Making F1 Great Again

Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.
User avatar
Big Tea
99
Joined: 24 Dec 2017, 20:57

Re: Making F1 Great Again

Post

It may sound like a stupid question ( because it is) but..

I love watching classics race. Is against the rules to make a 'new' classic?

For instance, imagine a grid full of MP4/2s and contemporary cars run as real races ( not that they hold back ) Ferrari 126, Brabhams etc.

Toys for rich boys, Ok, but what entertainment for the rest of us.
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

User avatar
Zynerji
110
Joined: 27 Jan 2016, 16:14

Re: Making F1 Great Again

Post

Big Tea wrote:
01 May 2019, 20:49
It may sound like a stupid question ( because it is) but..

I love watching classics race. Is against the rules to make a 'new' classic?

For instance, imagine a grid full of MP4/2s and contemporary cars run as real races ( not that they hold back ) Ferrari 126, Brabhams etc.

Toys for rich boys, Ok, but what entertainment for the rest of us.
A grid full of 2007 Ferraris and McLarens with top drivers would be my favorite for sure.

Just_a_fan
591
Joined: 31 Jan 2010, 20:37

Re: Making F1 Great Again

Post

Big Tea wrote:
01 May 2019, 20:49

For instance, imagine a grid full of MP4/2s and contemporary cars run as real races ( not that they hold back ) Ferrari 126, Brabhams etc.
What, like the FIA Masters Historic Formula One Championship?
If you are more fortunate than others, build a larger table not a taller fence.

zac510
22
Joined: 24 Jan 2006, 12:58

Re: Making F1 Great Again

Post

Zynerji wrote:
01 May 2019, 23:34
A grid full of 2007 Ferraris and McLarens with top drivers would be my favorite for sure.
This comment goes to show how much beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I remember people complaining during this era about 'too many flip-ups' , especially in 2008, leading to the sidepod curvature rules.

People beginning to watch F1 now will feel nostalgic for the hybrid turbo era in 2030 :D

Even though I'm an older guy, I feel a bit nostalgic for the cars of 10 years ago too. When I look back to 2009, then another 5-10 years before that (and further) I see the changing trend and styles of cars, some engineer driven and some rule driven, and I see them all interesting and unique in their way and representing ideas and attitudes at the time, rather than one as solely the best.

Just_a_fan
591
Joined: 31 Jan 2010, 20:37

Re: Making F1 Great Again

Post

Aesthetically, for me, Formula One cars are best shown by the Mp4/6 and the FW14B.
If you are more fortunate than others, build a larger table not a taller fence.

User avatar
Big Tea
99
Joined: 24 Dec 2017, 20:57

Re: Making F1 Great Again

Post

Just_a_fan wrote:
02 May 2019, 00:03
Big Tea wrote:
01 May 2019, 20:49

For instance, imagine a grid full of MP4/2s and contemporary cars run as real races ( not that they hold back ) Ferrari 126, Brabhams etc.
What, like the FIA Masters Historic Formula One Championship?
Yes, but with modern built cars so there is no fear of losing a heirloom. There could also be some scope for safety improvements and slight tweaks to make them more 'up to date' without destroying the ethos.

Attending team numbers should also be kept low as it was 'in the day'. There could be a few period points with devisions where a particular large step was made ( active suspension etc ) even if the cars run at the same time.

I mean, someone would only meed a few hundred million to set it up :oops:
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

Slo Poke
3
Joined: 11 Apr 2019, 12:14

Re: Making F1 Great Again

Post

roon wrote:
01 May 2019, 03:38
But they are fast. They're faster than any other era. Might consider to update your associations. In the old school, there were no rules nor concern about engine sound aesthetics. They weren't trying to sound like the previous generations of cars, nor were the generation before them trying to sound like horses.

'Make great again' philosophies attempt to recreate or extend particular aesthetic cues beyond the eras they naturally arose within, into new eras artificially. Retroism.

I see a parallel between F1 and politics in this context. Population growth combined with technological development created cultural changes and inspired new legislation. Oftentimes in the name of safety for humans and or environment.

In F1, tech advancement created a similar sort of population growth scenario. The tracks could not handle the competitive necessity of ever faster cars. This inspired legislation over decades and the original competitive nature was lost.

Now we are in eras where the legislations are somewhat resented. But without full consideration people simply say "make it look like x years ago." Which is to say, lie to me. Give me illusions.

To truly address some of these concerns, foundations must be addressed. Politically, great-again would mean returns to real competition and combat, real death and consequences. Same for the race track.

But in this era we do not permit the zealous to die. I wonder if in the long run it is safer to let the hypercompetitive racer types drive into armco when they're still in their 20s or 30s. There is a Darwinian element perhaps not fully appreciated. Now we have zombie twentysomethigns living into their eighties because death, zealousness, grandeur, heroism, and daredeviling is outlawed.

Removing barriers, crash structures, halos, HANS devices, and 90% of the rulebook would create the foundation for real competition and risk, from which would attract real spectator curiosity and likely would result in louder cars as well. I doubt MxGA proponents want to go there, at the racetrack nor elsewhere. They like their lap belts, actually.
Roon, My Friend. If I was not Barred from doing so, I would have plus one’d your comment instantly. The mention you make of Darwinism is accurate in itself but attributed wrongly. That attribute belongs with Newey and the rule makers know it. That man has the entire f1 circus show by the nose and all other designers are in his wake, struggling to keep up and that’s a fact.
What I say, is Bar the man from every in season future GP but employ an especially commissioned TV crew to prowl the starting grid as he did or does, armed with a clipboard and pencil (how embarrassing must that be?), to let him and us, see the cars before the race starts on tv. The tv crew would have to contend with the constantly view blocking shuffling of grid mechanics but didn’t Red Bull initiate that little caper? F1 seems to be living in the dark ages as far as I’m concerned or might that be where f1 wants to keep us, the paying spectator, If that’s the case then how do we explain how I know exactly what Newey’s up to with Verstappen’s car and not Gasly’s? That is unlikely to ever be seen on tv. Furthermore I’m almost convinced that Mercedes have figured out what that is, and are busy trying to hide the fact, so we should all of us brace ourselves for twenty one locked out grid formations and for twenty one, with reliability, one, two race wins and that’s another fact.
Another fact would be the fact that has been mentioned everywhere the rules butt in and too little can be done to either capitalise, circumvent or just interpret them differently! The essence of this comment is not Darwinism or anything at all even neo-Darwinian. I am not a race driver and I will not chew on a bone wether it was thrown with intent or by design.

Just_a_fan
591
Joined: 31 Jan 2010, 20:37

Re: Making F1 Great Again

Post

Big Tea wrote:
02 May 2019, 16:12
Just_a_fan wrote:
02 May 2019, 00:03
What, like the FIA Masters Historic Formula One Championship?
Yes, but with modern built cars so there is no fear of losing a heirloom. There could also be some scope for safety improvements and slight tweaks to make them more 'up to date' without destroying the ethos.
Ah, I see you what you meant now. Yes, some "new that looks old" stuff would be cool and prevent the old stuff being stuffed in to a barrier.
If you are more fortunate than others, build a larger table not a taller fence.