Scuderia Ferrari SF90

A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter does not belong here.
izzy
16
User avatar
Joined: Sun May 26, 2019 9:28 pm

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by izzy » Fri May 31, 2019 5:57 pm

ENGINE TUNER wrote:
Fri May 31, 2019 5:37 pm
izzy wrote:
Fri May 31, 2019 10:33 am

Christian Horner said they're stiffer:
"We were very good on the tyres at the end of last year," Horner said. “Obviously there’s what something like 25 percent less rubber on these tyres, and they are stiffer.
https://f1i.com/news/341527-horner-very ... 2019.html
i've seen it somewhere else too. Pirelli said they'd changed the construction but not exactly what the effect was.

With the downforce, there was a lot of confusion. But they made the wings wider and also deeper, to offset the loss from cutting cascade wings and outwash, so they could change the shape of the wake to help following, supposedly, without making the cars slower. and maybe Pirelli were guessing what's actually happened, that teams have found ways of keeping a lot of their lovely outwash anyway, so the cars are faster if anything not slower and that's what we've seen isn't it
Horner is NOT a credible source, in fact he is a known to be a liar often, that is part of his job for RBR. Neither is he a technical person.

Downforce is lower across the grid except for Merc. That is what most of the numbers say to my understanding.
Do you have a source for your understanding? :) i mean Horner gets told things by Adrian doncha think and why would he make something up like this? he's 100% better source than no source at all

there was general confusion last year when Andy Green said RP were 1.5s down on their first go at the new car, it got quoted everywhere without the huge point that it was their first go and was obviously going to be developed massively. So in Spain this year pole was 15.4 when last year it was 16.1. And yes Mercedes have the most downforce, but obviously the tyres have to cope with that and there's the rest of the season still to come with 1s or even more of development

and there are the bigger wings, and the rear wing is lower to connect with the diffuser flow again

F1Krof
54
User avatar
Joined: Mon Feb 22, 2016 8:17 pm

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by F1Krof » Sat Jun 01, 2019 2:31 pm

izzy wrote:
Fri May 31, 2019 5:57 pm
ENGINE TUNER wrote:
Fri May 31, 2019 5:37 pm
izzy wrote:
Fri May 31, 2019 10:33 am

Christian Horner said they're stiffer:

https://f1i.com/news/341527-horner-very ... 2019.html
i've seen it somewhere else too. Pirelli said they'd changed the construction but not exactly what the effect was.

With the downforce, there was a lot of confusion. But they made the wings wider and also deeper, to offset the loss from cutting cascade wings and outwash, so they could change the shape of the wake to help following, supposedly, without making the cars slower. and maybe Pirelli were guessing what's actually happened, that teams have found ways of keeping a lot of their lovely outwash anyway, so the cars are faster if anything not slower and that's what we've seen isn't it
Horner is NOT a credible source, in fact he is a known to be a liar often, that is part of his job for RBR. Neither is he a technical person.

Downforce is lower across the grid except for Merc. That is what most of the numbers say to my understanding.
Do you have a source for your understanding? :) i mean Horner gets told things by Adrian doncha think and why would he make something up like this? he's 100% better source than no source at all

there was general confusion last year when Andy Green said RP were 1.5s down on their first go at the new car, it got quoted everywhere without the huge point that it was their first go and was obviously going to be developed massively. So in Spain this year pole was 15.4 when last year it was 16.1. And yes Mercedes have the most downforce, but obviously the tyres have to cope with that and there's the rest of the season still to come with 1s or even more of development

and there are the bigger wings, and the rear wing is lower to connect with the diffuser flow again
Actually the rear wing is higher this year.
Wroom wroom

izzy
16
User avatar
Joined: Sun May 26, 2019 9:28 pm

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by izzy » Sat Jun 01, 2019 5:34 pm

F1Krof wrote:
Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Actually the rear wing is higher this year.
Oh yes okay, 70mm, but still 100 wider 100 longer and 20 deeper, so they haven't lost downforce have they, it's more powerful if anything

zibby43
212
Joined: Sat Mar 04, 2017 11:16 am

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by zibby43 » Sat Jun 01, 2019 6:06 pm

New front wing for Ferrari at French GP + Merc's 1,020 horsepower Spec 2 PU upgrade to debut in Canada:

https://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/ferra ... h/4415276/

ENGINE TUNER
4
Joined: Tue Nov 29, 2016 5:07 pm

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by ENGINE TUNER » Sat Jun 01, 2019 10:54 pm

izzy wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 5:34 pm
F1Krof wrote:
Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Actually the rear wing is higher this year.
Oh yes okay, 70mm, but still 100 wider 100 longer and 20 deeper, so they haven't lost downforce have they, it's more powerful if anything
The rear wing is only as powerful as they want it to be regardless of the size/regs
They don't run the same rear wing in Monaco and Monza even though the rules are the same. Downforce levels are mostly down across the grid.

