So what will F1 teams do this year?

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Jolle
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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izzy wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 6:43 pm
strad wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 5:56 pm
Aren't the seats even a standard fitting?
Nope. Each seat is form fitted to the driver.
yes i meant the seat to the chassis, so they don't need to foam a new one each time. but it seems like the bolts can be in different places:
14.8 Seat fixing and removal :
14.8.1 In order that an injured driver may be removed from the car in his seat following an accident,
all cars must be fitted with a seat which, if it is secured, must be done so with no more than
two bolts. If bolts are used they must be :
a) Clearly indicated and easily accessible to rescue crews.
b) Fitted vertically.
c) Removable with the same tool for all teams and which is issued to all rescue crews.
but making a seat isn't too big a deal
Not just the seat. Pedals, steering wheel. Plus driver are only part of a bigger team. Race engineer, sim driver, etc etc. Would be easier to put them all in F2 cars. But then again, that’s not the point of F1.

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izzy
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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Jolle wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:18 pm
Not just the seat. Pedals, steering wheel. Plus driver are only part of a bigger team. Race engineer, sim driver, etc etc. Would be easier to put them all in F2 cars. But then again, that’s not the point of F1.
the pedals and steering wheel are designed to be adjusted at least, for the reserve driver who might be any size after the car's designed. And yes then NOT F2 but a full season of F1 with the WCC and WDC, just more separate and 'pure' than normal. Modelled on W Series with as you say drivers swapping engineers and mechanics and everything. Team WCC || Driver WDC.

And on a full proper race circuit that's real test of a car. Some wet races guaranteed! It'd be awesome. too much to hope for probably but if only they'd put me in charge this is what we'd have :mrgreen:

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strad
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-SOtWSGOB4
I can't find the better ones I have watched before.
It entails sitting on a plastic bag full of foam that sets up to be made into a mold. They have to sit for a while without moving around till it sets up. It is a lengthy process.
To achieve anything, you must be prepared to dabble on the boundary of disaster.”
Sir Stirling Moss

kimetic
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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strad wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 9:11 pm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-SOtWSGOB4
I can't find the better ones I have watched before.
It entails sitting on a plastic bag full of foam that sets up to be made into a mold. They have to sit for a while without moving around till it sets up. It is a lengthy process.
They'll be able to use the existing seat mould for the driver, just modifying it if necessary to mount into the new car. And probably several cars share the same mounting template.

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strad
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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probably several cars share the same mounting template.
I seriously doubt that. They bolt thru the rear bulkhead which has the fuel tank amongst other things behind it.
There are not many things where other than where specified by the rules they share the exact same bolt patterns/template.
To achieve anything, you must be prepared to dabble on the boundary of disaster.”
Sir Stirling Moss

kimetic
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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strad wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 11:41 pm
probably several cars share the same mounting template.
I seriously doubt that. They bolt thru the rear bulkhead which has the fuel tank amongst other things behind it.
There are not many things where other than where specified by the rules they share the exact same bolt patterns/template.
It's 2 bolts maximum, that have to be accessible, among shared whole drivetrains and all non-aero parts. The seat is not going to prevent them swapping cars.

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strad
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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You're right two vertical bolts hold it in for easy emergency removal, but the bucket that the seat sits in is custom made to fit the drivers custom seat. That part is not standardized.
Image
To achieve anything, you must be prepared to dabble on the boundary of disaster.”
Sir Stirling Moss

kimetic
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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strad wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 6:56 pm
You're right two vertical bolts hold it in for easy emergency removal, but the bucket that the seat sits in is custom made to fit the drivers custom seat. That part is not standardized.
http://v4.sportnetwork.net/mainadmin/im ... 187671.jpg
It's a sophisticated process indeed, but as a minimum each team has a seat shell mounting template that fits three different occupants into one design of car. It's quite likely their junior teams use the same mounting template, and every driver already has a mould for their body shape. And it only takes a few hours even from scratch: https://motorsport.tech/formula-1/f1-seat-fitting. So it's not going to be a showstopper.

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strad
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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each team has a seat shell mounting template that fits three different occupants
@Kim what you say is likely true within the team but not team to team.
To achieve anything, you must be prepared to dabble on the boundary of disaster.”
Sir Stirling Moss

kimetic
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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strad wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:47 pm
each team has a seat shell mounting template that fits three different occupants
@Kim what you say is likely true within the team but not team to team.
Yes quite so, unless junior teams use the same one as the senior team, but what I am envisaging is that the drawing from which they machine the mould, for layering up the carbon fibre, can be made up from the team's mounting template plus the driver's existing body scan, from his 'home' team. Or the foam layer if they use one. Though by the sound of it the body mould and scanning is so quick it might not be worth the bother. But they have to fit three drivers at least, so it's likely that one way or another they have an easy way of adding a new driver to their car's seat.

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strad
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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Making the foam mold is fairly time consuming the there is time spent cutting and milling that foam then time to make the seat using the mold. It's not a quick slam bam process.
There is the bucket and then the seat itself.
To achieve anything, you must be prepared to dabble on the boundary of disaster.”
Sir Stirling Moss

kimetic
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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strad wrote:
Mon Apr 06, 2020 2:25 am
Making the foam mold is fairly time consuming the there is time spent cutting and milling that foam then time to make the seat using the mold. It's not a quick slam bam process.
There is the bucket and then the seat itself.
It takes a few hours, as stated in the authoritative link I posted. They scan it.

NathanE
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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Wouldn't it be great if, instead of racing the teams went through the technical detail of one of their older cars at a "component" level. It would obviously need to be old enough to not be giving up any super confidential data but maybe 5 years old would be a long enough gap. A series of documentaries, either team by team, or aspect by aspect (aero, structure, engine, gearbox etc.) would easily create 10 to 20 2-3 hour episodes. You could even include things like FOM/F1 stuff like scrutineering, logistics. We get occasional glimpses, but a deep factual behind the scenes would be super interesting.

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izzy
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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NathanE wrote:
Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:27 am
Wouldn't it be great if, instead of racing the teams went through the technical detail of one of their older cars at a "component" level. It would obviously need to be old enough to not be giving up any super confidential data but maybe 5 years old would be a long enough gap. A series of documentaries, either team by team, or aspect by aspect (aero, structure, engine, gearbox etc.) would easily create 10 to 20 2-3 hour episodes. You could even include things like FOM/F1 stuff like scrutineering, logistics. We get occasional glimpses, but a deep factual behind the scenes would be super interesting.
It would be great wouldn't it, they're so paranoid secretive we only get hints and snippets normally, though that does give a kind of mystique to the whole thing

I wonder if they could do it with a race, and interleave the racing with the 'component level' explanation of how they were faster or slower

Just_a_fan
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Re: So what will F1 teams do this year?

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NathanE wrote:
Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:27 am
Wouldn't it be great if, instead of racing the teams went through the technical detail of one of their older cars at a "component" level. It would obviously need to be old enough to not be giving up any super confidential data but maybe 5 years old would be a long enough gap. A series of documentaries, either team by team, or aspect by aspect (aero, structure, engine, gearbox etc.) would easily create 10 to 20 2-3 hour episodes. You could even include things like FOM/F1 stuff like scrutineering, logistics. We get occasional glimpses, but a deep factual behind the scenes would be super interesting.
That would be good for nerds like us. For most of the "yay, the driver closest to my nationality is here in front of me <scream>" type "fans", there wouldn't be any interest. And Liberty aren't going to spend a lot of time/money making a marginal-interest documentary, sadly.
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