The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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raymondu999
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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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raymondu999 wrote:
29 Sep 2019, 08:39
I think the big thing is Seb is a momentum driver, whereas Charles is seemingly a direction driver. Seb likes to carry speed across corners whereas Charles seems like someone who likes to point the car and get a straighter exit.

Looking at the onboard comparisons of ghe last few races, I think (contrary to popular belief) that the Ferrari’s advantage is not power; but torque. That second phase of the exit when cars arent traction limited is where the Ferraris are stronger than the Mercs, not at the end of straights.

With Ferrari’s lower cornering performance Vettel’s momentum “style” is more disadvantaged than Leclerc’s; and whatever speed deficit Leclerc has on any apex would be countered by the Ferrari’s greater early acceleration
Back on this post that I stated a while ago; I think it's rather telling (and supportive of my argument) that whenever the circuit is one that requires a higher-downforce package (ie - suzuka; singapore; hungary) then Vettel has, relatively speaking, performed better. On the flipside; when it's a lower-downforce circuit (Monza; Spa) then Vettel has performed relatively worse. Possible exception being Monza qualifying; where Seb was close to Leclerc in time (relatively; given he had no tow which some estimated to be between 5-7 tenths worth)
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ENGINE TUNER
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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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raymondu999 wrote:
22 Oct 2019, 10:58
ENGINE TUNER wrote:
21 Oct 2019, 18:50
raymondu999 wrote:
12 Oct 2019, 14:21
I hate reviving dormant threads.

But I just stumbled across this (albeit old) article which I dont think anyone has posted yet; and I think is a good assessment of the situation https://www.skysports.com/f1/news/32420 ... s-mistakes
What a load of crock. Vettel apologists are silly. He keeps causing unnecessary accidents and making silly mistakes and they are nobody's fault except his own. Why weren't there as many Maldonado and Grosjean apologists? They are just as fast and just as accident/mistake prone as Vettel. Ferrari gave VET the fastest car in Bahrain, he spins. Fastest car in Japan, jump start. He had absolutely no pressure in Germany last year, Hamilton started 16th or something, vettel puts it in the wall. It's not RBR, or Ferrari or pressure, IT IS VETTEL, he is the problem, always has been.
None of your claims rebut the post in any way though.
I absolutely did...
So it's all Vettel's fault?

Actually, no. No, it's not. It is also Ferrari's fault.

In fact, the root of the pressure that is behind these accidents almost certainly originates from the operational shortfalls of the team. Prior to his joining the Scuderia, Vettel's career was almost blemish-free. Pressure errors were not part of his game.

Which implies that there is something about driving for Ferrari which is triggering them.
This is patently false, vettel has been mistake and crash prone his entire career. Crashing into Webber Japan 07, Webber again in Turkey 10, into Button Spa 10, going off in front of Button in Canada, crashing into the "cucumber", crashing in DRS boards, crashing in Senna in Brazil 12, and many, many more before he went to Ferrari. It has absolutely nothing to do with Ferrari, HE HAS ALWAYS BEEN LIKE THIS.

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raymondu999
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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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Crashing Webber at Fuji 07 was later shown to not be his fault though.

Mark Hughes’ general point though I believe is still valid. Even if Vettel was previously error-prone; he has never been as error prone as he has been these last few years with Ferrari
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ENGINE TUNER
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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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Crashing into Webber in Japan was fully his fault, regardless of who they tried to lay the blame on. He also tried to blame Baku 17 on Hamilton. Blamed Webber in Turkey 10, Tried to blame Verstappen in Singapore 17, Tried to blame Hamilton in Monza 18. See a pattern? It's never his fault.
Even if Vettel was previously error-prone; he has never been as error prone as he has been these last few years with Ferrari
He's been in more traffic with Ferrari because he didn't have by far the fastest car like he did in RBR, more traffic means more opportunities for mistakes.

Ferrari are not the problem, as evidenced by LEC'S great first season with them. Vettel is the problem.

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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ENGINE TUNER wrote:
21 Oct 2019, 18:53
PlatinumZealot wrote:
12 Oct 2019, 23:19
So baby schumi he is not then.
Retired now, been re-watching old races, Schumi made alot more mistakes than I remembered. He might actually be baby Schumi, but without a dream team (Todt, Brawn, Byrne) behind him. Plus both intentional crashed into competitors.
You know I was actually meaning Shumi from the point of leading and developing a team I mean. The article blames Ferrari for Sebastian's mistakes. For Schumacher he and the team were in perfect harmony and no such mistakes would every come up so often.
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raymondu999
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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
22 Oct 2019, 18:26
ENGINE TUNER wrote:
21 Oct 2019, 18:53
PlatinumZealot wrote:
12 Oct 2019, 23:19
So baby schumi he is not then.
Retired now, been re-watching old races, Schumi made alot more mistakes than I remembered. He might actually be baby Schumi, but without a dream team (Todt, Brawn, Byrne) behind him. Plus both intentional crashed into competitors.
You know I was actually meaning Shumi from the point of leading and developing a team I mean. The article blames Ferrari for Sebastian's mistakes. For Schumacher he and the team were in perfect harmony and no such mistakes would every come up so often.
Yeah; the current team + Seb is not running well... which in turn forces more mistakes
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raymondu999
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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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ENGINE TUNER wrote:
22 Oct 2019, 13:51
Crashing into Webber in Japan was fully his fault, regardless of who they tried to lay the blame on.
Iirc stewards penalised Vettel, after which they rescinded the penalty due to vids showing how it should have been someone else to blame.
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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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raymondu999 wrote:
22 Oct 2019, 18:49
ENGINE TUNER wrote:
22 Oct 2019, 13:51
Crashing into Webber in Japan was fully his fault, regardless of who they tried to lay the blame on.
Iirc stewards penalised Vettel, after which they rescinded the penalty due to vids showing how it should have been someone else to blame.
It was a bunch of nonsense, red bull tried to cover for their wunderkind by trying to put the blame on Hamilton, their blame game was effective with the rediculous stewards of that race who made many silly decisions that weekend. They were behind the SC, Hamilton was trying to keep his tires warm and not glaze his brakes, he pulled way to the right, Webber saw that and gave him space and pulled way to the left, Vettel slammed into the back of Webber for whatever reason, but it was fully his fault, just like in Baku 17.