Regardless of what Newey tells Horner, Horner will say whatever he needs to the media for the best interest of his team, and it is usually a lie.

izzy
16
User avatar
Joined: Sun May 26, 2019 9:28 pm

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by izzy » Sat Jun 01, 2019 11:21 pm

ENGINE TUNER wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 10:54 pm
izzy wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 5:34 pm
F1Krof wrote:
Thu Jan 01, 1970 1:00 am
Actually the rear wing is higher this year.
Oh yes okay, 70mm, but still 100 wider 100 longer and 20 deeper, so they haven't lost downforce have they, it's more powerful if anything
The rear wing is only as powerful as they want it to be regardless of the size/regs
They don't run the same rear wing in Monaco and Monza even though the rules are the same. Downforce levels are mostly down across the grid.

Regardless of what Newey tells Horner, Horner will say whatever he needs to the media for the best interest of his team, and it is usually a lie.
I still don't see any sources or data for downforce levels being down

ENGINE TUNER
4
Joined: Tue Nov 29, 2016 5:07 pm

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by ENGINE TUNER » Sat Jun 01, 2019 11:39 pm

izzy wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 11:21 pm
I still don't see any sources or data for downforce levels being down
Lap times speak for themselves

izzy
16
User avatar
Joined: Sun May 26, 2019 9:28 pm

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by izzy » Sun Jun 02, 2019 7:57 am

ENGINE TUNER wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 11:39 pm
izzy wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 11:21 pm
I still don't see any sources or data for downforce levels being down
Lap times speak for themselves
This is why I quoted a laptime, didn't you like it? :). I did pick the most downforce sensitive circuit so far

vogonvader
1
Joined: Sun Apr 21, 2019 4:18 pm

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by vogonvader » Sun Jun 02, 2019 10:15 am

You guys should check out that Perrinn 2019 F1 car work done by @Vyssion and @jjn9128 which is one of the most amazing things I've seen in this forum.

They've not yet developed it as much as they want I guess but iirc even in the first specs of the 2019 car they designed, they found out that the df levels were at the very least around the same levels as last year if not higher and that wasn't even a well developed polished car like the teams use, it was fairly underdeveloped for a 2019 car.

izzy
16
User avatar
Joined: Sun May 26, 2019 9:28 pm

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by izzy » Sun Jun 02, 2019 11:30 am

vogonvader wrote:
Sun Jun 02, 2019 10:15 am
You guys should check out that Perrinn 2019 F1 car work done by @Vyssion and @jjn9128 which is one of the most amazing things I've seen in this forum.

They've not yet developed it as much as they want I guess but iirc even in the first specs of the 2019 car they designed, they found out that the df levels were at the very least around the same levels as last year if not higher and that wasn't even a well developed polished car like the teams use, it was fairly underdeveloped for a 2019 car.
Wow that is extremely awesome isn't it, thanks :)
And yes so it gained with the wings and lost with the front tyre wake getting under the floor, and ever since teams have been working away on the bargeboards, cascade wings and brake ducts/wheels to fix that wake

dans79
195
Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2013 6:33 pm
Location: USA

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by dans79 » Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:42 pm

Some New Binotto quotes. Without directly saying it, he sure hints at not having enough down-force to keep the tires in the optimum operating window.

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/14386 ... rent-tyres
"The tyres of this season are quite different in this respect. Warm-up is a lot more difficult and in order to achieve what we may call the window, the temperature target of when you have the best grip from the tyres itself, you need to heat up the tyres."
"You can achieve [heat in the tyres] through braking temperatures and cooling the rims, but also it is downforce no doubt," said Binotto.

"The downforce has an absolute value, but it is also how you may balance the downforce at high speed to low speed.

"It may be as well how you may even target your aero development efficiency versus maximum downforce itself.

"I think we have a car that is quite efficient, as you can see on the straights, but it doesn't mean we have the car that has the highest downforce in the pitlane.

"It is right to question ourselves if we should look for different overall targets of how to achieve the final performance."

LM10
47
Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2018 11:07 pm

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by LM10 » Tue Jun 04, 2019 4:22 pm

No new quotes. He already told that weeks ago.

CriXus
94
Joined: Sat Feb 01, 2014 6:09 pm

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by CriXus » Wed Jun 05, 2019 8:55 am

Gazzetta reports the following developments for the European races:
  • France - new front wing (new profile and new flaps, but still the same concept)
  • Austria - new floor
  • Great Britain - new diffuser
  • Germany - new bargeboards
"Without music, life would be an error!!!" - Friedrich Nietzsche

falonso81
2
Joined: Wed Sep 04, 2013 2:29 pm

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by falonso81 » Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:54 pm

CriXus wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2019 8:55 am
Gazzetta reports the following developments for the European races:
  • France - new front wing (new profile and new flaps, but still the same concept)
  • Austria - new floor
  • Great Britain - new diffuser
  • Germany - new bargeboards
Let's hope all these pieces go onto the car without any issues.

dans79
195
Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2013 6:33 pm
Location: USA

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF90

Post by dans79 » Wed Jun 05, 2019 10:55 pm

Scarabs latest take on the SF90 issue!