Ferrari F2012

[clipsy1H]

i;m not impressed by new updates. I'm not sure but this exhaust can't give more than 0.100 per lap.

let's hope Alonso can win another race this year with this ugly car.

[Nando]

Well the new exhaust system and sidepods won´t exactly hurt them now like before.

[Crucial_Xtreme]

For the grooves after the exhausts, it may seem like it curves the exhaust away but it doesn't. You can't look at it as if the car is not moving, you have to consider the flows coming off the side pod at racing speed. The exhaust shoots more parallel to the car centre line at racing speed - so the grooves are shaped to manage the exhausts at those speeds.

So yeah, you can see that the exhaust streams blow towards the midpoints of the control arms then to the beam wings at racing speed. The high pressure zones in front of the tyres would want to push the stream inwards more too, so that is another reason why the groove are shaped like that.

Thanks for confirming I was wrong mate.

But seriously thanks, I was just thinking out loud. Nothing learned, nothing gained.

@bhall have a link to that study?

[bhall]

That whole paragraph should be a link. If not...

http://www.aps.org/units/dfd/pressroom/ ... axerio.cfm

[aral]

i;m not impressed by new updates. I'm not sure but this exhaust can't give more than 0.100 per lap.

On what do you base that on? The Ferrari engineers seem to have a different opinion.

[hardingfv32]

With the way the exhaust plum is expanding after leaving the exhaust pipe, BOTH vertically and horizontally, you would be lucky to get it to flow completely inside the RW structure (below main and above beam). What percentage of the exhaust plum is going to actual hit those narrow brake duct wing-lets?

Could this all just be about interfacing the exhaust flow into the body flows? The body flow design controls the ultimate outcome. Or injecting the exhaust into the desired body flow stream.

Brian

[alogoc]

i think Ferrari will most likely test in BCN an enhanced version of this

http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/2287/f2012rtv.jpg

[Crucial_Xtreme]

i;m not impressed by new updates. I'm not sure but this exhaust can't give more than 0.100 per lap.

let's hope Alonso can win another race this year with this ugly car.

Hate you're not impressed. The team was pretty happy with the updates they brought. And it's not just about the exhaust. It's about the entire package, most of which we haven't even seen yet. New turning vanes up front, new exhaust, brake ducts & rear wing. We will see new sidepods, nose & possibly new diffuser in Spain. One thing isn't going to decrease lap times significantly(aside from exhaust/Anderson estimates a couple of tenths). But together as a package, they might work great together which is why the team is introducing them. They obviously show gains in simulation/WT.

Even 0.3-0.4s would help the team tremendously. We'll have to wait just a little longer to see how much we cut the gap. But as the team says, it's about a series of steps/upgrades.

For the record, what would have impressed you? A McLaren or Sauber type exhaust?

[Vanja #66]

For the record, what would have impressed you? A McLaren or Sauber type exhaust?

What's the difference right now?

Fry is smart, I'm pretty sure team wouldn't stubbornly hold on to their exhaust philosophy if some other proved to be better suited for F2012... I was buzzing all over the place waiting for Mugello, it didn't disappoint. Right now, I'm buzzing all over the place waiting for FP1 in Barcelona. Although I'm going to miss it due to math lectures.

[FrukostScones]

I think the latest exhaust spec is just an interim solution, maybe they can't integrate a good Sauber or McLaren-style exhaust into their package until they have completely redesigned/packaged the side pod/internals.
Maybe the now Mercedes-style exhaust is good enough for staying intouch with McL,RB, LR, and when they finally get rid of the pull-rod front suspension this car will win (again).

[markp]

History repeats. Ferrari turned exhausts aero neutral in late 90's. Lotus currently not doing much on exhausts. Exhusts maybe teams clinging to last years big idea? There may be much more to other areas and keeping exhausts simple helps this?

[Chuckjr]

History repeats. Ferrari turned exhausts aero neutral in late 90's. Lotus currently not doing much on exhausts. Exhusts maybe teams clinging to last years big idea? There may be much more to other areas and keeping exhausts simple helps this?

+1
I think lotus and Merc are onto something. Find it somewhere else. Remove the variable.

[hardingfv32]

and keeping exhausts simple helps this?

..... Remove the variable.

What indication or evidence is there the Lotus/Mercedes exhaust is simple OR creates less performance than the Suaber/McLaren layout?

What variable are they trying to remove?

Brian

[MIKEY_!]

Well the Mercedes/lotus exhausts don't pass over any aero devices so they are more simple. We can't know for sure whether one system is better than the other performance wise but we can assume that MaCa/sauber have found exhaust blowing beneficial.
The variable is the dramatic change in exhaust flow between on throttle and off throttle resulting in highly variable DF levels and a car that moves towards oversteer and understeer characteristics depending on throttle position.

[bhall]

I think teams would love such an "aero-neutral" exhaust configuration these days.

(They blew the rear wing with ease.)

It's easy to rush to judgment* when one sees Car A turning out quicker lap times than Car B as if the exhaust layout is the major factor for the differences in performance, but it just doesn't work that way. I've seen quotes from the teams that indicate about 25% of the benefits of pre-2012 EBDs can be recovered under the 2012 regulations. If we take the 2011 British Grand Prix as a very, very, very rough estimate, we can see that the 0.5 sec advantage enjoyed by Red Bull over Ferrari in qualifying was reduced to 0.1 sec when off-throttle exhaust was temporarily banned. That implies a rough value of 0.4 sec of which 0.1 sec can be recovered. Even by F1 standards, that's not a whole lot.

You also can't really look at other teams' solutions and expect to see a carbon-copy implemented elsewhere. In the case of McLaren's exhaust, it's unlikely Ferrari will adopt that solution for the very simple reason that Ferrari's engine has very different cooling requirements than the Mercedes. At the same time, however, that doesn't mean the two teams aren't pursuing the same exhaust philosophy. They just look different.



* I should know. No one, and I mean no one, rushes to judgment faster.