.7 below).

When initiated during a race, the stewards may impose either of the penalties under Article 38.3a), b), c) or d) on any driver who fails to stay above the minimum time as required by the above.

[nevill3]

The pit lane entrance and exit is not restricted so a driver can increase his speed just prior to entering the pit lane entrance and maintain a higher speed up to the pit lane line where they have to reduce to the pit lane maximum. On exit they can accelerate as hard as they like from the second pit lane line until they reach the track and a little bit more.

This is where one loophole is I think.

[Edax]

I think the problem is they monitor speed not distance.
The racing line while quicker at racing speed is in some corners the longer route. Swinging from inside to outside and such to achieve the racing line covers distance.
Picture drag racing where the quickest time is achieved by going dead straight and it costs you time to drive the extra distance if you weave on your way to the finish line.
In this case you can make up time by covering the less distance by hugging the tightest line rather than the racing line. Every time you change your position on the track to achieve the racing line you travel farther.
To Vettel the non-racing line is this "ridiculous" line.

everybody's aware you can have a faster way to go under VSC than just follow the delta - by saving distance," Vettel said.

Rather they monitor speed not time. The comment of Whiting also seems to confirm vettels claim:

”If it's measured every 50m then any advantage you can get for taking a different line on the track is going to be absolutely minimal.”

So he confirms there is an advantage only he downplays the magnitude.

The other thing you can read is that they benchmark every 50 meters. Question is who’s 50 meters? The suggestion is that it is based on wheel rotation rather than fixed trackside references otherwise line wouldn’t matter.

I am starting to get the feeling that the FIA instead took a shortcut in implementing this system. What would be the proper way is to measure section speed based on GPS or transponder, calculate the 40%, relay that to the car and then compare that to the cars actuals. That would mean that they would have to invest in the aquisition/ calculations and analyis capabilities, but also that they would have to invest in a new communication channel with the car. And of course certify all of that.

What I suspect they actually did is give the teams a couple lines of code like “measure the speeds during the last 5 standard laps and display a delta to the 40% on the wheel, then send a pass fail signal via the telemetry ( which FIA reads anyway)”. That means no investments needed other than 50 lines of code, and since they control the software on the car they can enforce it. However since it is confined to the cars isolated electrical systems they can only access the information which is available, and that is speed not position.

[Big Tea]

A "minimal" advantage every 50 mtr though... ?

[strad]

Over a 1/4 mile weaving to the right and back to the center can increase the distance by over 50 feet.
Think how that adds up over the length of say Barcelona. I'm thinking sticking to the racing line could easily add a quarter mile to a lap.
One of you math whizzes would have to figure out how many feet they add by crossing the track repeatedly to go from apex to apex as they do when racing.

[Nickel]

Does anyone have some extended footage of drivers under the vsc?

[Moose]

A 'normal' line around a corner may cover (say) 300 mtr of road/distance, which following the formula takes X seconds.

A wide line covers 320 mtr which takes the same time as 300 mtr plus allows you to close up 20 mtr as the same distance is covered.

This doesn't make sense.

Taking a wide line doesn't gain you 20 meters at all. You had to go 20 meters further.

There is a slight advantage I can think of though. If you instead take the *shortest* path through the sector, you can burn slightly less fuel, and use slightly less rubber. That's the only way I can see to gain from a particular line in VSC periods.

[NathanOlder]

But none of the distances matter if there is a minimum sector time. If you guys are talking so much about distances of different lines, that must mean there is no minimum sector times ??

[Ennis]

But none of the distances matter if there is a minimum sector time. If you guys are talking so much about distances of different lines, that must mean there is no minimum sector times ??

I think this entire thread shows how little we actually know about this.

How severe is the minimum sector time? Can they take slightly shorter lines, and a very strictly enforced speed, and gain time over a much more 'loose' minimum sector time?

Why is the information on how this is done not transparent at the outset, or was it simply a case of no journalist asking the question when this was created?

[AJI]

But none of the distances matter if there is a minimum sector time. If you guys are talking so much about distances of different lines, that must mean there is no minimum sector times ??

Yeah... sort of, this thread hurts my brain...
Technically you can gain distance with a shorter line but keep within the time delta, but realistically how much distance..? When a VSC period ends the only gain (or rather lack of loss) I have ever seen is if someone pits and returns to the track without losing position.

That said, if one driver is taking a shorter line around the track to shorten the distance they will all be doing it, so Vettel's point is kind of pointless.

The big question for me is how is this monitored and how do they determine the appropriate delta for each marshalling sector? How big is a marshalling sector anyway?
Are the drivers physically watching the timing display for every sector? This seems pretty taxing to me, but the teams can still coordinate well enough to pull off a freebie pit stop, usually...

[Big Tea]

A 'normal' line around a corner may cover (say) 300 mtr of road/distance, which following the formula takes X seconds.

A wide line covers 320 mtr which takes the same time as 300 mtr plus allows you to close up 20 mtr as the same distance is covered.

This doesn't make sense.

Taking a wide line doesn't gain you 20 meters at all. You had to go 20 meters further.

There is a slight advantage I can think of though. If you instead take the *shortest* path through the sector, you can burn slightly less fuel, and use slightly less rubber. That's the only way I can see to gain from a particular line in VSC periods.

It means you can cover that 20 mtr getting closer to the car you are following if it is averaged speed/distance, or if just distance, as you say, you can cut the corner in the style of a track runner.

[Cold Fussion]

The system is pretty flawed even if all cars go around at the same speed; at the restart a car on corner entry will have a massive advantage over a car at corner exit.. What NathanOlders suggestion does cover is the nuisance of backmarkers failing to keep to their delta. Anyway I don't really see what the VSC has to offer over double yellow, and in my opinion it needs to be scrapped as it does upset racing.

In a perfect world the double waved yellows is probably a better system, the problem is in practice the amount of slowing down for the double yellows is driver subjective, and thus ripe to be taken advantage of (which it was). Ultimately there is no perfect solution to the problem.

[ian_s]

"It's the same for everyone but the FIA is supplying us with a system that makes us follow a delta time, and everybody has to slow down by, I think, 40%, but I think everybody's aware you can have a faster way to go under VSC than just follow the delta - by saving distance," Vettel said.

If everyones doing it, and its not dangerous, who cares?

[NathanOlder]

Vettel does.