Renault ECUs impounded

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littlebigcat
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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Sorry, what is the button on the steering wheel often marked as PIT or PL? Isn't that a preselected gear and rev limit to aid the driver?

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Morteza
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

nokivasara
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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littlebigcat wrote:
Fri Oct 25, 2019 2:21 pm
Sorry, what is the button on the steering wheel often marked as PIT or PL? Isn't that a preselected gear and rev limit to aid the driver?
Touché =D>

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henry
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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On a similar topic. Are the lights at the top of the steering wheel a rev count indicator or a change point indicator? If the latter why is that not a driver aid? Not to mention beeps in the ear to lift and coast.
Fortune favours the prepared; she has no favourites and takes no sides.
Truth is confirmed by inspection and delay; falsehood by haste and uncertainty : Tacitus

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subcritical71
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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henry wrote:
Fri Oct 25, 2019 10:58 pm
On a similar topic. Are the lights at the top of the steering wheel a rev count indicator or a change point indicator? If the latter why is that not a driver aid? Not to mention beeps in the ear to lift and coast.
Or the operation of the PU individual elements... i can understand the PU torque as a function of pedal position, but at full throttle the CE dictates PU operation (energy strategy) based on a preset algorithm.... driver aid?

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subcritical71
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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subcritical71 wrote:
Sat Oct 26, 2019 1:19 am

Or the operation of the PU individual elements... i can understand the PU torque as a function of pedal position, but at full throttle the CE dictates PU operation (energy strategy) based on a preset algorithm.... driver aid?
I've never been a particular fan of Cyril, but I seem to agree with him;
"It's a driver aid, just like as we said before a number of things are driver aids – I'll give you one, energy deployment. It's all lap distance based. At some point you need to accept that there's an element of subjectivity."

thestig84
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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I posted that ages ago on this thread but nobody acknowledged it.

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henry
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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subcritical71 wrote:
Sat Oct 26, 2019 1:19 am
henry wrote:
Fri Oct 25, 2019 10:58 pm
On a similar topic. Are the lights at the top of the steering wheel a rev count indicator or a change point indicator? If the latter why is that not a driver aid? Not to mention beeps in the ear to lift and coast.
Or the operation of the PU individual elements... i can understand the PU torque as a function of pedal position, but at full throttle the CE dictates PU operation (energy strategy) based on a preset algorithm.... driver aid?
Indeed. And the question arises what torque level matches 100% accelerator. Is it ICE torque with the higher levels introduced by the ECU as it judged they are needed? Or e-boost with the ECU reducing power to save energy? Or some mystical in between. Whatever it is something happens such that the driver is not unaided.
Fortune favours the prepared; she has no favourites and takes no sides.
Truth is confirmed by inspection and delay; falsehood by haste and uncertainty : Tacitus

gridwalker
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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Grosjean: Illegal Renault system in use since 2015

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/gros ... st=organic
"Change is inevitable, except from a vending machine ..."

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subcritical71
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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gridwalker wrote:
Sat Oct 26, 2019 1:07 pm
Grosjean: Illegal Renault system in use since 2015

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/gros ... st=organic
Which further makes this a joke. At least 5 years running an “illegal” system and your only excluded from one race!

101FlyingDutchman
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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Or if it can be used for so long then the whole scrutineering process is a complete joke and not fit for purpose. You wonder what else other teams have been doing or are continuing to do and remain “undetected”

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subcritical71
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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subcritical71 wrote:
Sat Oct 26, 2019 1:44 pm
gridwalker wrote:
Sat Oct 26, 2019 1:07 pm
Grosjean: Illegal Renault system in use since 2015

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/gros ... st=organic
Which further makes this a joke. At least 5 years running an “illegal” system and your only excluded from one race!
Somebody needs to protest DRS. I mean, if ever there was a driver aid meant to diminish the skill of the driver, it’s DRS. Sure it’s allowed by the technical regulations, but as a driver aid it’s against the sporting regulations!

rogazilla
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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This argument will lead down to flint stone race. Because the engine assist the driver... next we be watching marathons

littlebigcat
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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I interpret a driver aid as something that directly changes an input from the driver. So powersteering isn't because it doesn't change how much or little a driver is turning based on the input. The power unit mapping of the ICE,MGU-K and MGU-H isn't an aid because it doesn't change the input into the power unit, 100% throttle is still 100% throttle, just the map changes how that 100% throttle is interpreted by the three systems of the power unit.

Pit limiter is most definitely a driver aid and also breaks rule 5.7 of the tech regs so, I don't know what the hell the FIA are all about really.

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subcritical71
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Re: Renault ECUs impounded

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littlebigcat wrote:
Sat Oct 26, 2019 5:09 pm
I interpret a driver aid as something that directly changes an input from the driver. So powersteering isn't because it doesn't change how much or little a driver is turning based on the input. The power unit mapping of the ICE,MGU-K and MGU-H isn't an aid because it doesn't change the input into the power unit, 100% throttle is still 100% throttle, just the map changes how that 100% throttle is interpreted by the three systems of the power unit.

Pit limiter is most definitely a driver aid and also breaks rule 5.7 of the tech regs so, I don't know what the hell the FIA are all about really.
While I can agree with the power steering, the PU at 100% pedal position is not 100% PU output. And this is not under the drivers control, the K and / or H have strategies which change based on track position as well as strat modes. Essentially the same argument as the brake bias. If you want to male it driver aid-less the driver would have to adjust the deployment/harvest by way of physical input. While I think that would abide by the sporting regs, I would hate to see the driver playing steering wheel olympics (adjusting strat modes / deployment strategy / brake bias / diff settings / drs / radio / shifting / etc.) between corners and not racing.