Ferrari F2012

[Hail22]

The rod highlighted as "Number 1" in the photo looks like a tension/suspension arm/link that was also used in the 2009 R29, I think its an "Alonso" idea that was born back in 2004?

I could be wrong but I swear I remember reading something a long those lines during the February winter tests.

[wesley123]

The rod highlighted as "Number 1" in the photo looks like a tension/suspension arm/link that was also used in the 2009 R29, I think its an "Alonso" idea that was born back in 2004?

I could be wrong but I swear I remember reading something a long those lines during the February winter tests.

Correct
http://www.formula1.com/news/technical/ ... 5/948.html

Following Fernando Alonso's advice, Ferrari have introduced to the F2012 a concept used by their driver's former team, Renault, as long ago as 2001. Designed to make the rear end of the car stiffer, an arm (red arrow) has been added connecting the gearbox and chassis. Note also the oil radiator mounted on top of the gearbox and cooled by the second small inlet in the engine cover (blue arrow).

[stefan_]

Here and here (pictures found on the forum) you can see more clear the type of rods that we find in this year's Ferrari on the Renault. How does this solution influences the behaviour of the whole back end of the car and what are the expected gains?

[wesley123]

These torsion bars just make for a more rigid rear end, which gives a more stiffer body overall, which alonso seems to like. Albeit it adds some weight to the car, and adds it a bit higher up, driveability is increased due to less flexing.

[Hail22]

We have identified object 1 in terms of the main chassis picture (torsion bar/link).

1,2 and 3 on the brake duct, now this could be far fetched but that inner flap could be a part that reacts to heat/air flowing in the brake drum.

Heavy heat load softens or moves the flap allowing more air to flow through the drum...whether its an advantage or not beats me (that's if its the intention of said flap/ducting slot).

[Richard]

I would dispute some of those points if I had any idea what any of that mess of words means.

I've tidied up the mess, it's gone.

[Lycoming]

These torsion bars just make for a more rigid rear end, which gives a more stiffer body overall, which alonso seems to like. Albeit it adds some weight to the car, and adds it a bit higher up, driveability is increased due to less flexing.

I'm just curious, how exactly would that increase driveability? Is it meant to increase torsional or bending stiffness? Either way, how does an inadequacy in either of these areas manifest into something that the driver can perceive, and lead him to say, "I want a stiffer chassis"?

I seriously doubt it was because there was noticeable chassis deflection in any mode during normal driving, those things are built to be very stiff.

[wesley123]

some drivers prefer a stiffer or more loose chassis, the torsion bars would add some stiffness, but I'd doubt it is a lot.

On the other hand it could also indicate a problem of the F2012, in that it was lacking stiffness, and the placement of these bars sure would reduce some of the stress on the engien, which is a fully stressed member.

[Lycoming]

well yea but that's my question: What does a stiffer chassis feel like? What do they feel thorough the seat, the pedals, the steering, whatever, that is "wrong", when the chassis lacks stiffness?

[shelly]

The rod connecting gearbx and chassis arorund the engine was brought by renault - if I am not mistaken (I find it strange that nobdy has cited it yet, maybe it's because I do not remember correctly) the year was 2001, and the reason was to compensate for the lack of torsional rigidity caused by the notorius 111°-v engine.
It was kept later; I did not remember it was still there in 2009 (was it?). I do not know if it is on the enstone car of 2012
Hence my question: since the engine block has stayed the same for ferrari since the engine freeze, why have the rods been adopted? There is not a "weak" engine block to compensate for.
I connect it more to the adoption of the pull rod at the rear. Did ferrari have those rods in 2011? Did other teams have them in 2012?

The idea put forward by Piola of an Alonso suggestion seems far fetched, but maybe he has solid insight information for that. We have seen already in the last month that Piola sometimes is right (for example spotting slots in the front wing of mercedes at the end of 2011) and sometimes is wrong (for example seeing not-existing slots on redbull's rear wing in 2012 winter testing).

[Gridlock]

well yea but that's my question: What does a stiffer chassis feel like? What do they feel thorough the seat, the pedals, the steering, whatever, that is "wrong", when the chassis lacks stiffness?

Have you ever driven a Corsa?

[AnthonyG]

well yea but that's my question: What does a stiffer chassis feel like? What do they feel thorough the seat, the pedals, the steering, whatever, that is "wrong", when the chassis lacks stiffness?

More control, the front and rear working together more solid.
Of course you also need to bring setup/suspention in the game, but general you can know it'll respond faster to an imput and give you beter direction change.

[Mr Nür]

well yea but that's my question: What does a stiffer chassis feel like? What do they feel thorough the seat, the pedals, the steering, whatever, that is "wrong", when the chassis lacks stiffness?

More control, the front and rear working together more solid.
Of course you also need to bring setup/suspention in the game, but general you can know it'll respond faster to an imput and give you beter direction change.

Totally agree with you.

[Henning]

Is it possible to un-stick the threads for last year's cars now? The pre-launch speculation threads now have more activity than these eight or so dead threads.

[Gridlock]

Happens at launch, thread goes official and starts again.