Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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Big Tea
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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raymondu999 wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 3:19 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:04 pm
He goes to AM with Vettel on a one year (at a time) contract and Merc lets some of his crew go with them.
Is that even possible? i mean — Lance Lawrence thing.
The previous quote was a misquote, 'Not me Guv'. (Not that matters but twas El Scorchio)

Stroll? That's why I suggested Stroll to Merc.? I don't think they would disagree with that swap.
AM gets (another ) bunk up, Hamilton gets another Merc powered car, Merc gets more wins on the list
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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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Now Hamilton has 7 XWDC they MUST pay him more because of that fact. And Hamilton needs his 8th. He drives they provide the car. They must pay him more and he must drive better and promote the brand better. No free meals for either if them.
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the EDGE
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 7:34 pm
Now Hamilton has 7 XWDC they MUST pay him more because of that fact. And Hamilton needs his 8th. He drives they provide the car. They must pay him more and he must drive better and promote the brand better. No free meals for either if them.
I suspect if money was the hold-up it would have been resolved one way or the other by now

The only indications of the hold-up we have had so far is Hamilton wants less sponsor & factory commitment and Mercedes want a longer term deal

Both seem logical so I have no reason to doubt this

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NathanOlder
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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V12-POWER wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 3:20 pm
NathanOlder wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:47 pm
Zynerji wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 12:51 pm
Lewis needs Merc to win his 8th FAR MORE than Merc need Lewis just to win another Championship.
No single person in the Mercedes team, or any team, is as important as the team itself. Whats your point ?
as an example,

Schumacher needed Ferrari more than they needed him,
Senna needed Mclaren more than they needed him,
Lauda needed Ferrari more than they needed him,
and so on....

Why do people keep talking about it ?
cause Lewis can’t go to any other team and continue dominating, whereas almost half the grid can jump in the Merc and dominate, specially with BOTTAS in the team

I don’t get why you even said that in the first place, it’s like you agree with the point made but somehow want to avoid talking about it
My point is, all the top drivers couldn't go to another team and dominate. as an example, Schumacher, theres no way he would have won the 5 in a row without Ferrari. Their facilities, their own test track, their unlimited budget, their top staff ect.
So all I'm saying is, none of the people who dominated could have done so without the very teams they were with. So why do people keep saying about Lewis needing Merc more, when its obvious the dominant drivers need their team more, but that dominating team wouldn't have necessarily dominated without the actual driver they had.
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nevill3
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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So Lewis doesn't sign for Mercedes but opts to go to Maclaren instead in a straight swap for Lando.
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Big Tea
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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I am putting this in the silly season instead any of the team threads because there is probably a definite answer that is obvious.

I was wondering how the cost cap covers bought in parts? What brought it to mind now was Williams swapping over to the Mercedes box after so long.

Say after next season with Williams using the gearbox supplied by Merc, they were happy with it, could they (Merc) give or sell the ownership to Williams so Williams continue development of it while still selling it to Merc and AM ?

Its not just the cost of the present box, but if Williams employed some key people layed off by Merc, the box they develop will be 'very similar' the one Merc would have developed, but will now buy from Williams without the development cost being in their spending cap, but in Williams who can afford it while getting some needed funds.

Equally with RBR and AT or Haas and Ferrari, and any other allowed component.
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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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nevill3 wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 9:12 pm
So Lewis doesn't sign for Mercedes but opts to go to Maclaren instead in a straight swap for Lando.
Daniel would want that Merc seat and McLaren want to keep Lando so unlikely. Lando is porridge anyway.
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the EDGE
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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Big Tea wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 9:53 pm
I am putting this in the silly season instead any of the team threads because there is probably a definite answer that is obvious.

I was wondering how the cost cap covers bought in parts? What brought it to mind now was Williams swapping over to the Mercedes box after so long.

Say after next season with Williams using the gearbox supplied by Merc, they were happy with it, could they (Merc) give or sell the ownership to Williams so Williams continue development of it while still selling it to Merc and AM ?

Its not just the cost of the present box, but if Williams employed some key people layed off by Merc, the box they develop will be 'very similar' the one Merc would have developed, but will now buy from Williams without the development cost being in their spending cap, but in Williams who can afford it while getting some needed funds.