Red Bull begged for Vettel not to be penalized claiming that they suffered enough because he hit another Red Bull while trying to blame Hamilton, same reasoning why Vettel didn't get penalized in Turkey 2010. He's been blaming others and getting off his entire career... "You came in like a torpedo!!!". BS.

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Vettel165
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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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ENGINE TUNER wrote:
22 Oct 2019, 19:54
raymondu999 wrote:
22 Oct 2019, 18:49
ENGINE TUNER wrote:
22 Oct 2019, 13:51
Crashing into Webber in Japan was fully his fault, regardless of who they tried to lay the blame on.
Iirc stewards penalised Vettel, after which they rescinded the penalty due to vids showing how it should have been someone else to blame.
It was a bunch of nonsense, red bull tried to cover for their wunderkind by trying to put the blame on Hamilton, their blame game was effective with the rediculous stewards of that race who made many silly decisions that weekend. They were behind the SC, Hamilton was trying to keep his tires warm and not glaze his brakes, he pulled way to the right, Webber saw that and gave him space and pulled way to the left, Vettel slammed into the back of Webber for whatever reason, but it was fully his fault, just like in Baku 17.

Red Bull begged for Vettel not to be penalized claiming that they suffered enough because he hit another Red Bull while trying to blame Hamilton, same reasoning why Vettel didn't get penalized in Turkey 2010. He's been blaming others and getting off his entire career... "You came in like a torpedo!!!". BS.
I better avoid this topic, as you are just a salty Seb hater. All drivers make mistakes, your posts are a big joke really. because of your bias against a certain driver, which is clouding your mind. As Leclerc made even more mistakes this year as Seb, and Max also. Double standards here.

Seb is a 4 time world champion and will always be, on his day he is a monster, very fast. A deserving 4 time world champion as the same can be said for Hamilton, who is just plain faster than Seb and a tier higher. Its not hard for me as Seb fan to say that. But nothing to take away from Seb he had his time, Hamilton deserved his time. Both drivers from 2009 on have completely dominated the sport with I think together more than 130 wins and 10 worlds title. So just calm a bit down, take a deep breath and come back later.
Last edited by Vettel165 on 28 Oct 2019, 20:37, edited 2 times in total.

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Vettel165
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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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raymondu999 wrote:
22 Oct 2019, 18:49
ENGINE TUNER wrote:
22 Oct 2019, 13:51
Crashing into Webber in Japan was fully his fault, regardless of who they tried to lay the blame on.
Iirc stewards penalised Vettel, after which they rescinded the penalty due to vids showing how it should have been someone else to blame.
It was Hamilton slowing down unnecessary that race which coused the accident.

LM10
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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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ENGINE TUNER wrote:
21 Oct 2019, 18:53
PlatinumZealot wrote:
12 Oct 2019, 23:19
So baby schumi he is not then.
Retired now, been re-watching old races, Schumi made alot more mistakes than I remembered. He might actually be baby Schumi, but without a dream team (Todt, Brawn, Byrne) behind him. Plus both intentional crashed into competitors.
Can’t remember Vettel intentionally crashing in a competitor.

Also, what has Vettel done to you which makes you prioritize your hate towards him in the majority of your posts?

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RZS10
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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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Baku?

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NathanOlder
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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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RZS10 wrote:
28 Oct 2019, 21:46
Baku?
Lol. Please don't say that was an accident LM10 :wtf:
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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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Vettel165 wrote:
28 Oct 2019, 20:35
raymondu999 wrote:
22 Oct 2019, 18:49
ENGINE TUNER wrote:
22 Oct 2019, 13:51
Crashing into Webber in Japan was fully his fault, regardless of who they tried to lay the blame on.
Iirc stewards penalised Vettel, after which they rescinded the penalty due to vids showing how it should have been someone else to blame.
It was Hamilton slowing down unnecessary that race which coused the accident.
Slowing down unnecessarily behind the safety car? Please stop the nonsense, Webber was directly behind Hamilton and didn't crash into him, it was Vettel who crashed into the back of Webber behind the SC, sound familiar? Vettel is a fraud and a clown, and that was the first of his many crashes and mistakes, he crashed into the back of his teammate again this weekend. Vettel easily the worst multi wdc driver in F1 history.

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Re: The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

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LM10 wrote:
28 Oct 2019, 21:06
ENGINE TUNER wrote:
21 Oct 2019, 18:53
PlatinumZealot wrote:
12 Oct 2019, 23:19
So baby schumi he is not then.
Retired now, been re-watching old races, Schumi made alot more mistakes than I remembered. He might actually be baby Schumi, but without a dream team (Todt, Brawn, Byrne) behind him. Plus both intentional crashed into competitors.
Can’t remember Vettel intentionally crashing in a competitor.
Credibility gone. Remember better please.

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