Red Bull RB8 Renault

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zyphro
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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N12ck wrote:From listening to the Redbull live at silverstone (national pit straight) and to the caterham they are deffinatley using some overrun, it sounds like last years car.
It's been there the entire time.

amc
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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Listened today at Brooklands - noise is definitely only when completely off-throttle so cannot be 'hot' exhaust gases. Ferrari making a growling noise off-throttle too, as highlighted by the video a while ago. Could it be caused by the resonator they have added - which would explain why Mclaren and other Renault engines don't sound so extreme?

Either that or they could use KERS harvest instead of engine braking and go into neutral when coasting, as there is a slight clunk when the throttle is re-opened. If a form of anti-stall was activated (since the car is running down in neutral) they can open the exhaust valves and light the fuel, like last year.

Having said that, it's probably illegal and I don't have a copy of the regs to hand. Sorry if that's the case.
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aral
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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amc wrote:

Having said that, it's probably illegal and I don't have a copy of the regs to hand. Sorry if that's the case.
Why? The cars have been passed as legal, so why would you say they are probably illegal?
Last edited by aral on Sun Jul 08, 2012 11:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

amc
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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Sorry - my idea of going into neutral etc. might be illegal. I'm sure the car is legal. So my idea might be wrong.
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Nando
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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Looks like the package is working great, no matter the conditions.
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adrianjordan
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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gilgen wrote:
amc wrote:

Having said that, it's probably illegal and I don't have a copy of the regs to hand. Sorry if that's the case.
Why? The cars have been passed as illegal, so why would you say they are probably illegal?
Unfortunate typo there...!!
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MadMatt
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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Kiril Varbanov wrote:Lovely detail of the exhaust and the rear (do I spot a more humpy surface?)

Image
What shocks me on this picture is the ride height. I know today's F1 cars are like SUV (thanks to the FIA) and that we have wet weather this weekend but still, it looks really silly. :cry:

Owen.C93
Owen.C93
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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I'm not sure they'd have it much lower given the choice.
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Pierce89
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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bhallg2k wrote:
n smikle wrote:[Image]

This is the give away picture. It shows that the purpose of the tunnel and guide vanes inside it is to help give an even distribution of air-flow through the second set of 4 inch tall guide vanes and finally a even flow over the top of the diffuser. I believe this is to give better pressure characteristics at the diffuser exit and possible better influence towards vortex formation at the sides. Very good Idea. But It must be said that if the ramp was not there, you wouldn't need that foremost set of guide vanes... the second set would have worked OK by itself.
Actually, I think the tunnel is still mostly about keeping the exhaust plume separate from the air flow around the sidepods. The guide vanes at the back aren't so much guide vanes as they are diffuser strakes that extract the air flow through the tunnel, because they initially had problems with it being choked by too much air.

In essence, they have a very legal and literal double diffuser: the normal one below the floor and the new one on top of the floor.
But why would you want a diffuser that draws from above the floor? It would decrease pressure above the floor and hurt DF overall.
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allstaruk08
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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back in 2010 when i designed my own double diffuser and fed part of the upper diffuser from on top of the floor i got ripped to pieces on here from people saying that it would actually slow the air flow from the lower diffuser and as a result it would create less downforce.

bhall
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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That's true. You'd disrupt a diffuser if you fed it lower-pressure flow from the top of the floor. This is not what's happening on the RB8.

Red Bull was reported to have problems with their side pod tunnels choking from too much air flow. To combat the problem, they had to modify the tunnels to move more air. Part of that solution was to split it into two tunnels, and the forward tunnel was given a larger mouth.

Flow from the aft tunnel is exited through the starter motor hole to energize flow over the steep central section of the diffuser to keep the flow attached. The forward tunnel is routed to the lower vent in the engine cover.

To this end, the lower rear control arm and the half-shaft have been shrouded in a carbon fiber fairing to eliminate the turbulence caused by the rotating half-shaft. They've also added strakes to the top of the floor over the diffuser. This all serves to maintain a free flow of air over the floor and, importantly, out of the engine cover vent that's fed from the forward tunnels. It's just like what a diffuser does for air flow under the floor.

Make sense?

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Pierce89
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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bhallg2k wrote:That's true. You'd disrupt a diffuser if you fed it lower-pressure flow from the top of the floor. This is not what's happening on the RB8.

Red Bull was reported to have problems with their side pod tunnels choking from too much air flow. To combat the problem, they had to modify the tunnels to move more air. Part of that solution was to split it into two tunnels, and the forward tunnel was given a larger mouth.

Flow from the aft tunnel is exited through the starter motor hole to energize flow over the steep central section of the diffuser to keep the flow attached. The forward tunnel is routed to the lower vent in the engine cover.

To this end, the lower rear control arm and the half-shaft have been shrouded in a carbon fiber fairing to eliminate the turbulence caused by the rotating half-shaft. They've also added strakes to the top of the floor over the diffuser. This all serves to maintain a free flow of air over the floor and, importantly, out of the engine cover vent that's fed from the forward tunnels. It's just like what a diffuser does for air flow under the floor.

Make sense?
It makes more sense now, but Steve machet ,from Speed, believes the flow is blowing through the small holes in the "structure" above the diffuser. He called it a "spray bar".
“To be able to actually make something is awfully nice”
Bruce McLaren on building his first McLaren racecars, 1970

“I've got to be careful what I say, but possibly to probably Juan would have had a bigger go”
Sir Frank Williams after the 2003 Canadian GP, where Ralf hesitated to pass brother M. Schumacher

bhall
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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Yeah, they're definitely venting something through those holes. I hadn't heard that explanation, though.

You can see that the rear wing end plates are bulged and connected to the "spray bar" with tubes. But, the "spray bar" holes aren't large enough in size or number to vent everything drawn into the tunnel.

Look at the last photo I posted here. It's possible they're venting some of that flow through the beam wing, too. (Maybe.)

Lotsa stuff going on here.

Matt Somers
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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bhallg2k wrote:OK. Thanks. I thought for a moment they might be blowing the beam wing. But it appears as though they're just taking advantage of the loophole that allows them to deem as part of the end plate that part of the wing. Ferrari did it last year with their rear wing.
The same exclusion zone that Mercedes have their DDRS channel in.
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Owen.C93
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Re: Red Bull RB8 Renault

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bhallg2k wrote:Yeah, they're definitely venting something through those holes. I hadn't heard that explanation, though.

You can see that the rear wing end plates are bulged and connected to the "spray bar" with tubes. But, the "spray bar" holes aren't large enough in size or number to vent everything drawn into the tunnel.

Look at the last photo I posted here. It's possible they're venting some of that flow through the beam wing, too. (Maybe.)

Lotsa stuff going on here.
What spray bar with tubes?

EDIT: Ok I think you're talking about holes in the gurney. I'm not convinced but lack proper high res imagery.
For:
Image
Against:
Image

(There is something underneath the gurney where the rear wing joins the diffuser, it looks like a hole but since images for the part will be damn near impossible to find then you can make up anything you want about that and it wont matter)
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