Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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djos
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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hollus wrote:
Wed May 05, 2021 8:01 am
djos wrote:
Tue May 04, 2021 11:55 pm
10-12 Hour drives here in Australia are considered short.
In europe, 12 hour drives are considered international travel. ;-)
:lol:
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J.A.W.
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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djos wrote:
Tue May 04, 2021 11:55 pm
Just_a_fan wrote:
Tue May 04, 2021 4:21 pm
RZS10 wrote:
Tue May 04, 2021 4:07 pm
Such a trip is theoretically doable in one go with one driver, easily doable with two drivers in roughly 12h if you don't drive like a twat - it really shows how most of those cars aren't viable for long journeys yet.
Assuming one wants/needs to do the journey in one long 12 hour slog. Let's face it, most people don't.
10-12 Hour drives here in Australia are considered short. That's just an easy drive from Melbourne to Adelaide (~800kms), or Melbourne to Sydney (~900kms); we do both frequently to visit family.

Try driving from Melbourne to Perth (~3,500kms), that's ~38 hours if you drove non-stop, with multiple drivers! Slightly less is Melbourne to Brisbane (~1,800kms) at "only" 18 Hours if you drove non-stop, with multiple drivers.
Yeah, that Melbourne to Brisbane run (in <19 hours solo - stopping only for refuelling - car & me)
I've been 'forced' to do, fairly recently, (due to C-19 exigency) with Australia's ludicrous 100/110
Km/h (avidly enforced) max-speed limits ( but I was happy to 'shadow' local drivers, maybe 'bout
2/300 metres back, as they were regularly prepared to travel at ~130 Km/h on good 'back' roads).

My petrol M-B cruises effortlessly/economically/comfortably at such a pace*,
with a range such that only a few brief stops over that distance are actually required,
& were urgency-wise, dictated more by my own essential needs, than the Merc's...

*Its perfectly evident that a design which was intended to handle much higher speeds
in Euro-zone takes such 'piddling' pace well within its stride, if only really feeling 'active'
at higher speeds, while still ensconcing its occupants in confident comfort, 'Naturlisch!'.
We are standing on the toes of Hobbits. So wear safety boots.

Xwang
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Quoting SAE Automotive Engineering (march 2020 issue):
Dr. Cedric Rouaud, thermal systems project director for Ricardo U.K., said the industry presently is at about 100-kW peak charging rates and an average of 65 kW, but is looking to move to 300-350 kW.
I would say that when (and if) a 300 kW peak charging rate and an average 200 kW* will be available**, it should be possible to fully recharge a 80 kWh battery in 24 minutes.
According to this https://ev-database.org/cheatsheet/usea ... ectric-car such a car as a range of around 400 km (lets say 300 km in highway).
So even in such a scenario every 2.5 hours at 130 km/h you have to stop for about half an hour. which IMHO is what I do when I do long journeys.
This will work if you are certain that enough recharging stations are available so that you do not have to be in queue (with ICE engine it happens to be in queue when you go to fill your tank, but everyone takes not more than 5 minutes to fill the tank and pay).

* the average value is the same proportion of the maximum one as current technology
** provided newer batteries will not suffer from such high rate recharges
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Tommy Cookers
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Xwang wrote:
Wed May 05, 2021 11:21 am
if ... enough recharging stations are available so that you do not have to be in queue (with ICE engine it happens to be in queue when you go to fill your tank, but everyone takes not more than 5 minutes to fill the tank and pay).
well said !!

Just_a_fan
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Yes, queuing to recharge could be a problem, although it's only a financial (in other words political) problem as it's a simple engineering exercise given the funding.

But the reality is that the majority of people in highly urbanised countries don't do trips of several hundred miles/km in one go. The majority do short journeys that are easily "topped up" at home over night.

Take the UK, the average car journey is fewer than 10 miles. Yes, some people will do high numbers of miles for work. But the majority just don't do the mileage these days. Many trips can be done in EV-mode in a hybrid. A full EV with a range of 200+/- miles is more than enough to cover very many people's use for a whole week.

Yes, there are some that haul up and down motorways everyday, or drive across a continent to get a burger, but they are outliers in terms of the human population as a whole. Range anxiety is old hat now and mostly pushed out there by those that personally don't want an EV.
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Billzilla
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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djos wrote:
Tue May 04, 2021 11:55 pm

10-12 Hour drives here in Australia are considered short.
Not for all of us.

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djos
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Billzilla wrote:
Wed May 05, 2021 11:27 pm
djos wrote:
Tue May 04, 2021 11:55 pm

10-12 Hour drives here in Australia are considered short.
Not for all of us.
I meant in terms of cross country driving.
The impossible often has a kind of integrity which the merely improbable lacks.

Billzilla
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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So did I.

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djos
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Billzilla wrote:
Thu May 06, 2021 10:14 pm
So did I.
You don’t do much interstate driving then I guess?
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Greg Locock
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Maybe Billzilla needs an amphibious car!

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djos
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Greg Locock wrote:
Fri May 07, 2021 6:58 am
Maybe Billzilla needs an amphibious car!
:D is he Taswegian?
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J.A.W.
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Even driving across a multi-million inhabitant Australian metropolis, with their haphazard
& 1/2-arsed road networks makes a mockery of 'rush hour'*, perhaps a nice sightseeing trip
around Port Phillip bay, through Melbourne from Queenscliffe to Portsea? Range anxiety much?

That'd make Billzilla really want an amphibious vehicle, & a yacht would likely beat a car...

*Rush hours, plural, for a cross-town driving journey.
We are standing on the toes of Hobbits. So wear safety boots.

Billzilla
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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djos wrote:
Thu May 06, 2021 10:28 pm
You don’t do much interstate driving then I guess?
Not recently, but I have done plenty in the past. Including driving right around Australia.

J.A.W.
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Here's a link to a new 9 passenger/2 crew electric commuter aircraft:

https://www.eviation.co/aircraft/#Alice

Seemingly the pamphlet payload claim of 1134 kg max would indicate smallish people in a full cabin,
(not a bunch of big football players) &/or a modest luggage load. The battery accounts for ~60% MTOW.

Glossy advert, but oddly enough - no flying is shown - nor mention made of turn-around (recharge) times...
We are standing on the toes of Hobbits. So wear safety boots.

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humble sabot
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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So, 10-12hr drive people, do you really do that in one day?
Last time I did 12 hours in one day we stopped at the 2/3 mark and found a proper sit down restaurant for a full multi course meal, taking a two hour break before hitting the last 300km.
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