Equally with RBR and AT or Haas and Ferrari, and any other allowed component.
That’s a very good question, I don't believe there is any set or minimum price a team may charge, however they are unlikel to give it away for free and hand their competitor an advantage. Stroll has already talked about his desire to win WCC... obviously at the expense of Merc

I think however the level of collusion you suggest would be stretch of the rules, would be clearly evident and stamped out pretty quickly

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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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NathanOlder wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:47 pm
Zynerji wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 12:51 pm
Lewis needs Merc to win his 8th FAR MORE than Merc need Lewis just to win another Championship.
No single person in the Mercedes team, or any team, is as important as the team itself. Whats your point ?
as an example,

Schumacher needed Ferrari more than they needed him,
Senna needed Mclaren more than they needed him,
Lauda needed Ferrari more than they needed him,
and so on....

Why do people keep talking about it ?
Because a 50M/yr demand is disgusting when you can plug in your Junior driver for 10M/yr and win the same amount of championships.

Just wait to see the forum melt down if Merc say NO, and sign Russell instead, as it will be "racism" or "Big Company is Evil" instead of the cold, hard fact that Russell proved that he can beat Bottas as well, and at a huge discount.

Right now, Lewis takes whatever Merc offer, and ride into the All-Time history book, or he sits out a year and has to start over somewhere else to win another and set that record.

At least Lewis would be able to devote his full attention to activism for 2021 as he sits out for 0M. He's shown us all year that it matters enough to him to drag the entire sport into kneeling. Maybe he can do all that on Sky instead.
Last edited by Zynerji on Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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NathanOlder
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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Zynerji wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:08 pm
NathanOlder wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:47 pm
Zynerji wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 12:51 pm
Lewis needs Merc to win his 8th FAR MORE than Merc need Lewis just to win another Championship.
No single person in the Mercedes team, or any team, is as important as the team itself. Whats your point ?
as an example,

Schumacher needed Ferrari more than they needed him,
Senna needed Mclaren more than they needed him,
Lauda needed Ferrari more than they needed him,
and so on....

Why do people keep talking about it ?
Because a 50M/yr demand is disgusting when you can plug in your Junior driver for 10M/yr and win the same amount of championships.

Just wait to see the forum melt down if Merc say NO, and sign Russell instead, as it will be "racism" or "Big Company is Evil" instead of the cold, hard fact that Russell proved that he can beat Bottas as well, and at a huge discount.

Right now, Lewis takes whatever Merc offer, and ride into the All-Time history book, or he sits out a year and has to start over somewhere else to win another and set that record.

At least Lewis would be able to devote his full attention to activism for 2021 as he sits out for 0M.
No one is going to call racism, well not his fans anyway. The haters will want the fans to call racism, but they wont.
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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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Abiteboul... Was the "bowl" of the spoon that Renault "bit" off as they shockingly awoke from their slumber.
.. OG.. OG.. OG.. OG..
Online Stress Therapy. #77 is mediocre. W12 is the fastest car. Repeat x 1,000

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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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NathanOlder wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:14 pm
Zynerji wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:08 pm
NathanOlder wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:47 pm


No single person in the Mercedes team, or any team, is as important as the team itself. Whats your point ?
as an example,

Schumacher needed Ferrari more than they needed him,
Senna needed Mclaren more than they needed him,
Lauda needed Ferrari more than they needed him,
and so on....

Why do people keep talking about it ?
Because a 50M/yr demand is disgusting when you can plug in your Junior driver for 10M/yr and win the same amount of championships.

Just wait to see the forum melt down if Merc say NO, and sign Russell instead, as it will be "racism" or "Big Company is Evil" instead of the cold, hard fact that Russell proved that he can beat Bottas as well, and at a huge discount.

Right now, Lewis takes whatever Merc offer, and ride into the All-Time history book, or he sits out a year and has to start over somewhere else to win another and set that record.

At least Lewis would be able to devote his full attention to activism for 2021 as he sits out for 0M.
No one is going to call racism, well not his fans anyway. The haters will want the fans to call racism, but they wont.
I'd just call it good business to buy a cheaper driver that can still win in a dominant car, thus having more funds to make an even more dominant car.

