Technical analysis of completing and defending overtakes

[JonoNic]

I will just leave this here

[JonoNic]

What did you guys think of Vettel's overtake on Perez into Ascari? There were many initial comments that it was reckless but it looked quite clean to me. Was it maybe the cut in front of Perez after the overtake?

[sosic2121]

My view on Vettel - Hamilton.
Vettel was so close to Raikkonen and lost a lot of front end grip. So he understeered into Hamilton despite being slower than him.
Vettel's fault, no intention, and imo no penalty necessary.

On Verstappen.
Sore looser.

[nzjrs]

As for Verstappen on Bottas, does anyone have any doubt that it was just a dick move?

Isn't that just a message to Bottas that Verstappen will make life difficult for him if he cannot keep pace with the front three?

The problem in this case wasn't even Bottas' ability to keep up, but actually Mercedes sacrificing his race to get the win.
I really don't know what Verstappen's intention is. I remember seeing a video of Martin Brundle talking about Ayrton Senna, that he used to put other drivers in a position where if they didn't let him pass there would be an accident, and if they did let him pass, he knew that from then on they'd let him pass every time he showed a wheel.
I don't know if that's his intention, or he's just plain reckless. All I know is that so far he just seems to be throwing his talent away with that sort of bullshit.

For me it's clear that he knows this year is, from a championship perspective, worthless. Therefor he is taking on the advice/mantra of Senna and using this year to teach the others drivers a lesson they will remember in the furture - that he will run them both off the road if they don't yield.

[dans79]

For me it's clear that he knows this year is, from a championship perspective, worthless. Therefor he is taking on the advice/mantra of Senna and using this year to teach the others drivers a lesson they will remember in the furture - that he will run them both off the road if they don't yield.

The big difference between Senna and Max, is that Senna had the respect of the other drivers. I'd be shocked if any of the top or even midfield drivers respect Max. I mean look at how Hamilton referred to him after Bahrain. Or what Vettel called him during the race In Mexico 2016

[DiogoBrand]

Isn't that just a message to Bottas that Verstappen will make life difficult for him if he cannot keep pace with the front three?

The problem in this case wasn't even Bottas' ability to keep up, but actually Mercedes sacrificing his race to get the win.
I really don't know what Verstappen's intention is. I remember seeing a video of Martin Brundle talking about Ayrton Senna, that he used to put other drivers in a position where if they didn't let him pass there would be an accident, and if they did let him pass, he knew that from then on they'd let him pass every time he showed a wheel.
I don't know if that's his intention, or he's just plain reckless. All I know is that so far he just seems to be throwing his talent away with that sort of bullshit.

For me it's clear that he knows this year is, from a championship perspective, worthless. Therefor he is taking on the advice/mantra of Senna and using this year to teach the others drivers a lesson they will remember in the furture - that he will run them both off the road if they don't yield.

May be. I would be surprised if he behaved like that while fighting for a title. But then again, he doesn't cease to negatively amaze me. If Vettel can make stupid moves with a title on the line, then definitely so can Verstappen.

[marmer]

It's all about asserting yourself over the other driver. Ham has done this over vet mentally. Vet worries about Hamilton attacking him if he is behind. Ham worries about Ferrari pace if he pits not vettels ability to pass him.

Same way drivers gain respect is be surprising the bigger names. I remember a few years ago when Danny Ric was battling with Alonso
Alonso was in a much quicker car and found it hard to pass Ric. From that moment Ric was a real driver everyone knew he could do it at a top level.

Hamilton is interesting as a driver though he has been spooked in a way by two drivers who most people overlook button and rosberg
Button got the best of him in there time together and never seemed bothered by Hamilton why he seemed troubled by button. Nico didn't bother Hamilton at first but free as a driver.

Equally he mentally got the better of Alonso and he hasn't been affected badly by anyone else

[strad]

Verstappen has been allowed to race by his team and the FiA as if he'd already won multiple championships

So if you have won a championship you can get away with doing things like giving people a choice of letting you past or wrecking?
Senna did this and people adored him. Schumacher learned it from Senna and Verstappen is just following in their footsteps.

[JonoNic]

Here are 100 passes by Senna without any commentary, only stupid music.

What I noticed that there are not many lock-ups from these drivers who ultimately had less aero back then.

[Sevach]

As for Verstappen on Bottas, does anyone have any doubt that it was just a dick move?

Most drivers come back to crowd the driver on the outside, IMO Verstappen just miscalculated, was too aggressive in his closing move.

[DiogoBrand]

As for Verstappen on Bottas, does anyone have any doubt that it was just a dick move?

Most drivers come back to crowd the driver on the outside, IMO Verstappen just miscalculated, was too aggressive in his closing move.

Which would be okay if it was his first time being an ass to defend a position.

[dans79]

As for Verstappen on Bottas, does anyone have any doubt that it was just a dick move?

Most drivers come back to crowd the driver on the outside, IMO Verstappen just miscalculated, was too aggressive in his closing move.

Which would be okay if it was his first time being an ass to defend a position.

Honestly, what earns him such a bad wrap, is his routine meltdowns every time he's told he has a penalty.

[TwanV]

This thread is a good idea, but everyone seems offtopic or perhaps it's my subjective interpretation of a technical analysis. I would call it: Local Campground of the Fellowship of Inconsolable Verstappen Critics.

I was making a joke yesterday but you guys are really at it.. so much frustration here it's embarrassing.

Sorry JonoNic, I won't be participating in this thread.

[JonoNic]

I fear this thread may go way off topic. In race threads the voting function has been removed, so that's why we should keep it more technical here.

[Red Rock Mutley]

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