Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

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dans79
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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by dans79 » Fri Apr 12, 2019 5:13 pm

This entire think smacks of the press taking bits of pieces of what they heard in the paddock and just running with it.

If their was a technical directive as some has claimed, surely someone in the press should have been able to get their hands on a copy.

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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by turbof1 » Fri Apr 12, 2019 5:35 pm

dans79 wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 5:13 pm
This entire think smacks of the press taking bits of pieces of what they heard in the paddock and just running with it.

If their was a technical directive as some has claimed, surely someone in the press should have been able to get their hands on a copy.
Well, something got dissaproved. We just don't really know what.

These are the moments we are going to miss Charlie Whiting. He atleast was good with communicating to the public.
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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by Polite » Fri Apr 12, 2019 5:53 pm

The rule 3.5.5
The 5% divergence between the Virtual and the real endplate is related to the vertical view: after u design the endplate as virtual then u can diverge of 5% to curve the endplate ( like ferrari s endplate which is not linear from the vertical view).

Hope im writing it understandable

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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by dans79 » Fri Apr 12, 2019 5:56 pm

turbof1 wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 5:35 pm
Well, something got dissaproved. We just don't really know what.
Yea, the FIA has never been very good about transparency!

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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by Polite » Fri Apr 12, 2019 6:03 pm

:lol: quote for sure

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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by turbof1 » Fri Apr 12, 2019 6:09 pm

Polite wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 5:53 pm
The rule 3.5.5
The 5% divergence between the Virtual and the real endplate is related to the vertical view: after u design the endplate as virtual then u can diverge of 5% to curve the endplate ( like ferrari s endplate which is not linear from the vertical view).

Hope im writing it understandable
Completely understandable as far as I am concerned. I think the confusion comes from how or where Mercedes is breaking that stipulation or even finding itself in a grey area. There is no limitation on where you can deviate 5% from the VES.

There is one implied further regulation, in that the actually endplate can only be 10mm and 5mm away from each side of the VES.

What possibly might break the regulations, is that the VES is only allowed to have one single, continuous curve in it. Again, I don't know what the actual reason is why Mercedes had to change, but that is potentially a grey area.
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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by dans79 » Fri Apr 12, 2019 6:33 pm

turbof1 wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 6:09 pm
What possibly might break the regulations, is that the VES is only allowed to have one single, continuous curve in it.
I saw that this morning, and thought that was really poorly worded. I was thinking do them mean just arc segment, or any curve (bezeir for example.)

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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by Just_a_fan » Fri Apr 12, 2019 6:59 pm

Polite wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 5:53 pm
The rule 3.5.5
The 5% divergence between the Virtual and the real endplate is related to the vertical view: after u design the endplate as virtual then u can diverge of 5% to curve the endplate ( like ferrari s endplate which is not linear from the vertical view).

Hope im writing it understandable
What you write is understandable but I think you're looking in the wrong direction. The 5% is in the lateral projection i.e. how much of the VEs the actual endplate must cover from the side view. That's what allows the teams, including Ferrari, to have notches, curved top edges etc.
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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by zibby43 » Fri Apr 12, 2019 10:19 pm

Just_a_fan wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 4:43 pm
That's what the article says, not what the regs say. The regs make no mention of the visibility of the flaps from the side (laterally), only from above/below. The 95% area bit is the only bit I can see might be relevant, but if the endplate meets that and other requirements, why is it illegal?

I think someone has got the wrong end of the stick with this story.

Indeed, this story points to the other end of the endplate:
https://www.racefans.net/2019/04/12/why ... g-designs/
Exactly.

Has nothing to do with the portion of the end plate with the new cutout, nearest the flap section.

It's the "leading" edge of the end plate that needed to be re-contoured.

From the article you linked:

"At the FIA’s request both teams changed the front edges of their endplates to prevent puncturing other cars’ tyres. (RaceFans understands reports that the dispute centred on the teams’ front wing endplate cut-out designs are wide of the mark.)"

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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by turbof1 » Fri Apr 12, 2019 10:55 pm

zibby43 wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 10:19 pm
Just_a_fan wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 4:43 pm
That's what the article says, not what the regs say. The regs make no mention of the visibility of the flaps from the side (laterally), only from above/below. The 95% area bit is the only bit I can see might be relevant, but if the endplate meets that and other requirements, why is it illegal?

I think someone has got the wrong end of the stick with this story.

Indeed, this story points to the other end of the endplate:
https://www.racefans.net/2019/04/12/why ... g-designs/
Exactly.

Has nothing to do with the portion of the end plate with the new cutout, nearest the flap section.

It's the "leading" edge of the end plate that needed to be re-contoured.

From the article you linked:

"At the FIA’s request both teams changed the front edges of their endplates to prevent puncturing other cars’ tyres. (RaceFans understands reports that the dispute centred on the teams’ front wing endplate cut-out designs are wide of the mark.)"
Hmm...

The rules on the leading edge are quite clear. 10-20mm thick for the first 50mm, 10-12mm behind that.

Maybe they did something like reverse the 5mm taper radius on the front edge extremities:
Image

Or the laminate "prescribed in the appendix of the technical regulations" (but not added to the public version of the rulebook) did not comply.

Thing is, teams cannot just ignore what is in the rulebook. Anything that made the FIA feel to make Mercedes and Red Bull reverse, must mean there is a regulation completely taken out of context. Just having a wrong laminate looks for me "too black and white".
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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by Morteza » Sat Apr 13, 2019 2:12 am

Mercedes flap modification (Via @AlbertFabrega)
So basically trimmed the flap and attached it to the endplate by the looks of it
Image

Image
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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by atanatizante » Sat Apr 13, 2019 4:42 am

Morteza wrote:
Sat Apr 13, 2019 2:12 am
Mercedes flap modification (Via @AlbertFabrega)
So basically trimmed the flap and attached it to the endplate by the looks of it
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D3_sF50U0AAQiae.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D3_vbAYU8AA_0pp.jpg
Is it me or there are differences between the first and 4th picture (Saturday spec) regarding upper flap dimensions in the area merging to the cut-out endplate?
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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by Morteza » Sat Apr 13, 2019 4:43 am

atanatizante wrote:
Sat Apr 13, 2019 4:42 am
Morteza wrote:
Sat Apr 13, 2019 2:12 am
Mercedes flap modification (Via @AlbertFabrega)
So basically trimmed the flap and attached it to the endplate by the looks of it
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D3_sF50U0AAQiae.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D3_vbAYU8AA_0pp.jpg
Is it me or there are differences between the first and 4th picture (Saturday spec) regarding upper flap dimensions in the area merging to the cut-out endplate?
They look different, yes. I don't know if it is the perspective or they had different solutions.
"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by tranquility2k4 » Sat Apr 13, 2019 7:24 am

Is it just me or is Merc running a smaller rear wing since mid way through fp3? I saw Bottas come back out on mediums and improve with a purple sector 3 and then he was again purple in sector 3 on the soft run at end of fp3. Also in q1 of fp3 he's again purple there. To me their wing looks visibly smaller than Ferrari who have maybe gone more the other way? I just wonder if they did make a change as late as midway through fp3. Also I don't know if Lewis still had larger wing in fp3, but has now converged (albeit missing practice on this set up) - can anyone confirm?

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Re: Mercedes-AMG F1 W10 EQ Power+

Post by MtthsMlw » Sat Apr 13, 2019 9:44 am

Crazy how tight they can run the engine cover
Image
via motorsport.com