I don't let my emotions get in the way of my mathematics.

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NathanOlder
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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Zynerji wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:19 pm
NathanOlder wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:14 pm
Zynerji wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:08 pm


Because a 50M/yr demand is disgusting when you can plug in your Junior driver for 10M/yr and win the same amount of championships.

Just wait to see the forum melt down if Merc say NO, and sign Russell instead, as it will be "racism" or "Big Company is Evil" instead of the cold, hard fact that Russell proved that he can beat Bottas as well, and at a huge discount.

Right now, Lewis takes whatever Merc offer, and ride into the All-Time history book, or he sits out a year and has to start over somewhere else to win another and set that record.

At least Lewis would be able to devote his full attention to activism for 2021 as he sits out for 0M.
No one is going to call racism, well not his fans anyway. The haters will want the fans to call racism, but they wont.
I'd just call it good business to buy a cheaper driver that can still win in a dominant car, thus having more funds to make an even more dominant car.

I don't let my emotions get in the way of my mathematics.
Well your letting your emotions get in the way of something, because you could still save money and have 2 drivers better than Bottas.

Bottas is on something like $10mill, Russell woukd sign for half of that.

So Russell and Hamilton is much better. And cheaper than they currently have.

:wink:
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King George has arrived.

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Phil
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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Zynerji wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:19 pm

I'd just call it good business to buy a cheaper driver that can still win in a dominant car, thus having more funds to make an even more dominant car.

I don't let my emotions get in the way of my mathematics.
It wouldnt be good business, because you are not looking at the business in its entirety. That being; selling cars, building image, exposure, marketability. For brands such as Mercedes, being part of F1 isnt just a sporting excercise. It’s a business.

Having that said, Russel seems to be a great prospect. But so far, he hasnt proven to be anything but probably as quick as Bottas on a ‘bad day’. Hamilton is quite a bit better than Bottas on most days and under pressure. That’s why they won 2017 & 2018. There’s nothing to suggest so far that Russel could have achieved the same for the team. It’s also rather doubtful he would have the same level of input and experience expected to drive the team forward.

The car might be good on its own, but there is no guarantee they’d be good enough as a package to win any championships.

Note; i am not suggesting Hamilton is worth 50 million a year. But he is a known quantity. In other words, a safe bet. Russel isnt.
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Re: Silly season 2021-2022-2023

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Zynerji wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:19 pm
NathanOlder wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:14 pm
Zynerji wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:08 pm


Because a 50M/yr demand is disgusting when you can plug in your Junior driver for 10M/yr and win the same amount of championships.

Just wait to see the forum melt down if Merc say NO, and sign Russell instead, as it will be "racism" or "Big Company is Evil" instead of the cold, hard fact that Russell proved that he can beat Bottas as well, and at a huge discount.

Right now, Lewis takes whatever Merc offer, and ride into the All-Time history book, or he sits out a year and has to start over somewhere else to win another and set that record.

At least Lewis would be able to devote his full attention to activism for 2021 as he sits out for 0M.
No one is going to call racism, well not his fans anyway. The haters will want the fans to call racism, but they wont.
I'd just call it good business to buy a cheaper driver that can still win in a dominant car, thus having more funds to make an even more dominant car.

I don't let my emotions get in the way of my mathematics.
And how about all those people Mercedes hires for millions that don’t even race their cars? Like Rihanna? Her background singer is almost just as good, could do the adds as well for just a fraction of the price...

Like I said in another forum as well, Daimler, PMI and brands like Nike know what their stars are worth in marketing value. Even after his retirement, whenever that is, Mercedes will still pay Hamilton millions for appearances, adds and talkshows etc. Heck, why is Mercedes in F1? Why not for a fraction of the costs just buy a few DW12’s and go round at Indy? Probably because their marketing team isn’t run by an accountant. Hamilton isn’t in the car for some ludicrous things you mentioned or the fear of reproduction, he’s there because he sells a lot more cars, petrol and polymers then he costs. Just like Vettel, Raikkonen, Schumacher and Senna before him. Maybe George Russell will become that, but at the moment just not yet.